Recurrent MCs and 5 mg of folic...?

[SweetLily]

So i was at my dr today and discussed my recurrent mcs (am at 5 now in 2 years, with 4 healthy kids). I turn 35 in 2 weeks so she told me I need to start taking 5 mg of folic every day. I admit to being a bit freaked by that--I have read too much FA can cause tumors etc. We want to sway girl in a few months. I started prenatals and omegas, i hope to get 3 months in before we ttc.

Does anyone else have any suggestions on what else can be done?

And is 5 mg ok? Does anyone know if it may help? I tried to research it but found nothing really--everything related to something else, not recurrent mcs.

Thanks!

[Hobbermittens]

Hey Sweetlily! I have only heard that folic acid is suspected to contribute to prostate cancer. I don't think there is any actual info that it causes anything. My dad is a doctor, and he said that he didn't recoomend that my DH take too much because of some studies, again about prostates, which we ladies don't have. But I haven't been reading medical journals, so don't quote me on any of that. Still, I am taking a ton of it for my sway (2400mcg a day).

[SweetLily]

Hobber, does it sway BOY???? Eek, i already have 3 of those! Dh and I so want a girl!!!

Still, isn't 5 mg like 5000 mcg? that seems crazy, tho I do know of someone else taking that much for NTD...but I have no history fo that (unless all those failed from neural tube defects!)

My dr today sent me in for a bunch of tests and my US results are still pending...go back friday and hope for some answers. a day 21 progesterone is supposed to be 3 dpo right? NO! 7 dpo!!! Lol, losing my mind. Too much going on....

I guess I better look up that folic and swaying. I really dont want another boy...well, i would be happy for him but I really want a girl...but healthy is even MORE important. thoughts on that? Thanks and hugs sweetie!

[lindi]

Have you had any hormone tests done?

[michaela]

The amount of colic acid is fine and you will just pee out any excess that your body doesn't use. I have seen people take a ton of it so that part is fine.

Have you had 5 miscarriages in a row or did you have kids between the miscarriages? Also how far along were you when the miscarriages occured?

[LolaInLove]

Hey girl! I was gonna email you back all this info, but I might as well post it here for others to read. I'll email you back anyway, of course!

So, I had these tests, which all came back perfect: FSH, thyroid, prolactin, progesterone, diabetes (she just wanted to check because of my weight gain....which is from BOY DIET and not diabetes, ugh), and a panel of blood clotting disorders.

After my 2nd m/c, I asked a friend who is a genetic counselor what I should do, and she said get tested for the clotting factors. This is the lowdown on those: there are 8 total that they test for, and 3 of them are aquired, 5 are inherited. My doctor only wanted to test me for the 3 aquired disorders, since I've obviously successfully had 2 children, I clearly didn't have any inherited ones, those would have been from birth and I would have never been able to get pg.

1. Protein C Antigen (I)
2. Antinuclear Antibodies (A)
3. Anticardiolipin Antibodies (A)
4. Factor V Leiden (I)
5. MTHFR (I)
6. Lupus Anticoagulant (A)
7. Prothrombin Gene DNA Analysis (I)
8. Antithrombin Deficiency Profile (I)

And I will warn you, these tests are VERY expensive and are considered infertility, so my insurance didn't cover all of it.

We didn't have an SA done yet, because my DH has gotten me pg three times already...my doc doesn't think he has sperm issues.....except possible one: since my 2 other kids are from the ex, and my current DH and I don't have any kids yet, she said there is a *possibility* that he has a chromosomal issue called a balanced translocation. This means that although his chromosomes work and do not make him retarded in any way, there is an extra "arm" from one that is stuck on another....something that again, doesn't affect him, but affects the sperm. His sperm couldn't make a complete chromosome with my egg, all of them would be abnormal, no matter what. Since my DH has no children anywhere, it is possible. The only way to check would be to do a gene/DNA karotype on him, which is like $800 out of pocket, so we are holding off on that. She said it's a possibility, although not what she thinks is the problem.

My doc really thinks that we just had crap luck twice in a row. I give my DH everything under the sun for healthy sperm, and I take a slew of supps and whatnot for egg health. I'm on my second round of Clomid also. My doc knows I ovulate, but she thinks it is worth a shot for a few months on the lowest dose to see if the Clomid helps me put out a "better" egg.

