Hello there ... 40 year old, two boys, Vasectomy Reversal ahead of us.

[Sweetplum]

Hello all.
I’m a 40 year old mommy with two amazing boys ages 4 & 2. My husband had a vasectomy about 13 months ago after we went through some serious health issues as a family. Now that we have fully emerged from a real low point I have been feeling depressed about our decision to snip. DH is entertaining the idea of a third child (he’s very selfless and I am incredible grateful for him listening to me) and we have appointments with my OB and his urologist set up in the next few weeks.

Assuming we are given the thumbs up for another chance I would really like a daughter.

With my boys, from what I can tell, I was swaying pretty traditional boys.
1. Big breakfast (cereal and milk)
2. Not much exercise
3. HE
4. Not much junk food but lots of salt (I have low blood pressure so I tend to be OK with adding salt to food and crave it)

We DTD every day from last day of period through O day with both boys and got preg on first try.

I’m wondering if anyone has tips for me if I start this journey…here is my plan:

Supplements:
Prenatal (I don’t feel comfortable not taking one)
Cal & Mag
Cranberry
Rasp and Peppermint Tea
Omega 3 (just take for baby’s health)

Diet:
Skip breakfast or dinner (12 hour fast each day)
Lots of dairy
Low sodium
LE
lots of veggies
diet caffiene free soda
crystal light
decaf coffee
tea

Lifestyle:
Lots of cardio (I’m fairly fit and in good shape but I would like to slim down so hope to lose 10 lbs or so)....this will be hard with my busy work and family schedule but I plan to run in the mornings (I used to run 5-10 miles each AM before the boys).

DTD:
Every 4 days after Period until 4 days before OV.


If anyone has advice related to my age and the VR factor I would love to hear.
Also – my hubby eats a lot of red meat / salt – how important is it for me to get him to change this and for how long prior to DTD? Hubby is 36.

Thanks all, I really look forward to meeting some ladies on here and supporting one another.
:cheerteam:
Sweetplum

[mommymachine]

Welcome! Atomic will have lots of good advice for you!!

[maidentomother]

Welcome! I strongly, strongly recommend you cut out ALL the supps you listed. Most sway blue and pepp tea I wouldn't mess with at your age. The prenatal & omega 3 are such strong blue swayers especially, and as soon as you get a BFP you can start taking those. You really DONT need them in advance.

I would just drink coffee, NO tea, it seems to sway blue. If possible, caffeinated coffee is likely superior for pink. I wouldn't recommend 'lots' of dairy, it's nutrient rich and sways blue. I would NOT worry about limiting sodium, it doesn't sway and is a bad idea for you in particular. High salt may even sway pink. If possible, go vegetarian.

Having conceived 2 boys easily past age 35 you are most likely very 'set' to have boys and so I would be strict in terms of diet/nutritients. The rest of your sway sounds great. If DH can do the diet with you, that's great but don't delay based on that. What you do matters most.

[Sweetplum]

Welcome! I strongly, strongly recommend you cut out ALL the supps you listed. Most sway blue and pepp tea I wouldn't mess with at your age. The prenatal & omega 3 are such strong blue swayers especially, and as soon as you get a BFP you can start taking those. You really DONT need them in advance.

I would just drink coffee, NO tea, it seems to sway blue. If possible, caffeinated coffee is likely superior for pink. I wouldn't recommend 'lots' of dairy, it's nutrient rich and sways blue. I would NOT worry about limiting sodium, it doesn't sway and is a bad idea for you in particular. High salt may even sway pink. If possible, go vegetarian.

Having conceived 2 boys easily past age 35 you are most likely very 'set' to have boys and so I would be strict in terms of diet/nutritients. The rest of your sway sounds great. If DH can do the diet with you, that's great but don't delay based on that. What you do matters most.

Thank you maidentomother! This is extremely interesting. I thought I had a grasp on the whole girl diet/supplement thing but apparently I'm totally off.
OK. SO basically the LE diet is low in all nutrients. So let's say I just drank coffee (half decaf half reg or full caffienated), 3-4 Coke Zeros/day, worked out a lot and ate two or three light veggie meals per day (simple things like snap peas, carrots, lettuce, cucumber, peppers) and eggs, nuts and a bit of fat free greek yogurt....would this be considered a girl sway? Any specific foods to 100% stay away from. What about chocolate? What about a calorie range? I can track cals if necessary with MFD.

What supplements would you reco? If any?

Oh what about alcohol. I'd love a beer or wine a few nights a week? Is this OK?

Thank you!

[maidentomother]

Many of your ideas are outdated swaying concepts that we've since learned don't work. Unfortunately though the rest of the inteenet/world of swaying has yet to catch up! This site is much more scientifically rigorous in its approach.

The foods you outlined are great! Though you can and probably SHOULD have some fullfat dairy in moderation, just try to get the bulk of your fat intake from pink friendly polyunsaturated plant fats (like soy & canola oil, safflower and sunflower oil). It is just important to stick to the dietary minimums as the maximums (30-60g fat, 40-60g protein, 1200-1800 cals). What you should aim for depends on your height and weight. If you are smaller stick to the lower end, bigger to the upper end.

There are few foods to avoid entirely. Though oats, fortified cereal (and any other highly fortified products like many protein bars and energy drinks), red meat, green tea and dark chocolate should be consumed rarely and in small amounts if at all. I'd limit coconut oil, olive oil and butter, but not as much as the aforementioned. Milk & white chocolate are fine if kept in your daily totals and consumed in moderation. Lowcal veggies are FREE, you don't need to count them, eat as much as you like. Only count higher cal veg like potatoes, squash, sweet potato, corn etc. But those are good for pink too, as well as nuts, legumes, and tofu in moderation.

The only supps I'd recommend are 1000-1400mcg folate (required), fibre (any type without added nutrients) before fatty/nutritious meals, and maybe ubiquinol for you and Olive Leaf Extract (up tp 1500mg daily) and maybe also Licorice Root (read up on it a bit here to decide of appropriate) for DH.

Alcohol consumption on both your parts, but especially yours, is great for pink! Drink anything you like (though possibly light beer/white wine/spirits are better than more nutrient rich dark beer/red wine) just make sure you drink WITH meals not between and count the cals.

[Sweetplum]

Thank you madientomother! Such great insights.

[Sweetplum]

I just posted this as a separate thread. More details on my struggle...any insights would be so wonderful. Thank you!
http://genderdreaming.com/forum/later-moms/53201-so-conflicted-sad.html#post792201

[maidentomother]

I take it even saving money by swaying wouldn't help much with the private school issue, bc it's a 3rd child that's too much cost?

You seem like a wonderful person and I really feel for your struggle. Let's hope the site can help you reach the best decision for you for you to achieve your desired outcome. It's a great community here!

[atomic sagebrush]

I would reduce the prenatals to 3x a week if you can't bear to give them up. Same with Omega 3.

At 40, the rules are different for you than others. I would not use pep tea for you at all, cuts odds of conception too far.

I do not recomend cranberry for ANYONE due to safety. I'd give hubby olive leaf extract but wait til after surgery and recovery to begin with that.

Calcium has been proven to contribute to cardiovascular disease and I think it sways blue anyway. I usually leave it to the individual to decide on that, but over 40 it makes me nervous due to the heart disease aspect of it all.

Rasp. tea I am on the fence about. It may sway blue, and it may mess up your cycle too for some people so unless you think you really need it, I'd skip it.

VERY IMPORTANT - do not have a 4 day cutoff. Timing doesn't work and that would cut odds of conception to virtually nil with your age and after the reversal. I would have you do every 4 days plus one more attempt at positive OPK (or the day before you expect to ovulate)

[atomic sagebrush]

At 40, you may want to increase folic or folate (folate better but more expensive) to 2000 and add in 200-400 mg coq10 in ubiquinol form

No licorice root for DH after the reversal

[Sweetplum]

I would reduce the prenatals to 3x a week if you can't bear to give them up. Same with Omega 3.

