Gender Selection Rules up for review in Australia - please make a submission!

[LJ81]

Hi Aussie girls. The NHMRC released its draft review of the ethical guidelines on the use of ART in clinical practice and research last week following public submissions on the issue last year. Please please please can people make a public submission in support of changing the rules and allowing gender selection in Australia - a link to the public consultation website is below. It is a bit of an effort to write a submission, but surely less of an effort than all of the trouble we have to go to to go overseas for the procedure.

I am about to draft a submission and I am happy for other people to see it if you want an example - I'm not promising it will be any good though!! Closing date for submissions is 17 September 2015. Lets get this through girls!

Ethical guidelines on the use of assisted reproductive technology in clinical practice and research | NHMRC Public Consultations (http://consultations.nhmrc.gov.au/public_consultations/assisted-reproductive-tech)

[MummaBear]

For anyone considering ART Gender Selection PLEASE submit a review. The NHMRC had this open for public comment 12months ago and have spent the last 12months reviewing it. The fact that they have decided they can't make a decision on it yet until they have had more public consideration means they may actually change the law here.

For anyone interested this is what I have submitted to the NHMRC :)

I am writing to express my views in regards to the use of ART and gender selection here in Australia.
I believe it should be allowed following very strict guide lines of family balancing for those families of 2 or more of the same gender.
My Story
I am a mother of 3 boys soon to be 4. We have tried every old wives tale gender sway technique and still have been unable to again naturally conceive the female child our family longs for.
We both love all of our boys and would not change any of them. When I found out my 3rd child was a boy I was a little upset not because he was a boy but because it still wasn’t the little girl I have always believed I was going to have. My husband and I had always planned on 4 children so we still had one more chance. I had lost a little girl. My first pregnancy was a girl but sadly I miscarried her at 10weeks (trisomy 16 – a completely random event and most common form of early miscarriage). I knew it was possible for us to conceive a girl and at the time we didn’t really want to invest all our savings into traveling overseas for IVF/PGD gender selection. We believed we could have a girl naturally with a lot of effort on us to use the sway techniques I had spent endless hours researching.
When we fell pregnant again I was positive it was a girl, we had put all our effort for months into swaying and surely it had worked. I decided to go with the new genetic testing to find out the gender early. Having 3 boys already the comments when people find out you are pregnant again are very ‘it has to be a girl’, ‘I bet you hope it’s a girl’ etc. This actually makes gender disappointment even worse and I wanted to stop these comments before they began so I wanted to find out gender before we announced it to anyone.
At 11 weeks I found out I was having another little boy. My world came crashing down. Whilst I was happy he was healthy this time being our final child my lifelong dream of having a daughter was gone in an instant. I still haven’t announced this pregnancy as I now feel very protective over this little man and worry people will feel he is unwanted as they know I would have loved a daughter. Again this is not the case but I feel I need to protect him from people and their thoughtlessness. Society is apparently against gender selection but the pressure they put on couples to have both boys and girls is incredible and anyone who has a one gender family receives endless bombardments of comments about having a child of the opposite gender. I have random strangers come up to me and say I have to have a girl as being a mother to a girl is completely different to that of being a mother to a boy, again thoughtless comments that don’t help. People who can clearly see I’m pregnant ask and I say it’s a boy but I have to follow up with a 20 minute speech about us being over the moon happy it’s another boy and yes it will be extremely crazy in our house but we wouldn’t change if for the world. This is normally followed up by wow you will be completely outnumbered. Yes thank you for that completely obvious observation.
This grief though was something I had never felt before and to make it worse I had to keep it to myself. I went through all the guilt of, I should be happy I have another healthy gorgeous boy on the way all whilst I was trying to come to terms with essentially losing my daughter. Ethically in Australia I could have legally chosen to abort this baby and as we only ever wanted 4 children and if I had aborted we could try again for a girl. It was before 12weeks and it was heavily affecting my mental health. In saying this although it did cross my mind as it was an option, I personally would never ever abort my baby he is still my baby and I love him with all my heart and I could never live with myself for doing something like that but I do know of couples using this option as it is the only form of gender selection available to them here in Australia. So the ultimate question we have to ask ourselves is: It is less ethical to abort a life already created or let couples chose the gender whilst it’s still just a clump of cells? The NIPT blood test enables couples to find out the gender of their unborn baby before 12weeks so has created a loop hole where couples can legally terminate the child of unwanted gender. We are progressive enough in this country to allow abortion but not gender selection for family balancing of usually large families?
The next few months I found myself really struggling and this is not something I am used to. I have never found having 3 kids hard I have always considered myself a natural mother, but I started falling into a form of depression. I was completely drowning and I couldn’t work out why. I started talking to a counsellor and eventually realised I was grieving but it was a hidden grief that I was even trying to hide from myself as I believed I wasn’t allowed to feel this. I wasn’t able to be a good mother, or wife or anything really.
I would avoid friends with daughters; I wouldn’t look directly at girls, no matter what age because looking at these girls I would find myself unconsciously imagining what she would be like. Would she have brown hair and eyes like me, or sandy blonde hair and green eyes like dad? Would she be smart and into study or more sporty? Would she be a girlie girl or more of a tom boy like me? I was trying to completely block this entire part of me out and it was literally killing me.
Eventually when I realised this is what was happening and my husband and I sat down and spoke about it all at great length as we had only ever planned on 4 children, so not only were we now looking at 5 we were looking to do it in a very scientific and risky and expensive way. Not a decision you make lightly. I do have a scientific background so making our little girl through IVF although not the way we ever thought we would it would give us our dream. My husband is religious but when he realised that if we continued to try naturally it would still likely be more boys and he could see the affect it was having on me. Mother Nature really wasn’t giving us a helping hand so science is our best option. We now plan to head over to the U.S. next year to get our little girl unless Australia changes the law here which we are really hoping they will. If we can go overseas and have it done why can we not have it done here?
Societies Arguments
1. Stereotyping
Some people say we are stereotyping her or creating this expectation of what a girl should be. I was a tom boy preferred cars and sports over dolls, make up and doing my hair. I rarely wore dresses and skirts and still don’t now. I like action movies over romantic comedies. I don’t care who she becomes just that she has a chance to become. I have always wanted to be a mother of a daughter not just a mother of only boys. People comment that I am lucky to have only boys as they are much easier, that I only have 4 penises’ to worry about not a million: Yes people do actually say this and to even my surprise it’s rather often! They simply just do not understand. For me none of this matters. What the future holds for her we do not know we hope she can forge her own path and become who and what she wants to be, the same wants and wishes I have for all my children. Comments like this though are stereotyping. She may like girls not boys just like one of my sons might like boys not girls. None of this matters to us. I have kept what dolls I did have as a little girl and my wedding dress and other odd things over my lifetime to give to her as I always just believed I would have a daughter one day. She may not want any of this but I will still give it to her for her to decide.
Before we decided to go ahead and travel to the U.S. to get our little girl, I was trying to come to terms with only ever being a mother in law. Most people don’t understand the gravity of this. Majority of women do not like their mother in laws. Having this faced upon me really opened my eyes to the unnecessary disrespect many women show their mother in laws. This now absolutely breaks my heart.
I will never get a chance to get excited about shopping for formal dresses or wedding dresses or suits if she prefers suits, these material things are not important. I will always be the mother in law when it comes to my grandchildren. My daughter and I might not be close so these kinds of things still might not happen but I will always be there for her as I would be my sons but when it comes to the grandkids the mother will majority of the time always turn to her own mother.
2. Playing God and Genoside
Some people say it’s playing god but In Australia will allow female gay couples or single women to use IVF to have a family. I think this is wonderful but this is along the same lines. These couples and women can’t have a baby naturally so we allow science to give them that baby they desire. My husband and I can’t have a daughter naturally so we want to turn to science to help us. Just as infertile couples can’t naturally have kids, if we want to enter into this argument god has decided for them to not naturally be able to have kids yet we now with science can help them achieve this. Again I do think this is absolutely wonderful but the playing god argument can’t be used as ultimately we already are.
Another argument against this is I hear often even by members of the NHMRC is that it opens it up for possible genoside where we start selecting for blonde hair and blue eyes etc. Besides the fact that this isn’t actually even scientifically possible yet the NHMRC has the ability to put strict laws into place to stop this kind of thing happening. The people usually extreme enough to want things like this will go to any length to achieve it and someone like Hitler comes to mind.