SweetLily, I don't think there is anything wrong with taking 5mg of folic. Isn't your last child or two from your current DH, if memory serves? So he wouldn't have any sperm or gene issues if so.

I would get tested for the stuff I did, just to check.....no one really knows why some have recurrent m/c, after they rule out everything. For us, I am going to wait till we jump into heavy expensive stuff, mostly because I owe a bunch for my testing and u/s from before since my insurance doesn't cover infertility. If we get pg and have another m/c, I will likely go ahead and have him do the karotype.

LOTS OF LOVE, hun. XXOO I am so sorry, I didn't know you have had so many!!!!

[XXdreaming]

5mg is fine, lots of people who have ntd in their family or even had a child with ntd take 5mg of FA, if you take it and dont need it then you just pee the rest out and folic acid doesnt sway, if you want you can do 4mgs that seems to be a more comfortable amount for people, vit E is good to help implantation and help with the inside of the egg growing but vit E does sway boy! sorry for your losses :(

[michaela]

Lola make sure you have these tests run through an re so they can examine it all in the grand scheme of things. I have had all these tests done and you are right it is extremely expensive! The karyotyping should not be that much out of pocket. I would call Reprosource and ask for their prices as I believe we only paid $350 for each of us to do it not $800 each. I just know that there are very few RE's that understand the immune stuff so make sure you get those results analyzed by someone who knows a ton about them. That is of course if you decide to go through with doing it. :)

I would also add the full HLA panel to your list and all the stuff related to natural killer cells.


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[LolaInLove]

Michaela, thanks for the advice! I am on the fence about what my next steps are.....whether it's time to just give it up and move on, or time to go to an RE, even though we'd only be going natural. This whole ttc thing is just so hard for me because we don't have the money to go HT in any way. I bet we could afford an IUI or two, but definitely not IVF. So I feel like it's natural or nothing for us.

Not to pry, but did they ever find anything that is the "problem" with you and your DH? I see you are using a gestation surrogate, which is great! I'll check out your blog.

[LolaInLove]

WOW, your blog is great! That vimeo clip made me cry!!!!!!! So now I know why you suggested those other tests....I will certainly ask my doc about that! I guess I have the same problem as a lot of poeple, my health insurance doesn't cover infertility. So although my doctor codes my tests for "uterine bleeding" and "weight gain" and all sorts of stuff, my insurance still only covers portions of it.

I am really optimistic for you with the surrogate, Michaela! What an awesome story. I hope you post about that journey here soon. I'll follow your blog also.

Sorry to crash your post, Sweetlily!!! (;

[michaela]

Michaela, thanks for the advice! I am on the fence about what my next steps are.....whether it's time to just give it up and move on, or time to go to an RE, even though we'd only be going natural. This whole ttc thing is just so hard for me because we don't have the money to go HT in any way. I bet we could afford an IUI or two, but definitely not IVF. So I feel like it's natural or nothing for us.

Not to pry, but did they ever find anything that is the "problem" with you and your DH? I see you are using a gestation surrogate, which is great! I'll check out your blog. IUI's are pretty cheap, usually around $500 but that all depends on the RE. I would probably see an RE just to see how they could help you. Maybe it is something as simple as needing Clomid or using HCG as a trigger shot to help you time things. Even if you used a small amount of injections to help with ovulation it wouldn't be that expensive and may save you lots of heartache. Nobody will force you to do IVF or an IUI if you see an RE but since you have been trying for so long I think it would be beneficial for you to see one.

Beyond the blocked tubes, yes it is most likely an autoimmune issue. I have several of them. LOL!


WOW, your blog is great! That vimeo clip made me cry!!!!!!! So now I know why you suggested those other tests....I will certainly ask my doc about that! I guess I have the same problem as a lot of poeple, my health insurance doesn't cover infertility. So although my doctor codes my tests for "uterine bleeding" and "weight gain" and all sorts of stuff, my insurance still only covers portions of it.

I am really optimistic for you with the surrogate, Michaela! What an awesome story. I hope you post about that journey here soon. I'll follow your blog also.