At 40, the rules are different for you than others. I would not use pep tea for you at all, cuts odds of conception too far.

I do not recomend cranberry for ANYONE due to safety. I'd give hubby olive leaf extract but wait til after surgery and recovery to begin with that.

Calcium has been proven to contribute to cardiovascular disease and I think it sways blue anyway. I usually leave it to the individual to decide on that, but over 40 it makes me nervous due to the heart disease aspect of it all.

Rasp. tea I am on the fence about. It may sway blue, and it may mess up your cycle too for some people so unless you think you really need it, I'd skip it.

VERY IMPORTANT - do not have a 4 day cutoff. Timing doesn't work and that would cut odds of conception to virtually nil with your age and after the reversal. I would have you do every 4 days plus one more attempt at positive OPK (or the day before you expect to ovulate)

Thank you atomic. I appreciate the feedback.
What would your insights be on this revised sway for me:
1. No prenatals/omega 3 (until BFP)
2. lots of exercise (as much as I can fit in)
3. low calories (will try to lose about 10 lbs which would be very very thin for me as I'm at my lowest weight since my wedding day which was THIN).
4. no restriction on caffeine
5. no restriction on alcohol
6. only supplements : folate and coq10 in doeses you mention (I will meet with my OB next week and discuss the safety of these with her just for my own piece of mind).
7. breakfast : will try to skip but this is a hard one for me. How important is this truly? I'll buckle down if I have to.
8. I don't plan to go crazy with logging my food - ultimately I plan to just leave this up to the universe and come to terms with the fact that ultimately what is meant to be will be. I read your amazing piece on Maternal Dominance Hypothesis and Privileged Daughter Hypothesis and I could identify with "Martha" as a younger woman...but I feel as I've gotten older and gone through some struggles recently I'm settling into a more "Mary" Psyche and as I move into this potential sway I plan to approach it this way.
9. Lastly - BD every four days from period. I feel strange doing it on OV day since this is when I conceived both boys. What about every four days then 24 hours after OV? I would like to risk it for a few months and if it's not working I could switch to OV day? Thoughts on this?

Thank you!

[Sweetplum]

atomic. PS>
what about pregnitude? Should I do this? Seems like good results from the spreadsheets but no idea....
what about salt? avoid or no?
Thanks!

[atomic sagebrush]

Pregnitude is not suitable for everyone. It's for people with moderate to severe PCOS and may make it harder for you to conceive.

Please keep in mind that doctors are not up to speed on supplements. They will not know what you're talking about, most likely, and will tell you to take minimal doses but that is because they are not informed on the safety and research into these supplements. They will also just tell you to take a prenatal. Do what you feel the need to do of course but my guidelines for those things are based on tons of research that indicates that higher than normal folate intake before concepiton may help to prevent chromosomal abnormalities in addition to neural tube defects. And Coq10 is recommended by reproductive endocrinologists nationwide like Dr. Potter and many others to boost egg health in actually higher doses than what I recommended to you. I just hate to see you guys giving the rather uninformed opinions of the average doctor too much credit when really they may not be informed about these things at all.

Most of us have totally given up on the salt restriction. It makes it way easier to stick to the diet when you don't limit it and our results have only gone up since we gave up on it.

If you can't skip breakfast, just try pushing it back a little. That's fine. Just something that may help a bit.

I am concerned since you're already quite thin, that not tracking food, eating "low calorie" and trying to lose 10 pounds will be disasterous for your cycle. The reason I emphasize tracking food is only nominally for the sway. It's really much more so that you can continue to eat a safe, healthy diet and continue your ovulation. You should not drop below 1500-1800 cals a day (and many have to go up to 1800-2000) 40-50 g protein, 30-60 g fat. The LE Diet is not and never has been a "low calorie" starvation diet, it's just the lower limit of a normal diet that is safe prepregnancy. Dont' cut down beyond those lower limits please.

Timing doesn't sway. If you want to include it, that's totally fine, up to you. But part of the benefit of the e4d is that you aren't worrying over this day or that day and trying to figure out this complicated thing where you're having attempts on a certain day. It's supposed to be effortless so you don't really need to think about it. Having sex 24 hours after ovulation is pointless and gains you nothing. O+12 does not work and it has caused more heartbreak than any other method out there, by rendering women infertile and unable to conceive, and the older you are, the worse it works as our eggs do not live long enough. http://genderdreaming.com/forum/trying-to-conceive-a-girl/35539-no-12-a.html There has never been a medically confirmed pregnancy the day after ovulation, in dozens of studies. AT 40, time is not our friend here. If you don't want to do attempt at positive OPK (which is really 36 hours before ovulation and not O day anyway) then I'd just do an attempt on O-3 and O-2 if you must and hope that your cycle stays regular. In that case it's even more important to not cut back too far on the diet.

[Sweetplum]

Pregnitude is not suitable for everyone. It's for people with moderate to severe PCOS and may make it harder for you to conceive.

Please keep in mind that doctors are not up to speed on supplements. They will not know what you're talking about, most likely, and will tell you to take minimal doses but that is because they are not informed on the safety and research into these supplements. They will also just tell you to take a prenatal. Do what you feel the need to do of course but my guidelines for those things are based on tons of research that indicates that higher than normal folate intake before concepiton may help to prevent chromosomal abnormalities in addition to neural tube defects. And Coq10 is recommended by reproductive endocrinologists nationwide like Dr. Potter and many others to boost egg health in actually higher doses than what I recommended to you. I just hate to see you guys giving the rather uninformed opinions of the average doctor too much credit when really they may not be informed about these things at all.

Most of us have totally given up on the salt restriction. It makes it way easier to stick to the diet when you don't limit it and our results have only gone up since we gave up on it.

If you can't skip breakfast, just try pushing it back a little. That's fine. Just something that may help a bit.

I am concerned since you're already quite thin, that not tracking food, eating "low calorie" and trying to lose 10 pounds will be disasterous for your cycle. The reason I emphasize tracking food is only nominally for the sway. It's really much more so that you can continue to eat a safe, healthy diet and continue your ovulation. You should not drop below 1500-1800 cals a day (and many have to go up to 1800-2000) 40-50 g protein, 30-60 g fat. The LE Diet is not and never has been a "low calorie" starvation diet, it's just the lower limit of a normal diet that is safe prepregnancy. Dont' cut down beyond those lower limits please.

Timing doesn't sway. If you want to include it, that's totally fine, up to you. But part of the benefit of the e4d is that you aren't worrying over this day or that day and trying to figure out this complicated thing where you're having attempts on a certain day. It's supposed to be effortless so you don't really need to think about it. Having sex 24 hours after ovulation is pointless and gains you nothing. O+12 does not work and it has caused more heartbreak than any other method out there, by rendering women infertile and unable to conceive, and the older you are, the worse it works as our eggs do not live long enough. http://genderdreaming.com/forum/trying-to-conceive-a-girl/35539-no-12-a.html There has never been a medically confirmed pregnancy the day after ovulation, in dozens of studies. AT 40, time is not our friend here. If you don't want to do attempt at positive OPK (which is really 36 hours before ovulation and not O day anyway) then I'd just do an attempt on O-3 and O-2 if you must and hope that your cycle stays regular. In that case it's even more important to not cut back too far on the diet.


Atomic. Thank you!
My comments…what do you think?
No pregnitude. Got it.
I still want to ask my doctor but I hear you on the supplements.
I won’t worry about salt – will just not add it as much as I used to
Will try to eat breakfast around 9-10 instead of 6-7…should be fine with this.
I’m not super duper ‘thin’ I’m just a very athletic frame and I can’t get down below a certain number without TONS of effort. Eating less than 1800 calories a day would make me miserable physically and emotionally. I also used to be anorexic many years ago so I tend to get anxious when I’m counting calories. It’s better for me to eat healthy and not very restrictive so I’ll just use my very deep knowledge of nutrition to just tone things down to the lower end of a healthy pre-preg diet. I can do that for sure. I still would love to lose 10 lbs for summer so even if we decide not to do the reversal this diet is something I plan to doing but not killing myself!
Sounds good on the timing! I love the idea of not stressing. I do log my temp in Fertility Friend so I have a rough idea of ovulation and I’ll just go with the flow on this and follow your reco.