Scenarios for allowing Gender selection ART here in Australia based on the case studies outlined in the review
Case Study 1: Most couples who look to do ART gender selection are doing so to balance their big families. These big families are usually created as a result of that family trying to naturally conceive the baby of the desired gender. This in itself creates a strain on the health care system as its leading to bigger and bigger families. I have already greatly upset the gender balance by having 4 boys. Allowing it for families with 2 or more of the same gender already would be the best and most logical scenario.
Case Study 2: Allowing a family to have a child based on a particular gender as they tragically lost a daughter etc, this couple already having a daughter is likely to have one naturally again but If they then went on and had 2 boys and still no girl then they could turn to gender selection to have the little girl they long for. If they already have 2 boys then they already fall in the category anyway. Whilst we would all love to have a pigeon pair as 2 kids is exceptionally easier I personally don’t think family balancing comes into play until you have 2 or more children of one gender.
Case Study 3: Many couples each year already travel overseas for IVF/PGD gender selection for family balancing reasons. To allow these families to do it here in Australia will definitely reduce those risks associated with other Doctors and laboratories that aren’t required to follow the same high standards and practices set here in Australia. It will also help to keep the money here in Australia. As this is a complete personal choice no one that does it expects to have the government or health insurers pay for the PGD/IVF. Not only will it reduce the risks associated with the pregnancy and birth, by allowing the couple to choose a child of the gender they are longing for may stop them from continually trying for that gender resulting in increasingly larger family which will definitely impact the health care system.
Being able to do it here in Australia will also mean less disruption for those families. Traveling overseas for 2 weeks affects work and schooling, will also mean unknown babysitters to look after kids during medical procedures whilst overseas etc. All of this opens up more risks for the families involved.
Case Study 4: The daughter we conceived through ART would have never ever had a chance at life if we hadn’t gone down this path. To say that it then means their life is controlled from that point on is invalid. Parents that control a child’s life or a child that feels controlled would have done so or felt this way whether that child was conceived naturally or otherwise. Saying it was a result of being conceived through ART is just looking for something to blame. All children conceived through IVF could then use this argument. I will openly tell my daughter that’s how she was conceived and to me this will mean she will know how wanted and how special she actually is.
I have no expectations of what my daughter will turn out like. As with all my kids I hope I can help them become the men and women they want to be.
Conclusion
So In summary I think ART Gender selection should be available here in Australia under strict guidelines of family balancing for those families with 2 or more of the same gender. No Medicare or private health insurance should be required to cover the costs of the IVF/PGD. In allowing it here in Australia it will help to reduce the risks associated with conducting the IVF overseas in laboratories with lower standards than those set in Australia. It will also help to reduce the strain placed on the health care system by helping to limit the ever increasing family size of those families having more children in search of the desired gender.
Finally the biggest point that needs to be made is that it will stop the abortion of those unborn babies simply because they aren’t of the desired gender. Again is it less ethical to let a couple choose a baby based on Gender before the life is created or to allow them to destroy that life based on gender?

