Australian going to Genesis

[luvpink]

Hi I'm from Australia and planning on going to Genesis in June for a girl. We have been deciding between Genesis and HRC but in the end decided with Genesis because they do sperm sorting. I hope we are making the right decision as they dont seem to have had a lot of success lately.

[Am3a]

Good luck! Would love to hear how it all goes!! 💗💗💗💗

I'd LOVE to do it... My husband is not on board. However we are doing tracking through a clinic - that's as close to GS as he would go.

All the best!!!

[glory]

Hey hun, what state are you from?

Although they do sperm sorting and they get a higher number of that sex, other clinics generally get the same amount of normals and roughly the same amount of the same sex normals.

Just being from Oz, if you are on the east coast HRC is probably an easier option and if you are on the west, SART would be an easier option too.

Have a look around in the members forum :)

[jen75]

Hi Ladies,
I am new to this forum and wish i had found you all before. After 2 unsucessful sways, i now have 3 boys and after 10 years we decided to go for high tec gender selection. We went to Dogus and as my parents live in the N of Cyprus i know that there is a lot of tension between the N and the S which i have found very biased in favor of the s as a generalisation. in all matters not just those concerning fertility. I have always found the people in the N to be lovely and we love it out there. however we have had a terrible experience with Dogus who lied to us and told us they had micro sort and we would get this for free with PGD for a girl. This is not true i have since found out that they are not registered or a provider of this. This would explain why we got 1 g and 1 b balstocist. they also do not tell you that with SET the chances are almost non existent and you are not included in the stats of sucess rates they use to advertise. The follow up has been terrible they will not even answer my questions and i had no idea what to expect. as of course age is not on my side now 37.5 i would consider tandem. i am also upset that they did not give me the option to freeze my 1 blast and try for more eggs. the lady Lyndsay who i has my first contact and all initial meetings and with had mysteriously dissappeared when we arrived and we were then handed to someone else to deal with us. the doctor we had initially been told that would do out egg collection did nt and some man i had never met did it. we were than also left with a perfect b blast which i had real issues discarding and it really upset me . this is why we wanted micro sort. I have had 11 pregnancies 3 boys all by c section and have been told 1 more c section is my limit so this is why we went for this route. Please give me some good info on where to go and if i should give my own eggs 1 more go as i did get 10, but felt that my own natural cycle was not taken into account which is longer, therefore 4 were imature. Having said that 4 did not fertilize which i find hard as we were also told ICI would be used. 3 failed to make it after day 3, but we were not not told what they were and 1 with genetic fault. we were not given any pictures of our embryos which i now realise is supposed to happen, but we were given 1 pic of the blast they put in. Since my BFN they have not answered any of our questions and i am wondering who the body is to complain to as they are still advertising micro sort on their site and adverts. they would not tell us before hand what we had in terms of embryos and this meant that i cried and we had 15 mins to decide when we got there and had a boy as well what was the best thing to do. All in all a distressing and unprofessional service. i would love some feed back from you ladies and would register on the private forums but we are truly skint as when we got there they also put up the price of meds and as we had already started we had no choice, or i felt i had no choice as it was my first experience. In all it cost us about £8, 0000, which we do not have, for nothing. I am posting on here to warn other desperate people who have carried a deep longing for a long time to beware. Any good experiences and affordable clinics with positive reviews, especially for a girl would be greatly appreciated.
Jen75

[Lara3]

Am3a what do you mean by doing tracking through a clinic, if you don't mind me asking? Are you in USA?

[glory]

jen you really need to join as a dream member, it is $12 a year and the best money ever spent. We have not seen one pregnancy here from Dogus, I think they come accross nice and all but it is a scam clinic.

Most girls from the UK either travel to Genesis clinic in Cyrpus or HRC in California as both of these are good for travellers.

THere is no gaurentee of PGD, so you may need to cycle even a few more times to get your girl. It took me 6 cycles to finally be pregnant and it was not what we thought we were up for.

Since you have had so many miscarriages, I would suggest a US clinic, possibly not even HRC, as there are reasons you would be miscarrying and these need to be sorted before having the PGD.