A few follow up questions:
1. Sweets? Good or Bad or doesn’t matter? Ie. Can I eat donuts at 10am for breakfast  Chocolate?
2. Dairy? Normal I’m guessing, not a ton and not a tiny bit….
3. PH? I have PH strips…do these work? Should I see if I can get down to below 5? Thoughts on this?
4. Douching with lemon and jump and dump for me?
5. Hot shower for hubby? OK or not.

[Sweetplum]

Atomic...I have to compliment you on the amazing amount of time and research you have put into this site. It's incredibly thorough and deep. Regardless of what we decide to do I'm finding this site so interesting to read. You've helped so many moms make dreams come true too :)

[atomic sagebrush]

Atomic...I have to compliment you on the amazing amount of time and research you have put into this site. It's incredibly thorough and deep. Regardless of what we decide to do I'm finding this site so interesting to read. You've helped so many moms make dreams come true too :)

Thank you - I just want you to understand I"m not mentioning the jazz about the doctors and the folic/coq because i'm offended or need my bal-s buttered LOL - it's because they will scare you into not taking stuff that can really help you get and stay pregnant. They know more than me on about 99.9% of stuff, this is just one thing I believe I know better on. :)

[atomic sagebrush]

Am i missing a question????

:agree: if you have a history of eating disorders you absolutely shouldn't count - I just want you to be sure you're getting enough, because many of the people who don't count end up eating less and less and less over time without realizing it.

sweets - not the greatest for egg quality but if you don't have PCOS or IR and egg health is ok, they are fine. I ate sweets in my successful sway and I was 41 so age alone does not mean you can't have them. People with PCOS/IR should avoid or limit them.

dairy - exactly. Just let your own taste be your guideline, dairy is handy for getting protein and fat.

Most of us have given up on pH. Soooo many pH opposites (including mine) that I find it impossible to believe any more. http://genderdreaming.com/forum/gender-swaying-general-discussion/11684-ph-pickle.html I got my daughter without checking pH at all, after getting my 4th son with them, and pH of 4.5-5 range that never went up till after I was already pregnant.

No douching or j and d at 40. If you want to do j and d do it only after 5 min. at least and not right away. ya never know when it may be the last fresh egg in the carton and you have to be there with a shot of conception.

I wouldn't bother with the hot shower for hubby, may not help anyway (no real data) and does seem to cut odds of conception.

[Sweetplum]

Thank you - I just want you to understand I"m not mentioning the jazz about the doctors and the folic/coq because i'm offended or need my bal-s buttered LOL - it's because they will scare you into not taking stuff that can really help you get and stay pregnant. They know more than me on about 99.9% of stuff, this is just one thing I believe I know better on. :)

I hear you 100%.

[Sweetplum]

Am i missing a question????

:agree: if you have a history of eating disorders you absolutely shouldn't count - I just want you to be sure you're getting enough, because many of the people who don't count end up eating less and less and less over time without realizing it.

sweets - not the greatest for egg quality but if you don't have PCOS or IR and egg health is ok, they are fine. I ate sweets in my successful sway and I was 41 so age alone does not mean you can't have them. People with PCOS/IR should avoid or limit them.

dairy - exactly. Just let your own taste be your guideline, dairy is handy for getting protein and fat.

Most of us have given up on pH. Soooo many pH opposites (including mine) that I find it impossible to believe any more. http://genderdreaming.com/forum/gender-swaying-general-discussion/11684-ph-pickle.html I got my daughter without checking pH at all, after getting my 4th son with them, and pH of 4.5-5 range that never went up till after I was already pregnant.

No douching or j and d at 40. If you want to do j and d do it only after 5 min. at least and not right away. ya never know when it may be the last fresh egg in the carton and you have to be there with a shot of conception.

I wouldn't bother with the hot shower for hubby, may not help anyway (no real data) and does seem to cut odds of conception.

Thank you. I've decided if we do move forward with this I'd do a personalized plan. Seems appropriate since I'm such a lost cause LOL.

[Sweetplum]

PS ATOMIC > Did you sway for a girl at age 41? Or was it a boy? Can't remember.

[maidentomother]

Yes she did and it was a successful pink sway.

[Sweetplum]

Yes she did and it was a successful pink sway.

This gives me hope.
There is so much information to sift through on here, it's amazing.

[atomic sagebrush]

PS ATOMIC > Did you sway for a girl at age 41? Or was it a boy? Can't remember.

Girl!

http://genderdreaming.com/forum/gender-confirmed-girl-sway-results/9388-atomics-stealth-sway-updated-july-20-a.html

Also, I SO LOVE your avatar. I really, really, really wanted to name my daughter Margot but we already have a Marshall and I thought we would be forever known as "the crazy Mar-People"

Then, very, very weirdly, the heroine in Wes Anderson's next movie was Suzy. Which actually is my daughter's name, spelled exactly the same and everything. (cue spooky music, or since this is a Wes Anderson movie, an obscure 70's song by Cat Stevens)

[atomic sagebrush]

Oh and was there a question I missed?? You said something about your comments and I am not seeing what I missed.

[Sweetplum]

Girl!

http://genderdreaming.com/forum/gender-confirmed-girl-sway-results/9388-atomics-stealth-sway-updated-july-20-a.html

Also, I SO LOVE your avatar. I really, really, really wanted to name my daughter Margot but we already have a Marshall and I thought we would be forever known as "the crazy Mar-People"

Then, very, very weirdly, the heroine in Wes Anderson's next movie was Suzy. Which actually is my daughter's name, spelled exactly the same and everything. (cue spooky music, or since this is a Wes Anderson movie, an obscure 70's song by Cat Stevens)

Wow. Your sway story is amazing. Thanks for the link.

Yep. I'm a huge Wes Anderson fan and Margot has been my (and DHs) #1 girl name since we started thinking of a family 6 years ago.

I don't think you missed a question...but I'm not able to keep up with all the stuff on here...I'm so impressed at how you get back to everyone with such personalized comments. It's pretty great.

I'm meeting with OB next week, if we get the thumbs up on a third pregnancy I have some more questions on swaying but for now I'm just lurking and catching up with all the old material on here. DH is pretty intrigued with the science/trends behind some of this too...but I'm trying not to get my hopes up since I have a feeling I'm going to get a big fat "Bad Idea" from the OB....sigh.

[Complex Emotions]

Margot is a beautiful name. Wasn't Margot adopted into the all boy Tenenbaum family? Maybe I'm misremembering...

I wish you the best in this journey.

[Sweetplum]

Margot is a beautiful name. Wasn't Margot adopted into the all boy Tenenbaum family? Maybe I'm misremembering...

I wish you the best in this journey.

Yes she was! Our family already has a Chas and Richie (no joke - my boys are just a quirky and bright in their own ways) so a little Margot would definitely make the plot line of our family story fun ;0)
Just got the thumbs up from my OB to keep moving forward. At least the door was not slammed in my face. Baby steps.

[Complex Emotions]

Congratulations on getting the thumbs up from your OB!

I see online that in real life Wes Anderson was one of three boys with no sister, and I think in the movie the parents had all biological sons and grandsons with no girls... I should watch that movie again.

I guess it makes sense that this gender stuff effects us in deep lifelong ways, consciously or subconsciously.

[atomic sagebrush]

Here is one for the hubbies out there. :) http://genderdreaming.com/forum/swaying-studies-and-scientific-research/32383-defense-swaying-part-1-a.html

[atomic sagebrush]

Congratulations on getting the thumbs up from your OB!

I see online that in real life Wes Anderson was one of three boys with no sister, and I think in the movie the parents had all biological sons and grandsons with no girls... I should watch that movie again.