[Magical22]

Awesome great work mummabear!!


I'll have to start on my review!


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[MaaMaa]

I have submitted my own 4 page argument in favour of gender selection already. My brief summary at the end was as follows:


In summary:


My strong and personal belief on gender selection is that it should be available nation wide for all people who desire to access it. It would minimise medical risks in travelling overseas and receiving ineffective care, and also lower the risk of severe mental illness and suicide in the parent/s.
There is little evidence to suggest that family balancing would cause a discrepancy between the gender percentages in Australia. 
Not every couple who plans on a child would gender select. There would, in reality, be few who undertake the procedure, as shown by Dr. Potter's statistics.
 With strict guidelines and laws in place, gender selection could easily be implemented into the IVF structure and offered to patients. 
The technology to perform the procedure already exists, the only thing stopping it from proceeding are these Ethical guidelines.

I tried to be as professional as possible without using too much of my personal thoughts and feelings, instead using facts and the general consensus of some.

I hope many of us put forward something and help get the law changed!! I would love to see it legal in Australia.

[3boys531]

Getting my submission ready and I know there are girls not on the board doing theirs so hopefully we are heard this time.

[charcai]

thankyou Mummabear you've inspired me to do a submission. Im now 42y.o and although it may not happen for me in australia, i do hope it will help future couples out there one day to have it available in australia. We are going to usa in august for our gender selection and as excited as i am, i do have trepidation travelling such a long distance with 2 little girls, and driving on the other side of the road- and other little things because we are so faraway from home.

[LJ81]

You girls are amazing - excellent work! I've nearly finished my submission and my husband will do one as well.

[jontez]

I have completed my submission and now have everything crossed for a positive outcome this time round. Here is hoping this is a step closer to my own baby girl. :]

[Soontobe4]

Does anyone know when we will know the outcome? We are planning to go to the U.S next year, but if it became available here in the next couple of years I would just wait. Have my fingers and toes crossed!!

[3boys531]

Does anyone know when we will know the outcome? We are planning to go to the U.S next year, but if it became available here in the next couple of years I would just wait. Have my fingers and toes crossed!!

The last email I got said it should be 2016 that a decision will be made.

[bellebb]

i have one daughter, but i only want to have two children, so i am planning to go to us next year to do IUI or PGD for having a boy.
i really hope i can do it in Australia. it is so sad, i just see this post. i miss the chance of the submission.

[kayla]

hi ladys I have 2 beautiful boys that I love but I've been longing for a girl for a long time, the thought of never having a daughter just isn't an option, having friends with daughters makes me really upset because I want to have the chance to have that experience of both sex. I know if sex selection doesn't go head next year in Australia I will have no choice but to go to Thailand to get pgd done. I really hope it does go head because going to another country to get this does scares me but I know its something that I desire and will do whatever it takes. I think gender selection should be legal for family balancing for 2 or more of the same sex and hoping one day I will have a baby girl.

[Pretty Pink]

Hi ladies, I am new here, joined few days ago. I am also a Aussie mum swaying pink. Any news or updates on this? Is it likely to be approved?
TIA

[Little men]

My obgyn says there's no way Australia will allow it and apparently sart in Thailand have no longer an agreement with genea [emoji22][emoji22] I've just emailed sart today to try and find out how I can do pgd in Thailand but do the hormones here first... There's no way I can go to Thailand for 6 weeks.

[rubyroo83]

My obgyn says there's no way Australia will allow it and apparently sart in Thailand have no longer an agreement with genea [emoji22][emoji22] I've just emailed sart today to try and find out how I can do pgd in Thailand but do the hormones here first... There's no way I can go to Thailand for 6 weeks.

Thailand doesn't do it anymore. You can go to the usa. We will be gone for 15 days (husband 9, me 15).
I think it will be legal here but not for a year at least.
We don't want to wait that long.

[My2Sons]

You can still go to Thailand but it is more difficult to organise meds and monitoring now that Genea is no longer able to assist. Contact the clinic directly to find out more undoing you are interested.

[Little men]

Rubyroo83.. I so hope your right... What makes you think it will be legal??

[rubyroo83]

Rubyroo83.. I so hope your right... What makes you think it will be legal??

