TTC Girl and Fertility Doc advice

[b'smommy]

We have been TTC for over a year now and just met with a fertility doctor, someone my husband actually knows well.

Anyway, it looks like I will probably begin fertility drugs since he thinks I have an ovulation issue with my abnormally short cycles. He has advised me to limit my caffeine and start taking Prenatal vitamins!!! I know this is typically a big no no when TTC girl. I am just taking folic right now along with zyrtec, baby aspirin and fiber.

He also told me not to loose any weight and make sure I am getting enough calories and protein. If I stay within the upper range of LE do you think I should be okay? I have been eating more towards the lower end, but with days I exceed the upper once a week or every other week. I am about 120-122 lbs (depending on day) and 5' 7.5".

My husband had to throw in there that I had being doing the low cal vegetarian diet to TTC girl and the doctor said there was no data to support that it works. I still believe it sways, or gives us girls hope at least. :)

Any advice out there? Has anyone been in a similar situation?

[nuthinbutpink]

If you don't ovulate, you can't get pregnant and cannot have a chance at a girl. If you aren't ovulating, you're likely not eating enough. If your BMI is too low not only can it make it hard to get pregnant but it can make keeping a pregnancy difficult too.

[atomic sagebrush]

Oh yes doctors love to tell people to take prenatals even though the only nutrient proven to make any difference in pregnancy outcome when taken before BFP, is folic acid. It's a quick fix way for them to appear to be doing something while passing the buck to you. Prenatal vitamins- A review of the literature on benefits and risks of various nutrient supplements | Formulary Journal (http://formularyjournal.modernmedicine.com/formulary-journal/RC/clinical/clinical-pharmacology/prenatal-vitamins-review-literature-benefits-a)

A couple compromises to prenatals:

Take them 3x a week

or take 150 iu iodine daily
18-30 mg iron 3x a week
8-15 mg zinc 3x a week
and if you don't get much sunshine Vit. D 400 iu once a week

I need to be perfectly clear what you consider upper and lower limits of LE are as follows:

1800-2000 cal
50-60 g pro
60 g fat

Sometimes people tell me they're eating all this food and I find out they have some other definition of what LE Diet even is. Low everything does not mean NO everything. If you stick in those limits it will help restore your cycles. I would like to see you eat a serving of full fat dairy a day, 4 eggs a week, and 1 serving salmon every week (you try to fit them into your limits for the day when possible.)

Just because your doctor doesn't know about proof does not mean that it doesn't exist. :)

[b'smommy]

Thank you, thank you Atomic and nuthinbutpink!

I have been eating closer to the 1500 calories/day and 40 g protein, but I will happily increase. Looking forward to eggs and salmon once/week. I have a dairy intolerance, but can incorporate some soy yogurt and maybe include a little more cheese, I can handle small amounts of hard cheese. I probably eat fewer calories than others since I don't really eat dairy.

I have only been doing LE for about 3 months, so I think I had ovulation issues before starting the diet, but I am sure increasing my calories will help. I did get blood work back today and the doc said I ovulated last week, so I'm not out yet! FX!! It was actually the first time all year I got a true positive lh surge.

I appreciate the options for additional supplements. Still thinking about what I want to do. I do eat tons of vegetables, especially ones that are super foods like kale, spinach and sweet potatoes. I know that you say to try and eat lower nutrient, but I thought, what the heck, I love vegetables. I am going to stop counting my veggies/fruit in as much in my fitness pal.

P.S. I did ask my doc if it would be okay to do cardio and he said no no no!

[atomic sagebrush]

Ok if eating only 1500 now, bump up to 1800 first and see what happens before increase more than that.

Low carb veg are free food on LE DIET, you can have as much as you like. When you have a choice of a lower nutrient foods pick the lower nutrient one but you can still have an unlimited amount of low carb veg like kale.

Try yogurt, many people with lactose intolerance can tolerate it because the active cultures predigest the lactose. I would not use soy yogurt, it's the saturated fat you're after and soy has compounds and a type of fat that may be harmful to fertility.

[atomic sagebrush]

If you were counting fruit and veg in my fitness pal then you were REALLY not getting enough. Low carb veg are free food and unlimited, high carb veg and fruits are free for protein and fat, only count cals.