I guess it makes sense that this gender stuff effects us in deep lifelong ways, consciously or subconsciously. My mom was lucky to always get the gender she longed for, each and every time: GBGB. But she herself had been one of seven girls out of eight children. While I was growing up I remember she occasionally made comments about the world having an excess of women and girls.

There are seriously a TON of super duperly creative people in all one gener families. Joss Whedon is one of 5, Hayao Miyazaki is one of 4, Jonas Salk and the Leakey family (anthropologists) are one of 3 boys, Laura Ingalls Wilder is from an all girl family, as is Virginia Woolf, I could go on and on.

I believe there is something strangely freeing about being in an all one gender family. Ya don't have to be "the boy" or "the girl" in a family of all one gender, it sort of frees you up to be what you want to be instead of having to fill in some familial role. :)

[atomic sagebrush]

Congratulations on getting the thumbs up from your OB!

I see online that in real life Wes Anderson was one of three boys with no sister, and I think in the movie the parents had all biological sons and grandsons with no girls... I should watch that movie again.

I guess it makes sense that this gender stuff effects us in deep lifelong ways, consciously or subconsciously. My mom was lucky to always get the gender she longed for, each and every time: GBGB. But she herself had been one of seven girls out of eight children. While I was growing up I remember she occasionally made comments about the world having an excess of women and girls.

Haha oh gosh I just realized yes they also have all boy grandchildren don't they??? And interestingly, they are also good friends with Jason Schwartzman who is also from an all boy family (but now has a daughter.)

[Sweetplum]

Congratulations on getting the thumbs up from your OB!

I see online that in real life Wes Anderson was one of three boys with no sister, and I think in the movie the parents had all biological sons and grandsons with no girls... I should watch that movie again.

I guess it makes sense that this gender stuff effects us in deep lifelong ways, consciously or subconsciously. My mom was lucky to always get the gender she longed for, each and every time: GBGB. But she herself had been one of seven girls out of eight children. While I was growing up I remember she occasionally made comments about the world having an excess of women and girls.

I love how my online "Should We Get A Vasectomy Reversal Thread" has turned into a conversation about Wes Anderson and his movies. Seems weirdly fitting. My life is so quirky and bizarre...but using a movie character as my pic may have something to do with this I suppose....

I just got the results from the AMH (Anti-Mullerian Hormone) test. Mine was 1.442. Anyone? My OB gave another thumbs up in her note, apparently above 1 is what they look for. I've realized that I can't analyze test results well as I'm a sample size of 1 and well, after all the health stuff we went through a few years ago I got sick of looking online for diagnosis and information as everyone is so unique. That said, if anyone has had this test, would love some anecdotal stories. I'm guessing the 1.442 means I have quite a few eggs left (but they are still old eggs) and obviously I'm trusting my doctor, just curious.

My husband on the other hand seems to have completely given in to the idea of a third kid. We talked a bit about 3 boys and (I may have mentioned this before but I always told friends and family growing up that I would love to be a mom of three boys) and after reading Atomics post on here about families of single gender children and the associated gender freedom/creativity I'd have to say I'm more excited than ever at the thought of another boy. If we have three boys...they would be like super adorable, weird, funny, bright Russian dolls. But if we have a girl, she would be the little cherry on top our family (and I get my pair of shoes). It seems like a win - win. My DH said..."If we do this I want to try for a girl because I'd like to see what a girl would be like" and I agreed but we both seemed to feel that we shouldn't kill ourselves. It was refreshing, although I think if we get into this the stress will increase as we're just in the discussion phase right now.

For me, now the issue is "do I really want to do this?" Hubby seems on board. Eggs seem to be available. Boy or Girl thing seems to have resolved itself. It's just me. And honestly, I'm questioning it. I'm sitting here in my cozy family room while the shrimps sleep upstairs quietly...working on this big fun project emailing the principals and a few colleagues at my firm and enjoying it while drinking some wine. Do I want to throw a baby in this fun mix? Yes. and No.

I'm thinking I may talk to my dad about things. I know it is weird but I'm closer to my dad than my mom (my mom is toooo emphatic - to the point that she cannot take herself out of my shoes when I go through stuff long enough to stop crying). My dad on the other hand will give me some good things to think about. I'm meeting him for lunch in mid-February (that's how busy we both are, yuck) and we'll see.

We are going to meet with the urologist next week. Then I have the second blood test a week after that. I'm very curious to hear what the urologist has to say and what DH says after. I'll report back.

[Sweetplum]

There are seriously a TON of super duperly creative people in all one gener families. Joss Whedon is one of 5, Hayao Miyazaki is one of 4, Jonas Salk and the Leakey family (anthropologists) are one of 3 boys, Laura Ingalls Wilder is from an all girl family, as is Virginia Woolf, I could go on and on.

I believe there is something strangely freeing about being in an all one gender family. Ya don't have to be "the boy" or "the girl" in a family of all one gender, it sort of frees you up to be what you want to be instead of having to fill in some familial role. :)

I LOVE this.

[atomic sagebrush]

It's fine for your age. Exactly what it should be. There's a pretty good explanation here: AMH levels assess ovarian reserve | IVF1 (http://www.ivf1.com/amh-ovarian-reserve/)

It is a hard decision to make. I still have mixed feelings about doing it now and then and my daughter is 3 1/2 LOL. My thoughts at the time and now are still, it's a now or never kind of thing, so if you choose not to decide, you still have made a choice, if you know what I"m saying. My fear was always, if I don't do this, in 5 years I won't be ABLE to, yk?? The wine will always be there, the baby option won't, but I'll be honest and say it's a slog sometimes (most) times and I do often think about the things I'd rather be doing than dumping out poopy pots and disinfecting my high chair for the 3000th time. :)

[Sweetplum]

Last night DH and I DTD and I'm about 2-3 days away from ovulation. I know there is a .00000000000000000000000000001% chance I'll get a BFP with the vasectomy and all, but I can hope can't I? Kinda sad isn't it. I really wish I wasn't in this position, being here feels so weird as I usually feel 100% sure of my life decisions and don't look back. This one is haunting me and the clock is ticking. It's hard.

[atomic sagebrush]

This is the big one. I wish they'd let us know that a little sooner. :/

[Sweetplum]

Just had our meeting with the urologist. Here is a summary.
1. He's got a 98% success rate (that is with the return of sperm). He's the best in our area....and beyond. Really great guy.
2. DH shouldn't be too difficult as the V is so new and he could tell in the check up that the tubes are touching (not much required to repair).
3. Average of 7 months after reversal to get pregnant. This would decrease with the minimal time passed since DH's V but increase with my age (40). So we'll just say around 7 months.
4. He's booking out a month.
5. Cost - $6500 or so.

I went to lunch with DH after the appt and here is a summary of that:
1. DH 100% doesn't feel the need for another child. He's happy with our two boys.
2. He will do the VR. He cares more about me being happy if this is what I want.
3. He's not excited about the procedure (to be expected).
4. We talked a lot about 'resentment' and the issue of me having resentment if we don't move forward and I always wonder 'what if' and the issue of him having resentment if we do move forward with something that he doesn't really need/want (or if something bad happens to me or with baby). We then flipped the discussion to instead focusing on resentment, focusing on one of us 'taking one for the team'. Meaning - me giving up my dreams of a third child/girl or him giving up his dreams of moving on and postponing the ease of 'older kids' a few years. In this scenario he felt taking the hit for 5 years of 'baby discomfort' (you know how the men don't love the baby years like us women) was worth it if it made me happy.

We had some low points in the discussion feeling frustrated with each other, but towards the end he just said "You know I'm going to do this if you want" and he got teary and I said "thank you so much honey, I am not even sure we should but I am so grateful you are hearing me out" and we left holding hands on a good note. We both agreed it's too bad we are in this position but that life isn't as linear as we all hope it to be.

This is the biggest 'decision' hubby and I have had to make (other than a few serious health decisions for our children a few years back). This one is lingering and all-encompassing since the clock is tick tocking away for me.