Can't go into details except to say friend's husband is a IVF specialist & so in the know.
Little men, I would be so so hesitant to go to Thailand, they have an unstable government and who knows what would happen to your embryos if they change the laws again.

[Little men]

When is the decision supposed to be announced?

[rubyroo83]

When is the decision supposed to be announced?

2016 but don't know when

[Magical22]

https://www.nhmrc.gov.au/health-ethics/ethical-issues/assisted-reproductive-technology-art/review-part-b-ethical-guidelines-c


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[Magical22]

Only 186 people submitted something for the review! apparently they met in Dec to discuss and are due to meet again early this year but it doesn't give a time frame.

They have tracker you can sign up too for updates on the matter.


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[boys2]

what is the general consenseses in regards to this? do u guys that there is a chance it will be past?

[Little men]

Considering we can't even get gay marriage passed, I doubt gender selection will!

[Magical22]

Very unlikely I think [emoji17]


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[rubyroo83]

Considering we can't even get gay marriage passed, I doubt gender selection will!

Sadly I think they will recommend it to be legal but it won't pass legislation.

[Little men]

Hey ladies, just thought I'd up date u... You can still go to sart in Thailand, it's not as widely advertised but they now work in conjunction with a ivf dr in Sydney but they won't tell you who until you give them all your details.

[mear1006]

Hey ladies, just thought I'd up date u... You can still go to sart in Thailand, it's not as widely advertised but they now work in conjunction with a ivf dr in Sydney but they won't tell you who until you give them all your details.

Thanks for the update little men. Are you currently going through this process? All the best :)

[Little men]

No I didn't end up needing to go. Unfortunately I have 2 autistic boys and 1 neuro typical so I can get it done here in Australia

[BrightSky]

Hey ladies, just thought I'd up date u... You can still go to sart in Thailand, it's not as widely advertised but they now work in conjunction with a ivf dr in Sydney but they won't tell you who until you give them all your details.

Good luck little men. That's interesting, I didn't think Thailand was an option anymore, are they just being extra discrete? Do u think it's a risk going there?

[Little men]

Yea it def is still available and they r careful not to disclose any info or confirm anything until they have all your details and checked you out. They ask for proof of Id etc. I don't see any risks going there, your monitored by a dr here in Sydney. Good luck

[BrightSky]

Thanks little men, I might look into it further when the time comes. Hrc is probably my first choice, but Thailand does seem a lot easier from Australia.

[purple]

There is a big headline 'Designer Babies' on the front of today's paper. I haven't read the full story but it is talking about allowing gender selection for your third child. I will read it when I get to work. I couldn't find it online yet.

[Magical22]

It's been all over the news this morning. Not saying much just whether it should happen


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[familymatters]

This popped up on my newsfeed today
IVF expert defends option for parents to choose sex of third child - ABC News (Australian Broadcasting Corporation) (http://www.abc.net.au/news/2016-07-25/ivf-expert-defends-parents-choice-childs-sex/7657540)
It's sounding really positive! At the bottom it says the NHRMC should have the report finalised by the end of the year. If it's for a third child, I wonder if I would qualify? I mean I already have a girl, but I also have two boys....

[BrightSky]

I've seen! Just posted on another thread about this! It seems like a fair interpretation of the law, esp if ppl are paying out of their own pocket, amazing if it does go through. Familymatters, I don't see how you would be any different from any one else wanting to balance their family :) I have to say, I would be shocked if it gets passed!

[familymatters]

I've seen! Just posted on another thread about this! It seems like a fair interpretation of the law, esp if ppl are paying out of their own pocket, amazing if it does go through. Familymatters, I don't see how you would be any different from any one else wanting to balance their family :) I have to say, I would be shocked if it gets passed!
I have gone back and forth between swaying and HT so many times in my head. We did a sway that ended in miscarriage, and afterwards I was convinced I wanted to go HT because the stress in my mind about whether the baby was a boy or girl drove me crazy. But HT overseas is just too hard. Oh my gosh if it was legalized here it would seriously be a dream come true! I'm on the LE diet now preparing for another sway attempt but now I'm not sure whether I should wait until the end of the year...

Does anyone know, if they do recommend legalizing PGD for gender selection, how long will this take to be put into action?

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[kc15880]

I wouldnt hold your breath - I have just gone through 11months of hell trying to apply to do IVF PGD gender selection for medical reasons (autism) & got denied even though it has been approved before in 2013. I doubt it will be passed in australia anytime soon for family balancing reasons

[Alias83]

My friend said she heard on the radio that they are legalising GS in Australia, but I have just searched online and can't find any articles, or anything on the nhmrc site that they have reached a decision.. Was she mistaken? I put a submission in last year, and it says the review will come to a decision in 2016 but they don't say when.. Has anyone else heard an update?

[Pink Pony]

I do hope it was true and that they give us an answer ASAP. I also did a submission.

[BrightSky]

Wow, really? I hadn't heard anything either, maybe she heard the laws were under review. Gee I hope she's right :pray:

[familymatters]

My friend said she heard on the radio that they are legalising GS in Australia, but I have just searched online and can't find any articles, or anything on the nhmrc site that they have reached a decision.. Was she mistaken? I put a submission in last year, and it says the review will come to a decision in 2016 but they don't say when.. Has anyone else heard an update?
I read on the NHRMC website that they weren't going to have a result until early 2017 now. Gosh they are SO unbelievably slow with this, considering they started taking submissions in 2015. What your friend probably heard was that they are considering legalizing it, not that they have. But I truly hope she's right!!