The pros of going to Genesis are that it is close and apparently it is very easy for European cyclers, they do a sort of sperm sort that does work, but we are not sure if this then does anything to the sperm as success rates here are not as high as they should be for a clinic that does FISH testing. A lot of cyclers are having to do 3 or 4 cycles to achieve a pregnancy.

He only tests 5 probe FISH which is an older method of testing, which means that not everything transferred will be normal on all chromosomes. Which may also be why success is a lot lower.

In America, it costs more to get there and stay and cycle, but they do full chromosome testing and if you get a transfer then you have a much higher chance of success (around 70% per transfer), they do not have any sperm sorting technique and your chances of transfer are lower.

Personally I would prefer a No Transfer than a transfer with an embryo that could never make a baby. But that is just me, a lot like it the other way.

Also not everything will fertilise with ICSI and not all eggs will be mature, you do loose eggs to maturity and fertilisation in the first few days. I have only had 1 of my 6 cycles with 100% fertilisation. I was never promised anything more.

Good luck, hope that you join as a member and have a good look around.

[jen75]

Hi, thanks for such a prompt reply,
There is no way in the world we can afford to go to America for our treatment. this was already all our savings and as we have an autistic son he would never cope with the change and we are already paying for lots of specialist help for him. i have already had loads of tests through the NHS for my miscarrages are there any you would recommend as i can ask for any i need over here with my current history. All indications from tests are that it was just unfortunate. they have discovered a high anti body count and low thyroid and i take 25micro grams thyroxin to help with this, I will join at the end of the month when we have a little money from pay. Thank you for your support. Do you know people who have done this at an affordable price and got results or am i just looking for false hope?
Thnks again for such a swift reply,
Jennie and Dan.
citw
jen you really need to join as a dream member, it is $12 a year and the best money ever spent. We have not seen one pregnancy here from Dogus, I think they come accross nice and all but it is a scam clinic.

Most girls from the UK either travel to Genesis clinic in Cyrpus or HRC in California as both of these are good for travellers.

THere is no gaurentee of PGD, so you may need to cycle even a few more times to get your girl. It took me 6 cycles to finally be pregnant and it was not what we thought we were up for.

Since you have had so many miscarriages, I would suggest a US clinic, possibly not even HRC, as there are reasons you would be miscarrying and these need to be sorted before having the PGD.

The pros of going to Genesis are that it is close and apparently it is very easy for European cyclers, they do a sort of sperm sort that does work, but we are not sure if this then does anything to the sperm as success rates here are not as high as they should be for a clinic that does FISH testing. A lot of cyclers are having to do 3 or 4 cycles to achieve a pregnancy.

He only tests 5 probe FISH which is an older method of testing, which means that not everything transferred will be normal on all chromosomes. Which may also be why success is a lot lower.

In America, it costs more to get there and stay and cycle, but they do full chromosome testing and if you get a transfer then you have a much higher chance of success (around 70% per transfer), they do not have any sperm sorting technique and your chances of transfer are lower.

Personally I would prefer a No Transfer than a transfer with an embryo that could never make a baby. But that is just me, a lot like it the other way.

Also not everything will fertilise with ICSI and not all eggs will be mature, you do loose eggs to maturity and fertilisation in the first few days. I have only had 1 of my 6 cycles with 100% fertilisation. I was never promised anything more.

Good luck, hope that you join as a member and have a good look around.

[glory]

Jen, in Australia you would get approved for PGD on the basis that your son has autism and that this generally affects more boys than girls, that plus your history of miscarriages would get you in the door. Different states have different policies but some are more 'lax' with their reasoning to give PGD.

I don't know what the law is there, but I am sure they do PGD for special circumstances? That would be a way cheaper option, it's local and your IVF may be paid for or subsidised by the government. I don't know if it is the same, but I would be ringing around and finding out, it can't hurt.

If you didn't mention gender selection for a girl, just that you want another child very badly and have had many miscarriages and that you know girls are less likely to have autism like your son and that you want to look into PGD for a girl, to possibly take away a high chance of the autism?

Realistically with going away it comes down to how much are you willing to risk and walk away from. Genesis is by far the better Cyprus clinic, but your chances of being a one hit wonder there is slim, just being honest. BUt doesn't mean it can't happen and if this is all you can afford, I would be there in a flash, I needed to know I tried everything I could to get my daughter.