We have the thumbs up from OB, a path for the VR and hubby will do it (and sway with me), we can afford it and seems likely to be a success. There is not much stopping us from moving forward with this....but I'm still not 100% sure what the right thing to do is....for everyone.

My first gut was to set a 'deadline' for us to make a decision, then I took back that thought almost immediately as that is exactly the type of thinking that got us here...."If we just schedule a vasectomy I'll stop thinking of more babies and shut that door and move on" (That did NOT work)....so instead we will ponder and let it play itself out. I may see a therapist (I have the name of a therapist that specializes in fertility and reproductive concerns) as really this is all about my way of thinking and the balance between the heart and the head.

To be continued.

[atomic sagebrush]

Thank you so much for this lovely update and I REALLY appreciate you putting into words, so eloquently, that thought process that I know so many ladies have followed...this..."If we just schedule a vasectomy I'll stop thinking of more babies and shut that door and move on" (That did NOT work) I thave seen so many people go this route and end up having reversals, both V and tubal.

[Traci25]

Best of luck with your decision

[Sweetplum]

Thanks Atomic and Traci for the comments.

The past few days I've been having major PMS...really tender boobs (excruciating when the boys crawl on me if we're reading stories or something), serious back aches (so bad I had to ice and miss work since I couldn't walk around), moody, peeing a ton (can't make it to the bathroom), nauseated, can't sleep, a really mild headache and bloated. Plus I'm hungry and craving sweets.

Feeling this way has really started to make me wonder if I can go through another pregnancy. All the things I've been feeling the past few days would pale in comparison to the reality of carrying a human for 9 months and all the stress related to my chronic health condition and well...most of all...the health of the baby.

I just don't know if it's worth it to push things so hard. If it had really easy pregnancies, I was younger, and we could just try without dealing with the whole vasectomy reversal issue for my husband I would feel better, but right now I'm just not so sure it is worth it, despite my desire for a baby (girl). I wonder if I may just be happier embracing things as they are and our decision on the V (which was truly made with both DH and I in agreement and good intentions even if it did backfire) and move on to enjoying a full life as a family of four.

I did talk with two girlfriends and they seem to think I should think with my 'heart' which of course means move forward and try for another baby (I really trust their judgement)....even though they both seemed to favor us moving forward, they were also wary of all the complications as they know all the stuff we've been through. At least I know I'm not crazy in my feelings.

We'll see how I feel this weekend. Speaking of crazy in my feelings, I find that my hormones dictate my desire for a third child, a monthly wave I ride....

Maybe the waves will taper off or maybe we'll just take the dive?

[atomic sagebrush]

One thing to keep in mind is that self-control seems to take a nose dive in the LP (second half of cycle) and you are not alone in finding that to be the case. I can't stick to my diet and invariably spend too much money too. :p

Question, is adoption a possibillity at all?

[Sweetplum]

One thing to keep in mind is that self-control seems to take a nose dive in the LP (second half of cycle) and you are not alone in finding that to be the case. I can't stick to my diet and invariably spend too much money too. :p

Question, is adoption a possibillity at all?

Nope. DH is totally against adoption. I am for the idea of it but the reality of adopting probably won't work for our family.

Feeling pretty hopeless lately. I need to come to terms with the fact that my friends and family will continue to have babies, and that at some point (now or in a few years) that phase will be done for me. I find it both so wonderful and painful to hear about friends and family expecting. I'm genuinely excited but deeply jealous at the same time. Regardless of what we do I need to work on this.

[atomic sagebrush]

Do you think that once the door is really closed you might feel better?? I feel like for many of us it's that tantalizing possibility that really keeps breaking our hearts.

[Sweetplum]

Do you think that once the door is really closed you might feel better?? I feel like for many of us it's that tantalizing possibility that really keeps breaking our hearts.

Yes. I do.
That was our goal a year ago with the vasectomy...closing the door and making me feel better :( But you are right, at some point this will happen and one option is to waffle until that point I suppose....

DH and I finally had time to talk last night again (after the appt a week ago). We sat in the kitchen for about an hour and went over everything. He is seriously an amazing partner, I'm so lucky and I think I've said this before, but the whole struggle is bringing us closer as we are both handling it so well, really hearing one another out with loads of empathy and understanding.

Bottom line : He has left it up to me. He will be happy either way and I have been given the OK to schedule the VR if I want. The first available VR is not until mid-April which means we couldn't start trying until May which is fine, our Spring is already busy with a kitchen remodel project and some travels. The timing would be good.

But, now that I have the go-ahead and know this is a real possibility I'm not 100% sure I want to pull the trigger.

I'm just going to let it all sink in and hopefully something external will happen that will help with my decision. I feel if it's left to me alone, I don't have the tools to make the call....

If we do move forward with number 3 I'm looking forward to swaying for a girl as it's something I never considered with my previous pregnancies (I REALLY wanted a boy for the first and I equally wanted a boy for the second so that they would have one another). I know now after processing things here (thank goodness for this site) that the girl thing would just be icing...and knowing that I would be very happy with a third boy makes this decision easier actually. I may have bouts of GD over things like luscious dresses and sparkly shoes but honestly, I do everything I would do with a little girl with my boys already (and my boys are VERY fashionable themselves!)

[mommymachine]

If there is such a long wait time for the appointment, perhaps you should book the appointment and sit on the "go for it" side of the fence for a while and see how that makes you feel?

I am so glad you have such a supportive hubby!!

Mommy to 5 with number 6 due in June!!

[Sweetplum]

If there is such a long wait time for the appointment, perhaps you should book the appointment and sit on the "go for it" side of the fence for a while and see how that makes you feel?

I am so glad you have such a supportive hubby!!

Mommy to 5 with number 6 due in June!!

I had considered this and called to inquire, but it's $1,600 (non-refundable) to book the appt.

[mommymachine]

Yes I was wondering if that were the case (that you would have to put money down) :( I'm sorry.


Mommy to 5 with number 6 due in June!!

[Sweetplum]

I had lunch with my dad today. 2 hours. We talked about a lot of things...my boys, my career, his project (retired CEO helping launch a pretty amazing start up with my little brother), family stuff, finances (he's my advisor), summer plans and travels. We were just about done and kinda wrapping up some questions I had for him on my finances when I said "there is another factor in all these conversations dad". That opened up the flood gates about everything I've been feeling.

I told him I wasn't sure I was done, I had regret about the V (he knows about it since I was so confused a year ago and asked him for advice then), felt depressed and low. That I'm really happy with my own life but don't want to let this window pass if I think I'll regret not having another kid. That I do really want a girl, but I'd be thrilled with a boy. That I'm jealous of other family and friends having babies but that I know I can't feel this way forever.

He just listened intently. Seriously. Then he sat back and said "well, first of all you should not regret, feel guilt or beat yourself up over the decision you two made a year ago. At the time it was right, it may still be right, but if it's not it is because life changes and sometimes decisions you make at one point in your life may not be right at another" Then he went on "But on the other hand, you also cannot allow yourself to go back and forth on things forever". We talked a lot about this, it's part of my nature as a creative to constantly question everything and not be satisfied....anyway, back to the conversation. Basically he made me feel normal and OK for feeling what I was feeling. We then talked about risk and how often those who take huge risks don't have much to lose in the first place and for me, I have so much to lose by taking on some huge risks with a third pregnancy. The conversation tied into some other risk related issues we both have going on in our lives so it started to make more sense to me.

I have so much to lose.

My life is incredible right now. Not perfect but it's imperfect, messy, happy, sad, wild, joyful and fulfilling...what life should be. It has been really hard recently, but it's not anymore. We endured that. I finally have what I've dreamed of - an incredibly rewarding career where I feel like I'm contributing to society and good at what I do, a loving husband and partner, two healthy children, financial comfort and parents who are alive and well. We have a lot to look forward to.