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[Little men]

I wouldnt hold your breath - I have just gone through 11months of hell trying to apply to do IVF PGD gender selection for medical reasons (autism) & got denied even though it has been approved before in 2013. I doubt it will be passed in australia anytime soon for family balancing reasons

Who did u go through? I know if someone that got it no problem! She's in nsw, went through genea I think.

[kc15880]

I was applying in wa :(

[Little men]

I head wa is stricter than sydney.... come here and do it

[IWANTAGIRLPLEASE]

So my FS has been informed that 2 Nov is when they meet again to discuss and finalize their decision..... has anyone else heard this??

[netti02]

So my FS has been informed that 2 Nov is when they meet again to discuss and finalize their decision..... has anyone else heard this??
Im not sure but it would be great if there is finally a yes or no answer. Of course there's still finalisations to be made but it may give me a choice rather than swaying again. Fingers X if i hear anything ill be sure to post

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[starsandglitter]

I'll be eagerly watching for some news. Hoping its approved as they have been discussing ie available for children with two or more of the same sex already.


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[IWANTAGIRLPLEASE]

Fingers, toes and everything crossed. Would be good to know where they stand.

[BrightSky]

Fingers crossed here and at the very least yes, it will be good to know where we stand so we can move on!

[BrightSky]

Anyone hear any news??!

[dancingdiva88]

Nothing that I've heard.

[IWANTAGIRLPLEASE]

I'm seeing my FS on Friday so I will ask him. It was him that told me that they were meeting so hopefully he knows more....

[dancingdiva88]

Hey Brightsky and Iwant, where abouts are you ladies? I'm on the Gold Coast.

[mear1006]

Awww fingers crossed he has some news Iwantagirlplease. Would just be nice to get a yes or no so we can either wait or just move on and make new plans.

[IWANTAGIRLPLEASE]

Totally agree. We just need to know an answer so we can move forward with plans!
I'm Brisbane!!!!!

[BrightSky]

I'm still looking into the U.S., but it would be an amazing surprise to get the news we might be able to do it here, I'm in Sydney dancingdiva!

[BrightSky]

Any word iwanta?

[IWANTAGIRLPLEASE]

Any word iwanta?

Negative. I asked him today and he said he hadn't heard anything.... more waiting .....

[BrightSky]

Negative. I asked him today and he said he hadn't heard anything.... more waiting .....

Oh well, thanks for the update anyway!! Definitely is a waiting game on this one..

[Little men]

http://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20161110/74f9900877ea4380aba93684af1ff706.png

[Little men]

Looks like we will be waiting for get a answer "sometime in 2017"

[IWANTAGIRLPLEASE]

Wow.... well to 'sought further advice' is better than a 'no approval'! Just a pain we all need to wait longer......

Good find little men! I was told they met 2 November so it's taken them over a week to post that!!!!!

[Magical22]

It's going to drag forever isn't it [emoji19]


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[starsandglitter]

It is Magical [emoji17] why do they have to wait so long between meetings!! Anyway nothing happening anytime soon unfortunately.


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[BrightSky]

I guess no news is good news :sigh: in the meantime I'm not sure what the trump win means for the Aussie dollar, hopefully travel to the US doesn't become too expensive

[rubyroo83]

I guess no news is good news :sigh: in the meantime I'm not sure what the trump win means for the Aussie dollar, hopefully travel to the US doesn't become too expensive
Should mean stronger Aussie dollar.
God that's so depressing they can't make up their mind.
Does it really harm anyone if families with 1 or more children of one gender want a child of the opposite?
I'm legally allowed to abort if it's the 'wrong' gender by saying I don't want a baby but we can't safely chose the gender?
I am so lucky we had enough money to go to the US & were successful first go but not everyone is.

[BrightSky]

Should mean stronger Aussie dollar.
God that's so depressing they can't make up their mind.
Does it really harm anyone if families with 1 or more children of one gender want a child of the opposite?
I'm legally allowed to abort if it's the 'wrong' gender by saying I don't want a baby but we can't safely chose the gender?
I am so lucky we had enough money to go to the US & were successful first go but not everyone is.

That's a little bit of good news if the dollar goes up. I will be amazed if it gets through, I think we have a long way to go here still.

[Kawazza]

Thanks for the update Little men. I've just been trying to find this info myself on the website but couldn't.

[Little men]

https://www.nhmrc.gov.au/health-ethics/ethical-issues/assisted-reproductive-technology-art/review-part-b-ethical-guidelines-c
It's still there, bottom of the page

[IWANTAGIRLPLEASE]

So apparently March is the next meeting and a decision will be made... according to my FS. Time will tell..... another few months to wait.

[mear1006]

So apparently March is the next meeting and a decision will be made... according to my FS. Time will tell..... another few months to wait.

Thanks for the update!! It's nice to know at least when they will meet.

I wonder if they do change the legislation if the Act and NT will start offering gender selection fairly quickly as they have no legislation about it. There seems to be a clinic in the ACT which is also very pro gender selection Fingers crossed .