[b'smommy]

Thank you so much Atomic. You are so helpful!! :)

[b'smommy]

Oh yes doctors love to tell people to take prenatals even though the only nutrient proven to make any difference in pregnancy outcome when taken before BFP, is folic acid. It's a quick fix way for them to appear to be doing something while passing the buck to you. Prenatal vitamins- A review of the literature on benefits and risks of various nutrient supplements | Formulary Journal (http://formularyjournal.modernmedicine.com/formulary-journal/RC/clinical/clinical-pharmacology/prenatal-vitamins-review-literature-benefits-a)

A couple compromises to prenatals:

Take them 3x a week

or take 150 iu iodine daily
18-30 mg iron 3x a week
8-15 mg zinc 3x a week
and if you don't get much sunshine Vit. D 400 iu once a week

I need to be perfectly clear what you consider upper and lower limits of LE are as follows:

1800-2000 cal
50-60 g pro
60 g fat

Sometimes people tell me they're eating all this food and I find out they have some other definition of what LE Diet even is. Low everything does not mean NO everything. If you stick in those limits it will help restore your cycles. I would like to see you eat a serving of full fat dairy a day, 4 eggs a week, and 1 serving salmon every week (you try to fit them into your limits for the day when possible.)

Just because your doctor doesn't know about proof does not mean that it doesn't exist. :)

Atomic,
My doctor is starting me on Clomid this week. Is there anything that I should do different in regards to supplements? I have been taking the baby aspirin, fiber and zyrtec. My husband has been taking LR. I am thinking he should stop the LR and just drink peppermint tea with me.

We also did 1 attempt at positive opk last month. It didn't look like the stats were much different with 2 attempts. What do you think?

Sorry for all of the questions, I just want to put our best foot forward once I start the Clomid.

Thank you!!

[atomic sagebrush]

I would drop the zyrtec and the peppermint tea for you, and drop BOTH LR and pep tea for DH. They are both detrimental to sperm health.

If you have him on cranberry I would drop that and do the olive leaf extract instead.

Before a few days ago, the stats on 2 attempts vs. 1 were running about 60-65% with 2 attempts and one attempt has been steadily consistent at 75% for months. We have had a run of successful sways lately that may be artificially inflating the 2 attempts number and I think you should give it at least one month on clomid with the one attempt. But that is just my opinion and it's totally up to you on that.

[b'smommy]

So I got a positive opk on CD 9 with a clearblue digital. We bd CD 8 (not an attempt, but I guess it was now). I am hoping that I am not out for this month. I am out of town for work and come back tomorrow, my doctor said to give it another attempt when I get home (even though it is a little late). Any others O crazy early on Clomid? I didn't think I would have an attempt until this weekend.

[atomic sagebrush]

keep doing OPK and have another attempt, that may have been a false surge. Pretty unlikely that you would have ovualted that soon after taking Clomid - anything is possible of course but much more likely that you ahve started taking OPK too soon and are still detecting the Clomid in your system (makes false pos OPK). Clomid and Ovulation Tests (http://www.justmommies.com/getting-pregnant/fertility-medications-and-natural-supplements/clomid-and-ovulation-tests)

did they tell you to start doing OPK that soon?? It's unusual advice

[b'smommy]

keep doing OPK and have another attempt, that may have been a false surge. Pretty unlikely that you would have ovualted that soon after taking Clomid - anything is possible of course but much more likely that you ahve started taking OPK too soon and are still detecting the Clomid in your system (makes false pos OPK). Clomid and Ovulation Tests (http://www.justmommies.com/getting-pregnant/fertility-medications-and-natural-supplements/clomid-and-ovulation-tests)

did they tell you to start doing OPK that soon?? It's unusual advice

My doctor told me to start testing on cd 9 b/c my cycles are only 24/25 days. I was stubborn and tested on cd 8 and it was negative, then positive on 9. They told me to me to test again this am, but that little smiley face was stuck for 2 days, it would not let me reset. :)

I asked if it was a false positive and they told me it wasn't with the digital. Maybe, maybe not?? They would have had me come in for a u/s today, but I was out of town, bummer. They did say they would probably have to put me on a higher dose to delay ovulation next cycle. I hope there isn't a next cycle, but this does not sound very promising. I will keep testing like you said, maybe I have a shot at another attempt and it was false positive. We will also attempt tonight to try and catch it.

[atomic sagebrush]

Eeek - take this for what it's worth, but get a new doctor!! FOR SURE second opinion before upping Clomid dose because you can end up with freaking quadruplets that way!!