I hope to see you in the members section :) There are heaps of girls in there and not many will post out here, as it is quite a private subject and are afraid of it being seen publicly. I won't show my signature because of that reason.

Your thyroid needs to be under control for a successful cycle and the antibodies may need some kind of treatment, I have not had to go down that path, but you could get seen (and treatment) for this in the UK, I would get onto it and then have a plan when you do cycle.

[luvpink]

Glory I'm from Brisbane. I looked into Sart but there results don't seem great. And we looked into HRC and in fact we were set on going with them (we first started looking into PGD about 18months ago and had a Skype consult with Dr Potter & then I saw the 60minutes story about his clinic and his success so I was convinced but now we are ready to go ahead and they can no longer do microsort so we thought since Genesis do sperm sorting it would give us the best chance to get more female embryos. I am a Dream member but there is so much to read. I would love to no which clinic has the best results. Does sperm sorting really make a difference is PGD enough. So many questions ???????.. For us it's not so much the money or distance but choosing the best clinic to give us a beautiful daughter in the shortest amount of time. Even my two gorgeous boys are asking for a baby sister.

[Wanting a daughter]

Direct flights to LA from brisbane, by far best success rates, I'd be going to HRC in your shoes. And I've just got a bfp from genesis.
Yes the sperm sort works, there's no question he gets high numbers of desired gender. But, we really don't know if it damages the sperm in anyway.

[Am3a]

Am3a what do you mean by doing tracking through a clinic, if you don't mind me asking? Are you in USA?

Hi Lara, I'm in Australia and I'm tracking through a fertility clinic for a girl. It's drug free. I have blood tests and an internal scan each cycle to measure my follicles. I'm in my 2ww of my 3rd cycle in 4 months (including 1 mc).

[glory]

Luv I agree with Wanting, she is our first BFP from Genesis in a long time and that is with donor eggs of a younger woman. (no offence WAD :) ), if I was in the UK and money was an option then yes I would go to Genesis but being in QLD and both money and travel are not a problem, your absolute by best choice would be to cycle would be HRC.

Second would be SART, there are far fewer BFN's from SART than genesis, plus they have now advanced to full chromosome testing this year which will increase their stats considerable.

I think we worked for Genesis, success rates at the moment are about 20%, yes everyone seems to get a transfer but of them nearly all put in more than one embryo and only 1 in 5 of them actually get pregnant.

With full chromosome testing on transfer at SART you would expect between 50-70% will achieve a BFP with transfer. Genea who half own SART when I had my transfer had a 85% success rate, so SART would be working towards that.

Travelling so far you need the comfort of full chromosome testing in my opinion, you want to know what you are putting back is normal, otherwise what is the point of going back for frozen transfers etc...

Here is a link to the private section of cycle summaries, BFP are positives and BFN are negatives.

http://genderdreaming.com/forum/ht-family-balancing-info-current-cycles/4876-past-present-cycle-summaries.html

[glory]

This is international stats for last year

http://genderdreaming.com/forum/international-clinics/25947-international-clinic-summary-data.html

This is HRC stats for last year
http://genderdreaming.com/forum/western-us-clinics/25945-western-us-clinics-summary-data.html

I know this is confusing and I am all for doing what needs to be done, but being someone who has cycled if you can afford better (and closer) do it!

[luvpink]

Thanks glory. Oh gosh so now I don't know what to do my gut tells me to go HRC but my DH thinks Genesis I really need to make up my mind we want to go ahead in June.

[glory]

Show him the stats, they speak for themselves. Of course if you were in the UK I may have a different opinion for you, but it doesn't make sense really. Maybe he doesn't mind a Cyrpus holiday and if it works well and good, if not then you could try somewhere else.

This was a heated Genesis discussion we had recently
http://genderdreaming.com/forum/ht-family-balancing-info-current-cycles/25643-genesis-sperm-sort-full-article.html

[luvpink]

Ok so after talking to my husband we have decided to look into Sart and HRC. I would be comfortable going to Thailand as I have been there 3 times for holidays and just love it. Do you know of any girls from Brisbane that have been or are going to Sart?