I feel like it is time for me to move on and start living my life instead of planning for the what ifs. I have so much in front of me. I am incredibly grateful for this site, for allowing me to start in one place and end up in another without judgment (I don't know how many even read this but I am grateful for the positivity here). I am intrigued by all the swaying and I know I'll pop in to read up on stuff from time to time for the fun of it...and to see how some of the people I've chatted with are doing, but I think my time here is mostly done and I've realized what my story is about.

My story is about being an older mom. Having some really hard stuff happen but loving pregnancy more than anything. Loving newborns, loving breastfeeding and late nights. Feeling slighted for not having a natural birth and the 'experience" I expected. It's about me seeing that even though my experiences were not textbook they were mine and my son's. It's about maturing through this and lowering my expectations but not my standards. About putting my children's health first over what I want out of childbearing for me. It's about being unsure of things sometimes and learning that this is OK and I can't make decisions that change my feelings...in the future I have to give my feelings space before decisions. It's about me knowing that I'll have pangs of envy and sadness when I see a gorgeous round pregnant mom when I'm out and about but this is OK. It's about me being an aunt who buys her (soon-to-be-born) nieces some of the most gorgeous clothing to get my fix. It's about me being a REALLY good boy mom and knowing that. It's about me knowing that another child would be amazing and wonderful but my life already already is amazing and wonderful. It's about allowing myself to process this without judgement. And finally it's about realizing that I finally feel like both my head and my heart is telling me to move on with this life I've created with DH and relish every single moment.

Thanks all and best wishes to everyone on finding their own childbearing story, through swaying, IVF or simply processing things here like me. I wish you all the best with all your beautiful families. And thank you again to Atomic for the compassion, insight and research you provide. This is a wonderful place for many women. Peace! and Hope!

[XXforhubby]

Well said! So many things you said are exactly how I feel too. I too was/am having trouble with the end of my childbearing years. I am finally embracing what I have in front of me and being fully present with my three, sweet boys. I'm looking forward to what the future holds for us. While I wish my DH had the DD he desired, I'm grateful we tried one last time and have a beautifully, healthy baby boy! I have always wanted to be a boy mom, and I'm thankful to have them. While I felt I wasn't through having children, I began to realize that the prospect of trying one more time was something I was forcing. Nothing good ever comes from force.

I feel free. Thank you so much for posting your thoughts on the matter. I've been reading your posts and it has cause me to reflect on my thoughts and feelings.

I wish you peace and happiness [emoji8]!


[emoji170]DS1[emoji1379], DS2[emoji577], & DS3[emoji602] completes our family![emoji170]

[atomic sagebrush]

Thanks SP, I've really enjoyed this thread. :)

if it helps at all, I think that for many of us, myself very much included here, it cuts so sharp because our lives AREN'T incredible. It is that we don't have all this stuff, and we also don't have THAT. If you do have this amazing, wonderful life, then you go, girl. This is a speed bump to you. None of us ever get everything we want in this world and that is ok. Just by virtue of being born when and where we are, we have more than most. Luscious dresses and sparkly shoes aren't all they're cracked up to be, and I just enjoyed a conversation with my 20 year old SON on the telephone more than I've enjoyed buying any of them. :) it's not that I'm not happy with my own decisions, because I am, but I can see how a different set of decisions would also make a person happy and I just want you guys to know that. :heart: Wishing you the best moving on.

[Sweetplum]

Thanks SP, I've really enjoyed this thread. :)

if it helps at all, I think that for many of us, myself very much included here, it cuts so sharp because our lives AREN'T incredible. It is that we don't have all this stuff, and we also don't have THAT. If you do have this amazing, wonderful life, then you go, girl. This is a speed bump to you. None of us ever get everything we want in this world and that is ok. Just by virtue of being born when and where we are, we have more than most. Luscious dresses and sparkly shoes aren't all they're cracked up to be, and I just enjoyed a conversation with my 20 year old SON on the telephone more than I've enjoyed buying any of them. :) it's not that I'm not happy with my own decisions, because I am, but I can see how a different set of decisions would also make a person happy and I just want you guys to know that. :heart: Wishing you the best moving on.

I wanted to write back on this before I move on, yes, it might seem like I have 'everything' to those who look in on me from 100 feet. My life seems perfect, people are intimidated (which is hard for me actually). I really like this place because it is an equalizer. I come from wealth, I have all that 'stuff' that should make life perfect but if you strip all that away it doesn't really matter. We all feel the same thing, and seek understanding when we are struggling and I think ALL moms struggle during their childbearing years, if not on gender on when to stop having babies or something else. I frankly value the depth of people and their resilience over the silver spoon (for good reason as I've seen what the silver spoon can do) and that is why this place has been good. There are real women here.

My husband has said I should write a book as a project. I think this is what I'm going to spend my time on. I love places like this where I can write and meet others so I may be back if I do decide to write something....you are a very selfless person Atomic, all your beautiful children (boy or girl!) are so very very lucky to have you as mom.

[Sweetplum]

Well said! So many things you said are exactly how I feel too. I too was/am having trouble with the end of my childbearing years. I am finally embracing what I have in front of me and being fully present with my three, sweet boys. I'm looking forward to what the future holds for us. While I wish my DH had the DD he desired, I'm grateful we tried one last time and have a beautifully, healthy baby boy! I have always wanted to be a boy mom, and I'm thankful to have them. While I felt I wasn't through having children, I began to realize that the prospect of trying one more time was something I was forcing. Nothing good ever comes from force.

I feel free. Thank you so much for posting your thoughts on the matter. I've been reading your posts and it has cause me to reflect on my thoughts and feelings.

I wish you peace and happiness [emoji8]!


[emoji170]DS1[emoji1379], DS2[emoji577], & DS3[emoji602] completes our family![emoji170]

XX,
I've read your posts too and I do feel we have a shared story. It is hard to talk about these things in 'real life' as it can be too sensitive for those close to us....too invested in a way. Giving in to the present is really nice! I'm excited to not have to diet and worry and looking forward to finding another fun project for myself :) All the best to you and your family. Three boys sounds like a dream. Enjoy them!

[Dreamsister]

Dear Sweetplum. Wauh. You are not waisting your time. What a deveopment you have gone through just in this short time being present at this site. I really admire your ability to reflection, your sincereness and openess. I wish I could reach the same conclusion as you and xxforhubby: being happy with the kids I have and not wanting more. Take care and enjoy. And many thanks for sharing your thoughts with us.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[Complex Emotions]

My story is ... about maturing through this and lowering my expectations but not my standards. About putting my children's health first over what I want out of childbearing for me. It's about being unsure of things sometimes and learning that this is OK and I can't make decisions that change my feelings...in the future I have to give my feelings space before decisions. It's about me knowing that I'll have pangs of envy... It's about me being a REALLY good boy mom and knowing that.



This is so beautiful. I'm glad we joined this site around the same time. Your perspective on life shows me that everything will be alright if our second baby is another little boy. Thank you.

[Complex Emotions]

Luscious dresses and sparkly shoes aren't all they're cracked up to be, and I just enjoyed a conversation with my 20 year old SON on the telephone more than I've enjoyed buying any of them.

There is something utterly mesmerizing about little girl clothes... there are dresses I still remember like I was looking at a photograph from the time I went shopping after finding out our first would be a boy. But I'd imagine it's not so different than when I buy myself an outfit that initially seems like it has the potential to change my life but then it inevitably doesn't fit comfortably, or it gets ruined right away.

Clothes are just clothes. It would probably be absolutely magical to shop for my daughter that first time after I found out we were having a girl. But then reality would probably set in, and shopping for a girl would probably become just about the same thing as shopping for a boy. Actually, maybe it would be worse since there's that weird pressure to be beautiful put on little girls.

[atomic sagebrush]

Yes exactly, it's just like that. I spent so much time and care and money picking out these scrummy clothes and most of them are hanging in a closet or in the chest of drawers because the day to day life she just is a busy bee and doesn't want to sit around looking like a puffball. :) When I put a bow on her head and take her out, she will remove the bow and we have lost about 10 really $$ bows that way. Many days (as you can see by my many avatar pics) I forget to brush her hair even (bad mom LOL but also because she hates it.) It's just not as AHMAYZING as I expected it to be and she has bigger fish to fry.