Sorry to crash your post, Sweetlily!!! (;My insurance doesn't cover a dime of infertility stuff either so I feel you on that one. It is so hard going through this spending outrageous amounts of money! Most insurance covers diagnostic testing so unless they give you a reason for your infertility most of the tests will be covered. Obviously it depends on your insurance but it is something you may want to look into. It will either be worth it and save you lots of heartache trying month after month after month or it won't tell you much and you could be right back to where you started. I totally understand not knowing what to do and I feel for you in that area.

Thanks for the encouragement! We are very excited and I hope that you will get that BFP soon!!

[atomic sagebrush]

So i was at my dr today and discussed my recurrent mcs (am at 5 now in 2 years, with 4 healthy kids). I turn 35 in 2 weeks so she told me I need to start taking 5 mg of folic every day. I admit to being a bit freaked by that--I have read too much FA can cause tumors etc. We want to sway girl in a few months. I started prenatals and omegas, i hope to get 3 months in before we ttc.

Does anyone else have any suggestions on what else can be done?

And is 5 mg ok? Does anyone know if it may help? I tried to research it but found nothing really--everything related to something else, not recurrent mcs.

Thanks!

The best evidence seems to indicate that can't hurt and almost certainly helps prevent birth defects. I had a baby with a neural tube defect and then I took 4 mg of folic for the first tri of my 4th pg and my next baby did not have the defect. You tend to just urinate out the excess that your body doesn't need.

Yes, there is a link between tumors and folic acid, BUT it is most likely in cancers that are already there and growing, it just makes them grow faster (which may actually be a good thing if you caught them sooner.). Also, it may very well be that the high folic intake has to be for a long period of time and not just for a few months.

The question is, are your miscarriages caused by NTDs or not?? There is no way to know that really. In all honesty, doctors know very little about why some pg are miscarried, and I actually think your doc is being pretty smart and proactive in making the suggestion. Folic has also been linked to possibly preventing/reducing rates of Down's Syndrome, which may mean that it is helpful for other stuff as well, aside from NTD.

Re - swaying. It doesn't matter whether it sways pink, blue, or plaid, because if you can't get/stay pregnant, you have no chances at your DG. We don't know if it sways or not. The reason why blue swayers take high doses of folic is not because it sways, but because the TTC boy diet and some of the supplements they are on, are highly depleting of folic acid, so high folic intake is mandatory for blue swayers.

[atomic sagebrush]

Michaela, thanks for the advice! I am on the fence about what my next steps are.....whether it's time to just give it up and move on, or time to go to an RE, even though we'd only be going natural. This whole ttc thing is just so hard for me because we don't have the money to go HT in any way. I bet we could afford an IUI or two, but definitely not IVF. So I feel like it's natural or nothing for us.

Not to pry, but did they ever find anything that is the "problem" with you and your DH? I see you are using a gestation surrogate, which is great! I'll check out your blog.

OMFG MICHAELA!!! Geesh I go on a Facebreak for a couple months and I am missing EVERYTHING!!!

I am so happy and excited for you!!! :pray: and crossing everything I have for you guys!!!!!

[michaela]

...

[LolaInLove]

Michaela, thanks again for all the advice! I have been on 50mg of Clomid for 2 months now, so DH and I are thinking it's time for the SA, even if he has gotten me pg before (my daughers are from a previous marriage, but the 2 m/c are from current DH, so he/we have no live children). I am going to ask my doc for a referral to an RE, and you are right, it can't hurt to open the door. DH and I even talked about using our tax return to have some of my eggs frozen right now if we have to and saving up for a few years....right now my ovaries are working, but ya know, they may slow down by the time we could afford IVF!

Anyway, I can't wait to read about your upcoming journey!!!! I will also be keeping you in my prayers....it's GONNA WORK!

Sweetlily, again....sorry for thread crashing, but I think Atomic is right on, you should totally take the folic and not worry about it. I take about 2000 mcg a day myself, and I give it to DH also. Honey, I am so sorry you are dealing with all of that! Ya know, everyone loves to tell me their "I know someone who had X m/c and now has a healthy baby" story, and I've heard several recently that were at 5.....so keep your hope alive....all we can do, right?