Much easier to go on an Australian road trip rather than overseas.

[netti02]

Wow that may even be a possibility 🙂🙂 lets hope they stop dragging this out

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[BrightSky]

That would be so amazing.. I've even been wanting a trip to Canberra. March still seems so far away :(

[Violet Winter]

Following for any updates. :)

[emshe]

lets cross our fingers

[Kawazza]

So apparently March is the next meeting and a decision will be made... according to my FS. Time will tell..... another few months to wait.

Oh I so hope so, that would be perfect. they have dragged this out. Eagerly waiting for March. Thanks for the update


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[Bananagirl]

Anyone know any more details about when they are meeting? How long after a meeting do they hand their recommendations down?


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[emshe]

Anyone know any more details about when they are meeting? How long after a meeting do they hand their recommendations down?


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Im eagerly wondering too!

[starsandglitter]

Im eagerly wondering too!


I think it's soon as there was an increase in media coverage in Feb and I believe some more media coverage this coming week so it's soon. Fingers crossed for all of us!


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[MiaMelb]

Not sure either but agree there seems to be a few related articles popping up around the place. I don't hold out much hope of any real progess on gender selection here in Aust unfortunately.

[Soontobe4]

Really not holding much hope for them to decide by the end of the month. It's been dragging on for so long.

[netti02]

Im hoping the dragging on is because they have had to finalise everything and that its officially legal and done with. Way too long to make a decision. Though i read who was on the panel 😐

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[emshe]

Oh oh the panel doesn't sound too promising then!?


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[netti02]

Not really. A few people who were no longer working. Some seemed involved with alot of things i thought conflicted the research panel, it just didn't seem convincing for a positive outcome.

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[emshe]

Such a shame, i hope we're all pleasantly surprised


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[Soontobe4]

Oh really :( Guess we will just keep waiting and see what they decide on.

[Chloepink]

So apparently March is the next meeting and a decision will be made... according to my FS. Time will tell..... another few months to wait.

Please let us know if there's any update! Am really hoping to do HT this yr, would be amazing if this somehow gets changed in a good way for us!

[louil]

I am hanging for an update as well. We are planning to travel to america next year, but if it was available here that would be amazing!!!! Surely it must be soon - I wonder if it's approved how long it will take before we can access it. Anyway getting ahead of myself, but I can't help but feel a little bit excited!!

[Pinky3]

I am anxiously waiting on hearing the results too. I think it will be my only way to convince my husband to do it and go a third. To travel os i doubt he will go for it. I have convinced myself that it will be passed! Do you think if they approve it it will then take yesrs for law to be passed or will it take effect straight away?

[MiaMelb]

I am anxiously waiting on hearing the results too. I think it will be my only way to convince my husband to do it and go a third. To travel os i doubt he will go for it. I have convinced myself that it will be passed! Do you think if they approve it it will then take yesrs for law to be passed or will it take effect straight away?

On the very slim chance that the changes are approved I cant believe that it would become legal across Aust anytime soon, pollies dragging their feet and all. I'm hoping that if the changes happen maybe one state might legalise it quicker than others and could maybe travel interstate for it (NSW did have gender selection legal for a short period of time I think so maybe they might be quicker to implement).

[MiaMelb]

I am anxiously waiting on hearing the results too. I think it will be my only way to convince my husband to do it and go a third. To travel os i doubt he will go for it. I have convinced myself that it will be passed! Do you think if they approve it it will then take yesrs for law to be passed or will it take effect straight away?

On the very slim chance that the changes are approved I cant believe that it would become legal across Aust anytime soon, pollies dragging their feet and all. I'm hoping that if the changes happen maybe one state might legalise it quicker than others and could maybe travel interstate for it (NSW did have gender selection legal for a short period of time I think so maybe they might be quicker to implement).

[giraffes]

Has anyone heard anything recently about when the decision will be out?

[Violet Winter]

Ok, so March is over. Does anyone know if the meeting happened?? Anxiously waiting for any updates.

[netti02]

No. There's no further information. They are just dragging this out. It's hard to imagine it would be approved

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[emshe]

Frustrating!

[Violet Winter]

:sad: I wish they'd just hurry up and make up their minds.

[MiaMelb]

Unfortunately this isn't likely to be a case of "no news is good news".

[starsandglitter]

https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20170403/ee5377d65c6eb256c6cf762a95ace1bf.jpg

This was the latest update which is nothing new but thought I'd repost. I think there is a bit going on in the background from what I've heard but no date for announcement.


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[Violet Winter]

Thanks starsandglitter. I keep checking their website for updates. Looks like we're to keep waiting:sigh:

[Little men]

https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20170420/38e5a00e932a6118dcb9c307e0474024.jpg

[Little men]

[emoji24] looks like they are not allowing it.

[Little men]

https://www.nhmrc.gov.au/_files_nhmrc/file/guidelines/ethics/_summary_of_major_revisions.pdf

[netti02]

Yep. It looks like NSW would need to legislate the practice separately (who knows how and when) and after that those who offered gender selection would not risk there accreditation.

So whilst its not a complete 'no' im not sure what the next step is for NSW legislation.