[Sweetplum]

Thanks ladies. I am obsessed with looking online at girl clothes but I know it's mostly because I don't actually have a girl to dress and it's really fleeting since you can only dress them for the first few years anyway - then they will start to dress themselves...I'm not into bows and frilly things but more lush patterns and bright colors. My boys wear stripes and patterns all the time so I'm only missing out on the pink patterns I guess ;)

I am back here as a bunch of feelings came up this AM when I found out my friend named her baby girl who was born last week "Margaux". I think I may have mentioned that our girl name would be "Margot". It's little things like this that make the feelings bubble up but I'm getting better at putting them in their place and realizing that they are only temporary and related to something external not internal. Seeing the adorable newborn pictures of her was hard though, just made me want to cuddle with a newborn in a cozy rocking chair....

In the past few days I've been able to stop myself pretty quickly when my mind starts wandering down the path of a third child, a little because it just isn't smart with my age and my past (and as I've realized I have a lot to lose by pushing this) but mostly because I am genuinely excited about life with my family as it is and moving forward. But now I understand that being happy/content doesn't mean that I'll never have these feelings of longing or sadness pop up sometimes, just that I'll accept them instead of fight them or give into them.

It's good to find peace even with some discomfort now and then, feels like progress.
Hope all are well :)

[atomic sagebrush]

If it helps at all, many of us when we did get our DD, found that the "dream name" was not right any more. It's happened to several people who always had a name or three in the back of their minds and then even when we get a daughter it isn't "her." I hadn't even THOUGHT of my daughter's name till the night before I had her! :p

Even at first, they just don't always love the dresses. I remember putting her into dresses when she was a baby and she'd step on the hem and get frustrated because she couldn't even stand up! They are really impractical and you end up putting them into the dress for 3 minutes so you can take a picture before she grows out of it, and it just isn't this transformative experience, if that makes sense.

[Sweetplum]

it just isn't this transformative experience, if that makes sense.

Yes. This 100% makes sense. I think I have a tendency to daydream a lot and I know very very well that my daydreams are usually way more fun in my head than if they actually become a reality. Vacations are always like this for me. So was going out and trying meet guys when I was in my 20s!

The name thing makes sense too.

[Sweetplum]

Been having stronger feelings about having another child again lately. I've gotten pretty good at putting the feelings away but for the past week or so I just have this awful baby fever whenever I see a baby, see a picture of a baby or hear about a baby. Not sure if this is just who I am and that this will never change or if I need to re-evaluate our decision again and possibly re-consider quitting at two.

It's frustrating to just not be able to move on :(

[Sweetplum]

Well. I called the urologist this AM to set up the reversal. Waiting for her to call back. It's officially been about a year that I've been waffling about this. My husband is Ok with the reversal as he sees how much the original vasectomy (although well intentioned due to all the health issues) is filling me with regret and we both know a third baby would bring the four of us so much joy.

Despite logic and all the risks we are going to take the leap and set up the reversal. It will most likely be in October with us TTC in November which will give me some time to sway a bit (I'm going to do a casual sway as frankly I'm not as concerned with gender as I am with just having a baby). If October comes and we get cold feet we can cancel the appt but will lose $800. At that point the door will close for us....and I will be at peace either way as we ran the course of this decision to completion.

It's really hard to be on the fence but the tipping point for us was the realization that we would be trying for baby 3 had we not got the vasectomy. My husbands short term health is a very very big concern for me which is why I still hesitate...but if we don't schedule something now we will be pushing it with my age. It's now or never.

More to come.

[atomic sagebrush]

Exciting news Lily!!! Keep us posted on things as they develop!! :)

[Sweetplum]

Exciting news Lily!!! Keep us posted on things as they develop!! :)

Thanks.
I'm still not sure if what we are doing is right/smart/risky/selfish/irrational/ok/heartfelt/loving/silly. I'm just so worried about the regret I shoulder and always wondering 'what if'.
Life is so short...
My husband is such a good guy.

[Dreamsister]

Welcome back Sweetplum. So happy you decided to go for a third child. Have been thinking about you and what you decided to do after this much thinking back and forth. Now we will be swaying buddies - and hopefully due-buddies too. So happy for you. Seems like you have a very nice and caring husband. GL with the reversal. Looking forward to your update.

[squigglepink]

I remember reading this thread back in Feb. Great to have you back Sweetplum! :)

I too was sitting on the fence and wondering what if, and should i/we, and what about this and that and the next thing... am i too old, will it effect us financially, what if another boy, can we carry on with private education, will i manage 3 kids, can i give them all a part of me, will my DH and i be ok, what about baby sitting and my mom having 3 kids to look after at once, what about going on holidays - how do 5 of us sit together on a plane, when i cross the road i want to hold all their hands, can i keep them all safe and will i survive another pregnancy, will i be ok in theatre, my list is silly and endless ...
Seeing my bf with her newborn daughter brought me to my knees. Fast forward 6 months and one attempt and im currently waiting for AF to (not) arrive!. My only agreement with myself for going for number 3, was that i was ok with it being another boy. The other stuff i can work around. Regret i simply cannot. I may have GD like i did with number 2 - but i got over that and currently obsessed with him! x

All the best going forward Sweetplum and i look forward to more of your journey here xx
PS - my second name is Margo :)

[Complex Emotions]

Welcome back Sweetplum! I've missed you.

It sounds like you have a good plan that will give you more time to think things through as you go.

[Sweetplum]

Thank you everyone for the support.
My husband saw how at ease and happy I was last night after making the call and I felt very at peace. That is different than a sort of frantic low mood I've had for quite a while. I'm hoping the peace means it's the right decision.

I also got a note from my OB yesterday reaffirming her support of us going for #3 despite my age and previous complications.

The first step for us is getting over the hurdle of the reversal and nurturing my husband.

[Sweetplum]

BTW. Even though I'm posting on a site dedicated to gender selection I have come to terms with the fact that if I am lucky enough to get pregnant and deliver a healthy baby I will have a girl OR a boy, even with swaying. I am totally OK with this. I'm even starting to dream of how wonderful it would be to have a third boy. I ADORE my boys so much and they have this very special bond with their mom. Having another boy and seeing how he will fit into our family of boys makes my heart swell. We would be 100% boy and I would just settle into this. Having a girl would be like a cherry on top, but having a boy would just sort of make our sundae really huge and even more full of love and craziness. I'm nervous but hopeful about this whole thing and I don't care that much about the gender anymore. Enough to sway but not enough to stress and kill myself. If things go OK I may just wait til baby is born to find out (like we did with the first two)....

[Dreamsister]

BTW. Even though I'm posting on a site dedicated to gender selection I have come to terms with the fact that if I am lucky enough to get pregnant and deliver a healthy baby I will have a girl OR a boy, even with swaying. I am totally OK with this. I'm even starting to dream of how wonderful it would be to have a third boy. I ADORE my boys so much and they have this very special bond with their mom. Having another boy and seeing how he will fit into our family of boys makes my heart swell. We would be 100% boy and I would just settle into this. Having a girl would be like a cherry on top, but having a boy would just sort of make our sundae really huge and even more full of love and craziness. I'm nervous but hopeful about this whole thing and I don't care that much about the gender anymore. Enough to sway but not enough to stress and kill myself. If things go OK I may just wait til baby is born to find out (like we did with the first two)....

I sounds like you have a totally right attitude. You want another child and not just a certain gender. I think this makes swaying so much more relaxing.


DS1 (9) ❤️ DS2 (8) [emoji173] DS3 (5) ❤️ DW (41) [emoji1326] DH (38) [emoji144] TTC'ing pink from May 2016

[Sweetplum]

I sounds like you have a totally right attitude. You want another child and not just a certain gender. I think this makes swaying so much more relaxing.


