Help needed

[mommymachine]

Ok. So I saw my OBGYN today to talk to her about my two miscarriages. She said that in SOME women, breastfeeding can cause miscarriages because of the low progesterone. She advises to stop nursing DD and then wait 3 months to TTC. She also said to call her immediately when I get a BFP and she will get me on a progesterone. DD is almost 14 months, but why do I still feel bad weaning her? Am I being selfish about weaning her to have another baby?? Honestly am I?

[Wanting-a-girl]

No that's not selfish... Lots of mommies ween at 12 months

[Princess of Pink]

I would feel bad doing it too! But for the health of your future baby maybe it's necessary?

[Butterfly Spirit]

You should be fine hopping right on progesterone. I nursed DS#2 until my milk dried up halfway through my pregnancy with my DD. You shouldn't have to stop.. several women out there are pregnant and breastfeed!

[The Anchor]

Ok. So I saw my OBGYN today to talk to her about my two miscarriages. She said that in SOME women, breastfeeding can cause miscarriages because of the low progesterone. She advises to stop nursing DD and then wait 3 months to TTC. She also said to call her immediately when I get a BFP and she will get me on a progesterone. DD is almost 14 months, but why do I still feel bad weaning her? Am I being selfish about weaning her to have another baby?? Honestly am I?

Honestly, I've never heard of m/c because of b/f'ing. Not that I'm a doctor or anything. I never actually "weaned" either of my bubs, I just kind of let them take charge. My DD lost interest at 18 months and my DS went to 16 months. I don't think you're being selfish, but do consider your DD - does she seem prepared to let go? It can be traumatizing...

[Winngrin]

I weaned my son at 8 months because I hadn't had the return of my periods yet and we wanted these last 2 close in age. It worked quickly but I STILL feel very guilty. Obviously your dd is much older but older can equal wiser! Have you thought about cutting back to just 1-2 nursings a day?

[mommymachine]

Yes I for sure going to cut it back to nap time and bed and see how she does. If she is having too hard a time then ill know its just to soon. Sometimes TTC can be so complicated.

[fish2012]

OMG no my ds weaned at 11 months i felt like the worst mother in the world as health vistor (stupid jumped up baby weighers we have in uk) said it was cause i was preggie

well ds2 weaned at 11 months was i preggie ah no, doll if you've made a year you've done an amazing job and your daughter has got pretty much all the health benfit from it she's gonna xx

[Shenanigans]

I just had to wean my almost 14 month old a week and a half ago to TTC. I would have kept breastfeeding but have to take DIM and shouldn't breastfeed while on it. It is much harder on me than on him, though. I really wanted to make it to 2 years to get the full benefit but oh well. You have definitely done great and gone longer than most! :)

[harleyquinn]

You know what?....thats HER opinion. Has she checked your progesterone or measured your cycle by bloodwork? I don't buy it.

I personally wouldn't do it. Your DD will naturally get older and nurse less (maybe at night??? or early mornings could be dropped) but we are really made to nurse and be pregnant. Thats MY opinion. (not an MD ;) ) I understand the need to be pregnant immediately but idk...I put the existing kids first unless there is an urgent pressing need to ttc asap.

[harleyquinn]

And I really wonder if these doctors pass out progesterone too quickly. I read a TON about it because I get nervous taking anything and my dose is super high. If you progesterone is already high without the suppositories, you are exposing baby to a vvery unnaturally high level of hormones (can't be good, I don't care what doctors say..the studies are out there). So how can they recommend this, when they aren't really monitoring people's progesterone??? (rant over)

[Butterfly Spirit]

You know what mommymachine, you could pm Atomic.
I was terrified after my loss about BFing during my pregnancy with my little one.. but she calmed me down. She will tell you that women have done it.. since the beginning of time, it's what we are built for. Like I said, I BF until my milk dried up mid pregnancy.. DS#2 still nursed for comfort.. until Dec and then I used the distraction method.. back massage instead of a nurse! LOL it worked!

[Butterfly Spirit]

And I really wonder if these doctors pass out progesterone too quickly. I read a TON about it because I get nervous taking anything and my dose is super high. If you progesterone is already high without the suppositories, you are exposing baby to a vvery unnaturally high level of hormones (can't be good, I don't care what doctors say..the studies are out there). So how can they recommend this, when they aren't really monitoring people's progesterone??? (rant over)

What dose are you on hon?

[atomic sagebrush]

Wow glad I spotted this.

First of all, bf "causing" miscarriage is totally unproven to begin with and even if it is true, it's exceedingly rare. Secondly, the older your baby is, the less likely it is that the BF will be affecting your cycles in that way. And thirdly, if your cycle was THAT badly off due to BF, you would be noticing a lot of other weird things like superlong cycles, anov cycles, spotting, super short LP, etc etc etc.