[jen75]

Hi Glory,
thank you for this information. i realise that i need to get some research done. do SART and HRC do sperm sorting as it has been distressing to read that some ladies have gone through a whole cycle and not got any embryos of their desired gender. my Dh is lovely and says that somehow we will find the money for another shot. I would like to do a tandem cycle due to my age 37.5 do you know which clinics offer this and what the chances are of success using this? I am looking forward to being able to get help finding accurate info through you ladies,
speak soon,
Jen75.

[Lara3]

I'm confused.. I didn't think that is was allowed in australia to do anything with gender. Is there a way I could do it without travelling? I am seeing a genea fertility specialist in April, but that was looking at going down the sart path. Thanks x

[lisvna]

5 probe fish test doesn't give better succes rates, its like normal IVF but knowing the gender. If you are oke with that then I would choose Genesis because of the spermsort (you will have a transfer of the desired gender) and a fresh transfer.

If you go to HRC and you choose Natera they check all 24 chromosomes but you won't get a fresh transfer. You must go back for a FET. They have also an other testing option with fresh transfer but what I understand is that dr Potter liked Natera more in the past.......

[Lara3]

Hi Lara, I'm in Australia and I'm tracking through a fertility clinic for a girl. It's drug free. I have blood tests and an internal scan each cycle to measure my follicles. I'm in my 2ww of my 3rd cycle in 4 months (including 1 mc).

Sorry. I meant t write other message in repsonse to this.. ta

[nuthinbutpink]

I'm confused.. I didn't think that is was allowed in australia to do anything with gender. Is there a way I could do it without travelling? I am seeing a genea fertility specialist in April, but that was looking at going down the sart path. Thanks x
Yes you can. I would do that before I went to Genesis.

Genesis has yet to prove itself. It doesn't matter if they have a sort if they can't get you pregnant.

Genea is a real possibility. I would pursue that first.

[glory]

Jen, I was recommending SART or HRC to luvpink, as she is in QLD, Australia. For her a trip to Genesis would be a 30+ hour flight I would think with stopovers along the way. She has also said that money is not a problem and she could do this a couple of times, wheras to HRC it would be a 15 hour flight.

For you if you want the cheapest option then Genesis with spermsort would be a better option (if you can't get approved locally, seriously you should look into it), like Lisvna said you will get a transfer, but I don't know how you feel about a transfer and a BFN as you have already had one. I personally did a 5 probe transfer and got a chemical pregnancy everyone assumed it was chromosomal issues but it worked out I had a blood clotting issue that was stopping implantation, so if I had never used full chromosome testing I would not have got help as quick as I did, as I don't get many good quality embryos in the beginning so chances of transfer were lower.

For me, a NT is a lot better than a transfer with an embryo that may not be normal. I am sorry Lisvna, but Dr Savaas transfers a lot of really, really good looking embryos that don't become babies, that makes no sense to me, his embryos are amount the best looking that I see, yet time and time again, no pregnancy. I know FISH doesn't increase rates of pregnancy, but the rates should be just has high as normal IVF and it isn't. Maybe they are just going through a bad stage, but if I only had one go and I could afford HRC, I would do it. IF I had many goes or could only afford one go at Genesis, then I would do Genesis.

Lara, GS is illegal in Australia. Very rarely some will get exempt on certain things, if you read the Genea website you will see that they will approve it if there is a sex linked disease in your family or if you have special circumstances, say your sons have autism and you would like a girl as there is less chance of a girl having autism.

It's a hard process to get approved, there are geneticists and testing to get through but I was told a 'handful' of people get done this way a year. (and works out to be just as expensive in the long run)

It's not something I like talking about on the main boards as they aren't private. If you have questions, then ask in the members section :)

[glory]

Lara, Am3a is not doing PGD in Australia, she is going to a fertility doctor for cycle tracking, they will tell her when she ovulates and when the best time do have sex for her DG. This would work in a similar way to Shettles method.

I personally did the shettles method twice and it did not work, but there are others that say with the monitoring then your chances are higher.

[jen75]

Thank you Glory,
you are so informative and helpful, i will try to work out how to private message you so we can talk some more. you are a mine of useful information. Would like to talk more and pick your brains if possible. Great news on Dream Blue.