First of all it is TOTALLY possible to get false pos OPK on digi tests and there are 700 gals on this site who can confirm that as fact. Secondly, if you start testing too soon when on Clomid, you get false pos OPK, that's how it works (please refer to link I posted) and if a doctor doesn't know that, I find that pretty darn concerning.

Clomid cycles have NOTHING to do with what your normal cycles off Clomid. There is no reason to expect or believe that you will O the same days. That's actually kind of the POINT of Clomid is that you aren't getting pregnant with the way your cycle is functioning and you need to change it up.

Keep testing and having regular attempts because I woudl bet dollars to donuts this is a false pos from the Clomid and not a real ovulation. Again, anything is possible so always cover bases with an attempt, it's just not terribly likely. GL!!

[b'smommy]

That's good to know other gals have had false positives on the digital.

I didn't talk straight to the horses mouth, was dealing with the nurse. So, maybe some info could be incorrect. But, she did sound very certain that the test was probably correct. But, she did tell me to test again. I will keep testing and hope I get a positive soon. P.s. I have been taking opk's all year and never got a positive until last month and this month. So, maybe something is working. :). I hope.

[atomic sagebrush]

You see what can happen is that the first test you took, your urine may have just been too dilute to register on the test (false negative and happens all the time) but the Clomid hormones were still THERE, then when you tested on CD 9, the test registered positive. Hope that makes sense.

Anything is possible of course, it's just that I want you to be in with a good attempt this month! :)

[b'smommy]

You see what can happen is that the first test you took, your urine may have just been too dilute to register on the test (false negative and happens all the time) but the Clomid hormones were still THERE, then when you tested on CD 9, the test registered positive. Hope that makes sense.

Anything is possible of course, it's just that I want you to be in with a good attempt this month! :)

Atomic, you were right! I just got a positive this am with a digital. Hopefully, this will count as my one attempt at positive opk since the last attempt was 4 days ago. And I just pigged out on Mexican last night, ohh well. At least it was vegetarian. :)

Thank you so much for letting me know, b/c I probably would not have continued testing through today. FX!

[atomic sagebrush]

Thank you for updating me, I really appreciate it (the feedback helps me to know if I'm on the right track with this stuff)!!

Yes that is perfect timing for having your next attempt, every 4 days is what got me my DD. Good luck and don't worry about the Mexi-pigout - it may be that gave your body the raw materials it needed to surge! :cheer:

[b'smommy]

Thank you for updating me, I really appreciate it (the feedback helps me to know if I'm on the right track with this stuff)!!

Yes that is perfect timing for having your next attempt, every 4 days is what got me my DD. Good luck and don't worry about the Mexi-pigout - it may be that gave your body the raw materials it needed to surge! :cheer:

Hi Atomic! Just started my af today after a very very very light bfp yesterday. :( I am going to call my doc on Monday, but it must have been a chemical.

I just paid for the personalized plan, not sure how that works, but I do see I have access to additional boards now.

I should be starting round 2 of clomid on Monday and really want to put my best foot forward with my sway this month. Any help would be greatly appreciated. So far I have been doing LE since Nov with literally 4 cheats during that time. I dropped almost everything this month with the exception of folic 1000 mcg, baby aspirin every other day, skipping breakfast, metamucil orange fiber 2x day (am and pm) and 1 attempt at pos. opk.

I do have a few ?'s about my diet, I had mentioned that I have a very difficult time digesting dairy, so just eat small amounts of cheese. I feel I do struggle to reach calories/fat since I don't eat dairy products like others may do. I do drink 2-3 cups of coffee each morning with a splash of vanilla soy milk and wondering if that is not good for sway since it is fortified with all sorts of vitamins. I looked at the rice dream I buy and that is fortified too, do you know of any non-fortified brands? I eat 2 meals per day, no snacking. My lunch is a very light meal (usually a veggie burger on english muffin or hummus sandwich with veggies and a banana) and eat a big dinner every night with a glass or two of white wine.

I travel 2-3 days EVERY week for my job, so I have to find LE foods on the road.

You did mention the olive leaf for dh, and I think I want to buy that this weekend. Do you know of a good brand?

Thanks for all of your help!! :)

[atomic sagebrush]

B in order to do a custom plan I need you to fill out the questionnaire and I can bump you to the head of the line because time is short.

I think you need to test again and hold off restarting the clomid till you get a negative test. You can have bleeding in pregnancy and if you are still pregnant, it would not be good to restart the Clomid.