Most people can get pg just fine while BF. I would never wean an existing child to TTC a new baby because the fact is, if your body is not ready to TTC, sometimes not even weaning will help. The odds are sky high that in three months' time, even if the unlikely event that BF had anything to do with your losses which 99.99% odds it did not, your cycle will be a-ok at that point even with breastfeeding.

I have BF longer than most doctors went to medical school, conceived twice while BF and tandem nursed 3 of my 5 in succession, so you can trust me on this! ;)

[atomic sagebrush]

And I really wonder if these doctors pass out progesterone too quickly. I read a TON about it because I get nervous taking anything and my dose is super high. If you progesterone is already high without the suppositories, you are exposing baby to a vvery unnaturally high level of hormones (can't be good, I don't care what doctors say..the studies are out there). So how can they recommend this, when they aren't really monitoring people's progesterone??? (rant over)

:agree: And the studies also show prog support does not improve pregnancy outcome. So you're taking a risk for dubious benefit. Doctors prescribe it so they can be visibly seen to be doing something when in reality, the only thing that helps is time. In 3 months your baby will be feeding less, your body will be 3 months further past postpartum - it fixes itself, no need for prog support.

[mommymachine]

Thank you everyone. I did so much research and emailed LLL and came to the same conclusion and have chosen not to wean my daughter:) She was hear first and I had a goal to nurse her until 2 and I don't want to change that. DH and I will try again in May and if that pregnancy doesn't work (God forbid) then we will rethink things. Tandem nursing is actually an experience I'm open to and wouldn't mind having. Claire is 14 months old today an is now officially my longest nursing baby:) so Yay!!!

I had no idea there was controversial evidence about progesterone. So now what? Do I tell my OBGYN I don't want to go on it?

[atomic sagebrush]

Most of us overestimate the amount our doctors think about us - she probably won't even remember, and if she does, you can tell her that you decided not to TTC for awhile and had an oops. At that point, you do not need to disclose whether you're breastfeeding or not. She probably will not recall that you were, and even if she does she'll probably assume you stopped.

[iwonder]

I am in the same boat as you, OP. I do have a history of low progesterone and have supplemented with both of my pregnancies. But I am going to continue BFing as I can't bear to wean at 14 mos. My ODS self-weaned at 21 months and I think if this pregnancy is meant to be then it will be! Good luck!

[harleyquinn]

Butterfly....they put me on 800 mg vaginally BEFORE my progesterone was ever tested. I kept asking...I don't think my prog is low so can i please have it tested? I was repeatedly told that prog flucuates so much, that when they test it, its really just a snapshot of an entire movie. I was nervous to start it without any info of what was going on with my body and took that risk. (by not taking it)

Anyway, when I changed doctors, I got a blood test from her right away to test the prog and hcg. I had to wait 3 days for the results (thats the way it goes around here) and lo and behold was the HIGHER end of normal for an early pregnancy. I HAD started the progesterone out of fear AFTER the blood test so.....the Dr got the results and called me herself and said to STOP taking the progesterone.

LONG confusing story, but here I am with NO suppositories, and getting prog checked every 2 days which works waaayyyyy better for me.

mommymachine, so glad you came to decision you feel good about for both you and your daughter xx

[harleyquinn]

The pills are the least effective...doesn't get thru your stomach acid very well and may fleetingly raise serum levels but doesn't get where it needs to go...which I think is where any controversy comes in perhaps

Shots most effective with the suppositories being next, as they both go direct into blood******. It also causes side effects...you will be more tired than you ever imagined and lots of fun intestinal issues. There is NO WAY I would take this just for "peace of mind". I want to be shown a valid medical reason before I make a pregnancy way harder than it has to be.

[Butterfly Spirit]

The pills are the least effective...doesn't get thru your stomach acid very well and may fleetingly raise serum levels but doesn't get where it needs to go...which I think is where any controversy comes in perhaps

Shots most effective with the suppositories being next, as they both go direct into blood******. It also causes side effects...you will be more tired than you ever imagined and lots of fun intestinal issues. There is NO WAY I would take this just for "peace of mind". I want to be shown a valid medical reason before I make a pregnancy way harder than it has to be.

Let me tell you, I was TIRED about 20-25 mins after taking my pills. I know that they worked! ;)
I'd be more scared to take the suppositories because it would seem that it was all coming out. I chose the pills. I was so nauseous one time that I threw it up and my doc said I could take it vaginally too so I did that one time too.