[Lara3]

Lara, Am3a is not doing PGD in Australia, she is going to a fertility doctor for cycle tracking, they will tell her when she ovulates and when the best time do have sex for her DG. This would work in a similar way to Shettles method.

I personally did the shettles method twice and it did not work, but there are others that say with the monitoring then your chances are higher.

THank you!
I actually have an appointment with the FS connected to Sart in April (in Sydney). Do you think I could ask her whether she could do that?

[Am3a]

Hi Lara, I am openly "tracking for a girl".
Like any method, it's not 100%.

If you search my username you'll find other posts I've written with more details.

<3

[nuthinbutpink]

Hi Lara, I am openly "tracking for a girl".
Like any method, it's not 100%.

If you search my username you'll find other posts I've written with more details.

<3

Is this Shettles? What is it? How do they "track"?

[glory]

THank you!
I actually have an appointment with the FS connected to Sart in April (in Sydney). Do you think I could ask her whether she could do that?

She would track your cycle this is not illegal (she wont agree with it working though) but the chances of it working are not like PGD. PGD is 99%+ accurate, this would be either 50:50 or slightly higher!

I think that if you have nothing else than yes do it, I was speaking to my cousin the other day and she knows people who are doing this as well. I personally don't believe it as I did with Ds 2 and 3 the Shettles method to the letter and no success. I didn't do monitoring with a clinic but I did timing via ovulation by working out when I ovulated myself.

You will not be able to do PGD in Australia, only via SART in Bangkok with Genea.

[atomic sagebrush]

Is this Shettles? What is it? How do they "track"?

I think this is some kind of Urobiologics-type thing. Here is one of the PP's other posts where she describes it.

http://genderdreaming.com/forum/waiting-ttc-future-cycle-buddies/27071-tracking-through-fertility-clinic-how-does-work.html#post367622

[Lara3]

Hi Lara, I am openly "tracking for a girl".
Like any method, it's not 100%.

If you search my username you'll find other posts I've written with more details.

<3

Great thanks. Read them and I think I understand.

Where about are you?

[b9mos]

Welcome to this board!

[desperate4blue]

Hi I'm from Australia and planning on going to Genesis in June for a girl. We have been deciding between Genesis and HRC but in the end decided with Genesis because they do sperm sorting. I hope we are making the right decision as they dont seem to have had a lot of success lately.

Hi

Just wondering if u have decided on genesis or not?

[monpetit]

Sorry.... were is "member section"? I can't find it

[Jus]

Good luck, If I could afford it I would go to!

[glory]

Hi

Just wondering if u have decided on genesis or not?

Luvpink is now going to HRC.

With the member section, you will only see it if you become a dream member. Most members wont post out here as they are afraid that people they know might see them.

[nuthinbutpink]

Sorry.... were is "member section"? I can't find it

http://genderdreaming.com/forum/forum.php#dream-member-high-tech-family-balancing-private-forum

It will say private unless you are a Dream Member.

[ella]

Hi

New to this forum! We too are going to genesis in June, for donor egg and spermsort and PGD.

We had a failed attempt last year with SART with my own eggs, so now with low AMH going to try with donor eggs, because could not travel so far without realistic chance of success.

Would really like to ask Wanting a Daughter how you were able to push genesis for more info on donor?

[glory]

Hi Ella and welcome. The best thing to do is join the dream membership for $12, then you can access the HT section, where most people will post. I don't think Wanting a Daughter was able to get much out of Genesis in terms of the donor.

Which state are you in? Would love to follow your story. Wanting a Daughter is heading back in June for a FET.

[ella]

Hi Ella and welcome. The best thing to do is join the dream membership for $12, then you can access the HT section, where most people will post. I don't think Wanting a Daughter was able to get much out of Genesis in terms of the donor.

Which state are you in? Would love to follow your story. Wanting a Daughter is heading back in June for a FET.


Really pleased to have found this forum.
We are going to genesis in June,
need to decide if to use 12 probe FISH,
would seem better to have as much chromosome info as possible even if this leads to some false positive identifications? Better to have NT than one that could lead to miscarriage?