Don't worry if you arent' getting much dairy, I hardly had any either and just got fat/pro/cals from other stuff instead. The soy milk in a small amount is fine. There is unfortified rice milk but it's gotten quite a lot harder to find. I got my daughter drinking fortified Rice Dream. You do need SOME nutrients coming in, it's Low everything, not NO everything.

Any brand of Olive Leaf is ok, I'd try to go with name brands rather than "Joe's Herb Shop of Topanga Canyon" Some people think liquid is better than dry form, but do what works FOR YOU - if you don't think DH would like taking the liquid, do the dry stuff.


I would up intake of folic to at least 1200-1600, and if this was a chemical you may want to go as high as 2000.

[b'smommy]

B in order to do a custom plan I need you to fill out the questionnaire and I can bump you to the head of the line because time is short.

I think you need to test again and hold off restarting the clomid till you get a negative test. You can have bleeding in pregnancy and if you are still pregnant, it would not be good to restart the Clomid.

Don't worry if you arent' getting much dairy, I hardly had any either and just got fat/pro/cals from other stuff instead. The soy milk in a small amount is fine. There is unfortified rice milk but it's gotten quite a lot harder to find. I got my daughter drinking fortified Rice Dream. You do need SOME nutrients coming in, it's Low everything, not NO everything.

Any brand of Olive Leaf is ok, I'd try to go with name brands rather than "Joe's Herb Shop of Topanga Canyon" Some people think liquid is better than dry form, but do what works FOR YOU - if you don't think DH would like taking the liquid, do the dry stuff.


I would up intake of folic to at least 1200-1600, and if this was a chemical you may want to go as high as 2000.

Hi Atomic,

I did just submit those 2 forms. I think it was just 2. Yes, def. my AF, no doubt. It has been super heavy and bad cramps. I will up the folic and get DH olive leaf, hopefully that will help with our attempt in about 2 weeks. Thanks!

[atomic sagebrush]

I had a full 5 day period, seemed totally normal, in fact a bit heavier than normal, with cramps, and I was pg the whole entire time and had a healthy normal 8 lb baby 9 months later!!!! Please take another pg test before starting the Clomid - better safe than sorry and you may be surprised by a pos test

[b'smommy]

Thanks, I will. I am calling doc in am too. I did take one the day after the crazy faint pos and I couldn't see anything.

[atomic sagebrush]

I'd still take one more in case your urine was just less concentrated the second day - it would be unlikely to get another false neg. at this point.

[b'smommy]

I'd still take one more in case your urine was just less concentrated the second day - it would be unlikely to get another false neg. at this point.

Hey Atomic,

I have had a bad cold/cough/sore throat the past few days. I have only been sucking on cough drops and taking ibuprofen since I know cough meds sway blue. Are there any herbal teas I can have that would not affect my sway? Just trying to figure something out to feel better.

P.S. I did take another preg test before popping the clomid yesterday, it was a bfn.

[stephk]

I have had a cold and have been drinking hot water with lemon and honey when I have really needed a hot drink. I have also had the odd cup of dandilion tea and the odd cup of camomile/honey tea.

I have stayed away from pep tea since I came off BCP in January although the odd cup of that would probably be fine.

Happy to be corrected on all of this by someone wiser :)

Hope you feel better soon.

[b'smommy]

I have had a cold and have been drinking hot water with lemon and honey when I have really needed a hot drink. I have also had the odd cup of dandilion tea and the odd cup of camomile/honey tea.

I have stayed away from pep tea since I came off BCP in January although the odd cup of that would probably be fine.

Happy to be corrected on all of this by someone wiser :)

Hope you feel better soon.

Thanks Stephk! Good idea about the hot water with lemon and honey. I did have just one cup a day of the peppermint tea with some honey (I'm staying away from it now b/c of the clomid). This cold just won't go away, I might take sudafed for a couple days with hopes it won't hurt me too bad with the clomid since I am only CD 5 right now. The sinus pressure is just soo bad. :)

[atomic sagebrush]

Is it stuffiness?? Would guanefesin help? The Sudafed is ok if you really have to, I don't like it because I don't think it's safe enough but one is prob. ok

I think any herb tea in moderation (as in, 1 cup) would be ok. I would stay away from any of the hormonal ones (pep tea, rasp. leaf tea, green tea) and while I know there are people out there who did use peppermint when on Clomid I don't recommend that. If it's an herb tea blend it is prob not enough mint to do anything. I also second the honey suggestion