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[louil]

This is so disappointing

[emshe]

What a shame

[Kawazza]

Oh no, Im gutted

[starsandglitter]

Disappointing but I think there's still hope in NSW as we have a number of clinics and FS that support it so perhaps they will push forward but who knows the timing.


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[Violet Winter]

This is such heartbreaking news. :( I don't understand how someone can abort an undesired gender but choosing a desired gender is unethical. What a load of shit!!

[netti02]

Exactly violet winter. Makes you wonder

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[Violet Winter]

If they had allowed gender selection to couples with 3 or more of the one gender all of their reasons against it would mean nothing. And if anything it would've boosted family sizes.

[BrightSky]

It's ridiculous, but not unexpected. It does seem to leave it a bit open to individual states though? Maybe a glimmer of hope for the future?

[Chloepink]

IVF gender selection could be possible for Australian parents (http://www.news.com.au/lifestyle/parenting/pregnancy/gender-selection-ivf-ban-continued-in-australia-but-states-could-overrule/news-story/f096899cd8be5ba8245a5ec7d600714c)

Not in our reproductive lifetime it seems... (that headline is so totally misleading!!)

[BrightSky]

It's totally crazy.. decades until it might be a possibility?! I just don't understand why society gets to have such a say in my reproductive liberty

[Violet Winter]

So it looks like I'm planning a trip to the US later in the year with 3 little boys. Something I'm not looking forward to. :(

[BrightSky]

Violet Winter looks like your 2 youngest boys are my boys ages, we are planning on going over later in the year too. I'm dreading the plane, but think the holiday will be fun!!


So it looks like I'm planning a trip to the US later in the year with 3 little boys. Something I'm not looking forward to. :(

[MiaMelb]

IVF gender selection could be possible for Australian parents (http://www.news.com.au/lifestyle/parenting/pregnancy/gender-selection-ivf-ban-continued-in-australia-but-states-could-overrule/news-story/f096899cd8be5ba8245a5ec7d600714c)

Not in our reproductive lifetime it seems... (that headline is so totally misleading!!)

"This is the pace of social change" - as always, Australia will move at a snails pace. So disappointing.

[Violet Winter]

:worry:
Violet Winter looks like your 2 youngest boys are my boys ages, we are planning on going over later in the year too. I'm dreading the plane, but think the holiday will be fun!!

I'm dreading the plane ride too especially if I'm full of hormones. :worry:

[dancingdiva88]

How expensive is the procedure in the US roughly?

[louil]

Its around 15,500 according to the information gender selection Australia sent me a few months ago. Although I'm not sure if that's us or Aus dollars.

We are thinking of heading to america in june next year although my hubby is having second thoughts and I'm starting to worry about my age. I will be 36 next June. How old is everyone who is considering going? There is so much to think about, it's all quite overwhelming

[dancingdiva88]

God, so much money! Then to add flights and accommodation on top of that too....and the egg may not even implant properly or you miscarry or something. Hope that's also not US dollars :/

[Magical22]

Its around 15,500 according to the information gender selection Australia sent me a few months ago. Although I'm not sure if that's us or Aus dollars.

We are thinking of heading to america in june next year although my hubby is having second thoughts and I'm starting to worry about my age. I will be 36 next June. How old is everyone who is considering going? There is so much to think about, it's all quite overwhelming

Yes that's US dollars so about $20,700 Aus at the moment, not including your drugs or dr appts back here. Then plus flights, accommodation, car hire, spending money etc.


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[BrightSky]

Its around 15,500 according to the information gender selection Australia sent me a few months ago. Although I'm not sure if that's us or Aus dollars.

We are thinking of heading to america in june next year although my hubby is having second thoughts and I'm starting to worry about my age. I will be 36 next June. How old is everyone who is considering going? There is so much to think about, it's all quite overwhelming

Hi louil, I'll be 36 end of this year, planning on going over bit before then. I think u will get a good idea of your chances through pretesting. Yes, it's not cheap, a lot to consider indeed!

[starsandglitter]

Its around 15,500 according to the information gender selection Australia sent me a few months ago. Although I'm not sure if that's us or Aus dollars.

We are thinking of heading to america in june next year although my hubby is having second thoughts and I'm starting to worry about my age. I will be 36 next June. How old is everyone who is considering going? There is so much to think about, it's all quite overwhelming

That's US pricing, you also need to add meds on to that unless you can find a FS in Aus to write the scripts for you.

I'll be 36 this August so time isn't really on my side either [emoji17]


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[Violet Winter]

Hi ladies, looks like we are all of similar age. I will be turning 36 in August. I will be breastfeeding my youngest for a few more months then hope to go for pretesting. It is a lot of money and age isn't on my side either but I will forever regret it if I didn't try.

[BrightSky]

Hi ladies, looks like we are all of similar age. I will be turning 36 in August. I will be breastfeeding my youngest for a few more months then hope to go for pretesting. It is a lot of money and age isn't on my side either but I will forever regret it if I didn't try.

Violet Winter, I've just weaned and waiting for everything to go back to normal, then will start pretesting, looking to go over Oct/Nov. That will mean just under a two year gap between the youngest 2, which makes me a bit nervous, but then again it might not work first go, so the gap could be bigger..