[desperate4blue]

Really pleased to have found this forum.
We are going to genesis in June,
need to decide if to use 12 probe FISH,
would seem better to have as much chromosome info as possible even if this leads to some false positive identifications? Better to have NT than one that could lead to miscarriage?

Hi Ella

Please keep me posted as to how u get on with the genesis clinic, as I am planning to go there to in the near futurw.

Many thanks

[glory]

I personally don't agree with that much testing because the chances of loosing potentially good embryos with that much testing is high. Your donor will be young and chances are most of the embryos that you will get that make it to a good stage on day 5 will be normal.

I wouldn't do anymore than a 5 probe and even then I would settle for X, Y and 21 if available.

The test on day 3, but they transfer by day 5, at this stage a lot can be seen as to what is a good and bad embryo, so they will pick not only the one that is 'normal' but the one that looks the best also. Not always are those one's normal, but they are able to tell a lot now from a day 5 embryo.

I think your chances with a donor are a lot higher than the results we have been getting lately, try not to worry.

[ella]

Thank you very much for advise, really appreciate it. I am wondering how many embryos likely to be lost unnecessarily also 12 probe FISH ? I had a miscarriage last yr so really want to do everything possible to reduce chance of this. Although would be terrible to loose good embryos for no reason, think for me would be worse to have miscarriage even if there are other embryos frozen to use later.

I am wondering also if anyone knows of REALLY CHEAP place to stay near genesis (spent all our cash on treatment!)

Good luck to everyone going in June, it is such a mind blowing process!

[unsure!]

good luck!!

[Wanting a daughter]

Hi Ella,
when in June will you be there? Which side of oz are you from?

June is their high season so cheap places may be harder to find. Saying that though accommodation there is cheaper than here in oz.

Good luck.

[ella]

I will be there beginning of june. We are from south australia.

[glory]

It is estimated that each probe has a 5-15% rate of being wrong. So by doing that many probes you will potentially loose another 1 or 2 good embryos.

I would not do more than 5 probe, I didn't even know Dr Savaas did that many probes. You won't gain any better info by doing more probes, it is not the same as doing full chromosome testing because of the way it is tested. They also only take 1 cell at day 3 so this just isn't enough to get a full picture.

Your donor will be young, most of her eggs should be normal anyway. Biopsy is on day 3, but naturally most will loose half their embryos day 3 to 5, these are generally abnormal and what is left is what they choose from they can tell a lot about an embryo by looking on day 5.

[ella]

Thank you for all this info. It will be a huge help with our decision.

[lisvna]

Dr Savvas from the Genesis clinic doesn't offer 12 probe fish. He does offer 5 probe. Ella are you confused with north Cyprus IVF clinic? There works a dr Savas.

[Palloma]

Hello everyone!
I am a 33 year old mother of four gorgeous boys!
Me and my husband would like to try for a girl using PDG.
I live in sweden and it against the law of ethics to preform pdg/microsort or gender balance techniques.
I have been in contact with multiple clinics around the world and has decided to go to Dr Savas in Genesis clinic, cyprus .
I would love to hear more about this treatment and your experiences with it all.
I hear you have a 33% chance to conceive the first time, is this true?
kind regards palloma!

[ever hopeful]

Welcome Palloma. I've been to Genesis twice and got PG both times with an XX (and I'm 'old' 44!) First time, sadly I m/c at 9 weeks, and am currently in the very early stages of this pregnancy - two good BETA's, so fx this one works. Personally, I like Savvas very much and the clinic, it's small and you get a personal service which is nice, although communication isn't always ideal...but I think that's just a different culture. However, from the experience of other girls on here, I definitely think that with Genesis it's a bit of 'one size fits all'. If it works for you great but, if not, you could spend a lot of money and go through a lot of emotional heartache.

Just wondering why you have chosen Genesis? At present, HRC in California are having fab results - 83% success I think and given your age you'd stand an excellent chance of it working first time. I seriously thought about going there this time round, had consult with Dr Potter and DH even left a sample. As a GD member you get a free consult and $1,000 off your cycle. Cost wise it's not that much more expensive (although travel obviously is). Really don't want to put you off Genesis but 30% versus 83% is a big difference....Good luck in you decision and if you've got any more questions please PM me xx