[atomic sagebrush]

Excellent point Harley - aside from any potential risks for BF, there are the risks and side effects to you as well. :agree:

Here is one of the studies - and this is for IVF, where they would ostensibly need prog support because their hormones are being artificially manipulated. Does not help even in that situation. Natural pregnancies are even less likely to benefit from prog support (there are studies on this too but this is just the first one I found, there are a bunch of links to other similar studies int he footnotes). Progesterone supplementation during early gestations after IVF or ICSI has no effect on the delivery rates: a randomized controlled trial (http://humrep.oxfordjournals.org/content/17/2/357.full)

And just a quick rant - I simply do not understand the reticence of doctors to prescribe Clomid which DOES raise progesterone and extend luteal phase, while they're shoving off progesterone onto people left and right despite no evidence that it even helps at all. Have a look at the side effects Progesterone consumer information from Drugs.com (http://www.drugs.com/cons/progesterone.html)

[harleyquinn]

The other side effect falls under "social issues"...your vagina is so full of an Elmers glue-like substance there is NO WAY you could have sex in a million years ;)

I am just happy not to be on it anymore.

[Butterfly Spirit]

The other side effect falls under "social issues"...your vagina is so full of an Elmers glue-like substance there is NO WAY you could have sex in a million years ;)

I am just happy not to be on it anymore.

:rofl: at what you said there!!!!
I was soooo constipated too, the most I'd ever been in my life I had to take drastic measures to get cleaned out. Ahh pregnancy is so sexy and fun! LOL ;)

[mommymachine]

Boy this is stressful. Now I'm certain I want to try again without progesterone but if I lose that baby too I know ill blame myself because I didn't go on it.

[harleyquinn]

mommymachine....I felt the SAME way (hugs)

Go with your gut. I ended up taking it(because I didn't want to regret it) but insisted on the bloodwork to back it up and then didn't need it in the end. Really go with your gut on this. You can't listen to us to make your choices and you need your doctor to walk the talk. (more hugs)

[Violet_]

Mommymachine, perhaps get your OB/GYN to check your progesterone levels (they may be fine) and take it from there?

[mommymachine]

My doctor is going to check them, but she said its not going to be very accurate since we have no idea what my cycle is doing and progesterone fluctuates so much during a cycle. I actually got a whole bunch of blood work done today.

[Tree]

Boy this is stressful. Now I'm certain I want to try again without progesterone but if I lose that baby too I know ill blame myself because I didn't go on it.

I hope you don't mind me asking, but what kind of miscarriages did you have? Natural or missed? I only ask because if they were missed miscarriages then surely they wouldn't have been due to low progesterone or suppression of any other hormones due to breastfeeding. If breastfeeding has the effect of shorting luteal phase due to lack of progesterone then any lack of progesterone causing miscarriage would surely be very early and natural?

[mommymachine]

They were both natural. First one ultrasound confirmed that the baby stopped growing at 5 weeks 4 days and I started bleeding at 7 weeks 1 day. The second one I started bleeding at 5 weeks 4 days and never had an ultrasound but my numbers never got very high. Only around 138.

[Tree]

They were both natural. First one ultrasound confirmed that the baby stopped growing at 5 weeks 4 days and I started bleeding at 7 weeks 1 day. The second one I started bleeding at 5 weeks 4 days and never had an ultrasound but my numbers never got very high. Only around 138.

Now I'm no expect but this doesn't sound like a progesterone problem. Once you've ovulated your body starts producing progesterone in preparation to support a pregnancy, if pregnancy doesn't occur the progesterone drops and you start bleeding (so the drop in progesterone causes bleeding). If the baby passed before bleeding that would imply there was a chromosome or other problem. You're body then realising, dropped the progesterone so you could miscarry. There is debate as to whether progesterone dropping is the bodies way of ending a pregnancy that is not viable anyway... If you were miscarry ing and the first symptom were bleeding that would seem to me to indicate a progesterone problem or even chemical pregnancy due to lack of lining for proper implantation, but it sounds as though both pregnancies just weren't to be. As I said I'm no expert, just my analysis and thoughts! In any case I am deeply sorry for your losses and hope there are no more!!

[atomic sagebrush]

The reason the numbers stay low is because the baby itself is not providing the proper chemical feedback to sustain the pregnancy. If something is going wrong with its development then your body senses it and sort of conserves resources in favor of future pregnancies.

[mommymachine]

Thank you ladies. You have made me feel so much better. I feel so much less "broken" and so much more that there was just something wrong with the babies. I still have anxiety about trying about but, I'm takin my folic acid and surprisingly, this new "project" of mine, meaning the LE diet and swaying, is really helping keeping my mind busy.

[Funkyfry]

Your not bring selfish at all!! I think feeding her for 14 months has been brilliant and a great start for get! Well fine you. I hope you get your bfp soon