BD timing and frequency

[ThinkingofPink]

I know that it isn't proven at all that timing sways but it is suggested that it may just slightly in some women and that FR or abstaining may sway. My question is, does dtd 4 days in a row including ovulation day sway at all? To be specific, we dtd yesterday (5 days before O) then skipped today (got too busy) and are planning on dtd every day for the next four days which includes O day. Will it mess up our chances dtd on O day? Will dtd 4 days in a row even lower his sperm count? Thanks!

[rainbowflower]

we call that "frequent BD" (a variation of FR), although normally it's 7+ days in a row...
it will lower sperm count, not as much as over a longer period, though. If you wanted to salvage it CFR might be an option for you

[ThinkingofPink]

Oh ok we may try that then. What about dtd on O day, is it a bad idea?

[atomic sagebrush]

I personally think that frequency has not gotten the results to justify its existence. One attempt in the fertile window has gotten great results, and thus I hesitate to see anyone doing several attempts like you are describing. I would stick with what you've already done (the attempt 5 DBO) because that's unlikely to achieve pregnancy, and then another attempt 1 DBO.

Attempting on O Day doesn't sway blue, but it is lower odds of conception with one attempt. Better shot DTD 1 DBO

[atomic sagebrush]

If you can't do frequent release/BD 7 days in a row before the EARLIEST attempt that could possibly get you pregnant, then it's not frequent release/BD. I really advise against what you're thinking of doing, I think it will sway blue for you.

Stick with one unprotected attempt from here on in. whether you ahve your husband release on his own or not is up to you.

[rainbowflower]

I personally think that frequency has not gotten the results to justify its existence. One attempt in the fertile window has gotten great results, and thus I hesitate to see anyone doing several attempts like you are describing. I would stick with what you've already done (the attempt 5 DBO) because that's unlikely to achieve pregnancy, and then another attempt 1 DBO.

Attempting on O Day doesn't sway blue, but it is lower odds of conception with one attempt. Better shot DTD 1 DBO

sorry for jumping in, but I just want to ask to clarify... I agree that the 1 attempt results are looking great BUT those are all from women who were (almost certainly) all doing lowering of some sort? so perhaps that has helped those results to some degree? (could create a row for number of attempts + lowering (one of FR, FBD, abstain, and CFR) and a row for number of attempts without lowering ("other"))? although saying that even most of those who said "other" will still doing SOME sort of lowering such as FR for 5 days or abstain then 2 attempts...

[ThinkingofPink]

Thanks for the response Atomic. I may do what you suggest then. I'm just really wanting a baby and was thinking of giving myself the best possible shot at catching the egg on the first try. I know in the end though I may be disappointed that I didn't try harder to get a girl.

[atomic sagebrush]

sorry for jumping in, but I just want to ask to clarify... I agree that the 1 attempt results are looking great BUT those are all from women who were (almost certainly) all doing lowering of some sort? so perhaps that has helped those results to some degree? (could create a row for number of attempts + lowering (one of FR, FBD, abstain, and CFR) and a row for number of attempts without lowering ("other"))? although saying that even most of those who said "other" will still doing SOME sort of lowering such as FR for 5 days or abstain then 2 attempts...

Well at least one person wasn't doing any kind of pattern at all - ME. Boy frequency, one attempt, result, girl.

Look everyone, I made those frequency patterns up 2 years ago trying to think up ways to lower sperm numbers. There is nothing even remotely proven about them and the results have been much worse than the amount of trouble that they are causing for people. It's time to let them go and try something different and see if we get better results. No one should feel wedded to something that I pulled out of my butt 2 years ago.

To answer the specific question, the two timing and frequency patterns that are almost always done with one attempt, the O+12 and the CFR, have pretty close to identical success rates of the one attempt (not a huge sample size but still). The frequency patterns that are more often done with more than one attempt, are getting disappointing results. In the meantime people who didn't even DO frequency, or at least didn't do it "right", are getting about 75%.

It's not just the stats that make me think this, either. It's many hours of my experience where people struggle incessantly with these frequency patterns getting BFN after BFN, and other times when on paper people did everything right, and I had them keep frequency and start adding attempts and the result was an opposite. It makes NO sense to continue doing frequency when it's inhibiting pregnancy and causing stress for people. IT'S NOT WORKING.

The stats and my personal experience with people who had great sways but didn't get pregnant and ended up adding attempts and then conceiving boys (and even some blue swayers who had great attempts but insisted on keeping the one attempt at O Shettles timing and got girl opposites), lead me to believe that it's the one attempt swaying and not the frequency. I think this is being supported by our experiences with the stats and due date groups, because we were not getting super great results for awhile there and pretty much right away when I started pushing keeping the one attempt, we started getting better results.

Do I KNOW this, no, not yet, it's a theory just like frequency patterns were a theory. But unlike frequency patterns, I feel like I have a fair amount of data and experience for making the recommendation. I can't always even verbalize why I think this, because I talk to at this point thousands of people but I remember tons of stuff and that's where I draw the data on which I base my conclusions. It's SO much more than one stats thread.

I don't know why it is, it may have nothing to even DO with one attempt, it may be the stress of frequency raising T levels for people or that it takes them longer to get pg and they give up on other stuff that sways harder, but we have to try it with just one attempt and without frequency and see waht happens.

Could I be wrong, oh yeah certainly. But I feel like I have a WAYY better handle on this than I do the frequency patterns. Either way, it boils down to "something atomic made up" and to my way of thinking, I hope that it makes sense to people to do "something atomic made up" now with 2 extra years of experiences under my belt vs. "something atomic made up" 2 years ago!

[Fbunny3]

Atomic I'm sorry to gate crash this thread but I'm a newbie and would really appreciate if you could let me know if I've read this right as some if the code words I'm still slow with,
So I'm on 4/5 days before ov, should I release hubby every day now until ov, but not BD, then on ov day BD? Just the once? Shall I release him first? Or shall we BD more than once that day?
Apologies if I sound a bit silly asking what might of clearly been stated above, being a newbie is hard keeping up to speed!;)
If anyone else can help out with this is really appreciate it!:)
Xx

[lovemy2blessings]

So, is it ok to dtd with a condom until positive opk (for the one attempt)?

[atomic sagebrush]

Atomic I'm sorry to gate crash this thread but I'm a newbie and would really appreciate if you could let me know if I've read this right as some if the code words I'm still slow with,
So I'm on 4/5 days before ov, should I release hubby every day now until ov, but not BD, then on ov day BD? Just the once? Shall I release him first? Or shall we BD more than once that day?
Apologies if I sound a bit silly asking what might of clearly been stated above, being a newbie is hard keeping up to speed!;)
If anyone else can help out with this is really appreciate it!:)
Xx

Hi fbunny,

This is really a "crystal ball" type question that we don't really have the data to answer. I think that no matter what frequency pattern you choose (the releasing, etc) sticking to one attempt seems to be what is getting the results and so FOR NOW, on the basis of the data I have, I think it's best to drop or limit frequency and keep the one attempt. Some people are going to start off wanting to do everythign and seeing if they can get pg that way, and so if you want to give it a go, since you're only 4 days out, I would have him release every day and then release once before as well. Or if you wantbetter odds of conception, just do the release within 3 hours before yoru attempt and skip the days of release prior.

[atomic sagebrush]

So, is it ok to dtd with a condom until positive opk (for the one attempt)?

yes I think that is fine