[BrightSky]

Hi ladies, looks like we are all of similar age. I will be turning 36 in August. I will be breastfeeding my youngest for a few more months then hope to go for pretesting. It is a lot of money and age isn't on my side either but I will forever regret it if I didn't try.

Violet Winter, I've just weaned and waiting for everything to go back to normal, then will start pretesting, looking to go over Oct/Nov. That will mean just under a two year gap between the youngest 2, which makes me a bit nervous, but then again it might not work first go, so the gap could be bigger..

[Violet Winter]

Hi BrightSky, your name is familiar. I think we may have been due date buddies july/ august sept 2016??

A little under 2 year age gap isn't too bad and from my experience my eldest two are a great help.

I breastfed my others for 10-11 months and plan to do the same for my youngest. He's nearly 9months. Trying to introduce a bottle feed once a day but he's not getting it. :(

Maybe we should open a new forum for us Aussie Mums planning to travel to the US in 2017/2018

[louil]

Hi BrightSky, your name is familiar. I think we may have been due date buddies july/ august sept 2016??

A little under 2 year age gap isn't too bad and from my experience my eldest two are a great help.

I breastfed my others for 10-11 months and plan to do the same for my youngest. He's nearly 9months. Trying to introduce a bottle feed once a day but he's not getting it. :(

Maybe we should open a new forum for us Aussie Mums planning to travel to the US in 2017/2018

Great idea, let's start a new forum! I think having some other ladies to talk to on this journey would be so good.

We used IVF for our second son which im due to have soon, so I have some idea how I responded to drugs. I also have a fairly low ovarian reserve. We ended up with four embryos and the second one worked, so no idea what sex the last two are or even if they are abnormal or normal. So I guess we will have to risk leaving those and try our luck in America.

[BrightSky]

Hi BrightSky, your name is familiar. I think we may have been due date buddies july/ august sept 2016??

A little under 2 year age gap isn't too bad and from my experience my eldest two are a great help.

I breastfed my others for 10-11 months and plan to do the same for my youngest. He's nearly 9months. Trying to introduce a bottle feed once a day but he's not getting it. :(

Maybe we should open a new forum for us Aussie Mums planning to travel to the US in 2017/2018

I'd be in on a new forum too!! I breastfed my first for 9 months and this one for 8.. He was refusing the bottle too, I've started working again and need him to take it when I'm not there and was trying to do mornings and nights but it was too hard, he was getting too confused. I've stopped completely and now he takes 4x250ml a day very happily. It's been over 2 weeks since I last feed and I'm still getting milk!! Think it's going to take a while for things to go back to normal this time!
I'm not sure if I posted in due dates.. maybe trying to conceive forums??

[Bananagirl]

We are looking to go to the US early next year also, we are Australian, but will be living in England then. Did someone start a new group?


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[Girlthing]

Hi Aussie ladies, I'm currently looking into PGD to try for a girl after two lovely naturally conceived boys. I'm in Sydney and just wondered what others are doing at the moment with the recent disappointing NHMRC decision? Are people still cycling at SART or is that pretty much out now? I don't think we can afford the US unfortunately and my husband would never agree to that level of travel and expense. We need to get onto it though, not getting any younger.

We are actually British and considering a move back there so Cyprus or Czech Republic possibly also an option. Thanks for any thoughts!

[Girlthing]

Sorry all, didn't realise I'd posted publicly so please feel free to message me or let me know if I can message you. Thanks so much!

[BrightSky]

Hi Aussie ladies, I'm currently looking into PGD to try for a girl after two lovely naturally conceived boys. I'm in Sydney and just wondered what others are doing at the moment with the recent disappointing NHMRC decision? Are people still cycling at SART or is that pretty much out now? I don't think we can afford the US unfortunately and my husband would never agree to that level of travel and expense. We need to get onto it though, not getting any younger.

We are actually British and considering a move back there so Cyprus or Czech Republic possibly also an option. Thanks for any thoughts!

Hi Girlthing. Yes, I dont think there will be an resolution on GS here anytime soon unfortunately! Even though it's not as popular I do believe people are still cycling at SART - maybe someone will chime in. I am in the same boat as you, 2 wonderful little boys, only want one more, so have decided to bite the bullet and go to HRC in the US. Im also not getting any younger so want to give this the best shot we can. We are also looking forward to making it a family holiday. I've completed pretesting, which was relatively easy and I've had great help here from IVF Australia. Im not sure about Cyprus or Czech - I dont think Czech Republic openly offer GS anymore, which makes it a bit tricky. If you post outside of this thread as it's mainly Aussies someone might be able to advise you better!!! Good luck with whatever you decide!!!

[frankie2017]

Hi Aussie ladies, I'm currently looking into PGD to try for a girl after two lovely naturally conceived boys. I'm in Sydney and just wondered what others are doing at the moment with the recent disappointing NHMRC decision? Are people still cycling at SART or is that pretty much out now? I don't think we can afford the US unfortunately and my husband would never agree to that level of travel and expense. We need to get onto it though, not getting any younger.

We are actually British and considering a move back there so Cyprus or Czech Republic possibly also an option. Thanks for any thoughts!

People are def still cycling at SART yep. They sound really good to deal with. Responsive to email too.


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