DS1 (9) ❤️ DS2 (8) [emoji173] DS3 (5) ❤️ DW (41) [emoji1326] DH (38) [emoji144] TTC'ing pink from May 2016

We have so much in common. I'm looking forward to following along with your journey as well :)

[atomic sagebrush]

Thanks.
I'm still not sure if what we are doing is right/smart/risky/selfish/irrational/ok/heartfelt/loving/silly. I'm just so worried about the regret I shoulder and always wondering 'what if'.
Life is so short...
My husband is such a good guy.

Every life choice is like that though. There's a song that goes "If you choose not to decide, you still have made a choice" and I think there is a lot to that. :)

[Sweetplum]

Every life choice is like that though. There's a song that goes "If you choose not to decide, you still have made a choice" and I think there is a lot to that. :)

That is my reality now. The urologist called me today to set it all up. I was busy with a deadline for work...but now I have about 1/2 hour before I need to head off to pick up my son at camp and I can't find the courage to call her back to schedule it. The inability to finally take the leap is really hard on me, and depressing. If my husband didn't have to go through a surgery we would just be casually trying now.

I have never felt so unsure of something in my life...and unable to move forward.

The "not making a choice" route (IMO) is actually giving up completely. I need to choose to move forward with two kids or try for three....the saddest thing would be if I waffle too long, then realize the door in closed and my husband was still willing.

[Sweetplum]

I called her back. The reversal is scheduled for October 21.
It feels good to take this step...

[pinkone2013]

Wishing you all the best, hope all goes well

[Dreamsister]

I called her back. The reversal is scheduled for October 21.
It feels good to take this step...

So happy you made the choice. How long after the operation will you be able to TTC? I am sure everything will go well and now you have time to set your body up for pink with diet and cardio.


DS1 (9) ❤️ DS2 (8) [emoji173] DS3 (5) ❤️ DW (41) [emoji1326] DH (38) [emoji144] TTC'ing pink from May 2016

[Sweetplum]

So happy you made the choice. How long after the operation will you be able to TTC? I am sure everything will go well and now you have time to set your body up for pink with diet and cardio.


DS1 (9) ❤️ DS2 (8) [emoji173] DS3 (5) ❤️ DW (41) [emoji1326] DH (38) [emoji144] TTC'ing pink from May 2016

If all goes well we will start TTC at the beginning of November, about two weeks.
I have 16 weeks to sway but honestly I've been lightly swaying all year so far since I've been on and off thinking of this. My current weight is 8 lbs down from this time last year, and I'm losing steadily without killing myself.

My current sway is as follows. If Atomic reads this, I'd love to hear her two cents on it.

No prenatal til BFP (took these pre conception with both boys)
No omega 3 til BFP (took these pre conception with both boys)
800 mcg Folic Acid Daily
400 mg Ubiquinol Daily
No Aspartame
100% Vegetarian Diet
Lots of Caffiene
0-2 glasses alcohol max per day
Exercise 60 min per day (6-7 days a week)
Skip Breakfast
LE Diet

** Not tracking anything as I don't have energy
** I am not going to obsess because honestly I feel sort of defeated in many ways and with the reversal I'm just going to pray husband is OK and see what the universe has in store for our family.


When TTC
4 day cut off or BD every four days
(With both boys with DTD everyday for about 8 days before and after ovulation, I need a different strategy)
With TTC I have about 2 years of trying then I'm done. I'm OK with that.

[atomic sagebrush]

Yes, exactly. Hemming and hawing and postponing is really choosing not to. It's easier though, and so a lot of times we end up procrastinating ourselves into making the choice when really, if we pushed ourselves to decide for once and for all we would not necessarily do things that same way. :)

[atomic sagebrush]

Coffee instead of caffeine - we are not quite sure if it is something in coffee or if it is caffeine so to hedge our bets I prefer caffeinated coffee.

Do not do 4 day cutoff. BD every 4 days is a totally different thing!! Has nothing to do with cutoffs.

If you MUST do a cutoff, no more than 3 days max and 2 days is better.

your husband MUST be doing regular release every 2-4 days. NO abstain, no FR.

There is a HUGE difference between BD daily and having one attempt. Please don't get those mixed up and think you have to have a 4 day cutoff plus abstain for this to work!!!

[Sweetplum]

Yes, exactly. Hemming and hawing and postponing is really choosing not to. It's easier though, and so a lot of times we end up procrastinating ourselves into making the choice when really, if we pushed ourselves to decide for once and for all we would not necessarily do things that same way. :)

I am the opposite of a procrastinator really. With this whole deal though it's that we feel like we ALREADY made the decision when we got the V (move on with two) and to go back to the drawing board is so huge. It's such a weird place to be in. To know I want something and could have it but to have done something (for good reasons at the time) that prevents this from happening.

Anyway, it feels good to move forward with it. I'm still worried about it all but more hopeful and not as sad.

SIDE NOTE :
I have to say I'm concerned about what to say to those that know we got the V. If they are questioning things if we do end up pregnant.

I know our fertility and family planning is none of their business but in reality I should have a formulated response to those that ask and I want it to be positive, happy and hopeful - not something like "It's none of your business" as that isn't my style.

What would others say to the comment "Oh my gosh, that is great, but I thought you guys had a Vasectomy?"...nothing reactive or defensive though...would love to hear thoughts.....

[Serenity]

Hi Sweetplum,

I would probably say "I guess this little one was really meant to be!" and then excuse myself before they could ask any more questions that are none of their business anyhow. :cool:

[atomic sagebrush]

"The miracle of modern technology".

Many people do go back and have either a reversal or IVF using sperm extracted from the hubby's testicles, and most people have heard of that somewhere along the way. I think that's all the explaining you'd probably need to do except for in the very most nosiest of cases. :)

[trifecta]

I would probably just own up to getting a reversal and say "We realized we really wanted one more child" or something along those lines. I think people will wonder and speculate much less if you're up-front about it.

[Sweetplum]

All fabulous responses I'll use in a variety of situations. Certain levels of friendship require more or less info....and I am a fan of mystery for the majority and frankness with my close girlfriends. Love it, keep them coming, I'm literally going to write these down so I have a list memorized ha ha.

My MIL knows we had the V and she's nosy, that will be interesting if we get there.

Thank you!

[Dreamsister]

That seems like a great plan. Don't you think you should eat more Folic Acid (or better Folate)? I think Atomic say 2000 mcg a day. What kind of cardio are you doing and when will you fit it into your day?

[Sweetplum]

Not sure. Atomic, what do you think? More FA or Folate instead? How much?

My husband is being kinda a jerk today about the whole thing. He's willing to do what I want but he's not excited about it. This brings me down a lot. I want him to be as excited as I am about the possibility of a third child. He even said today...I didn't think we would be starting over again, I'm ready to move on from this phase. Sadly, I'm not. Feeling a bit unsteady.

[atomic sagebrush]

Moms over 40 I often have them take 2000 mcg folate, this has been shown in some studies to possibly help prevent chromosomal abnormalities with the egg.

There is an old saying amongst evolutionary biologists: "Men love women, women love children, and children love hamsters (or Pokemon, or My Little Pony)" The point is, it's different for them then it is for us and we can't expect them to be as into it as us. My daughter is a baby fanatic, she can spot a baby at 100 yards. My sons are more "eh". (I know that's one of those things people say that everyone assumes is pushed by the parents but NO). WE just may be more "set" than they are for parenthood and that is ok.

Just remember, he's on a different timeline than you and you have to do what you have to do NOW to make this happen. We only get one life.

[Serenity]

Hi Sweetplum,

Sorry you're feeling unsteady. I think as long as you keep the lines of communication open between you and your DH, things will work out OK. :happy:

I do think it might be a bit too much to ask to expect your DH to be as excited as you are. It sounds like this isn't his idea and might not be his first choice of ways to move forward, but he's willing to do it anyway, because he loves you. It makes sense to me that he would feel a bit resentful about that, even as he moves forward with you.

My husband feels similarly, except he's not sure yet if he does want to move forward with TTC or not. I have so much respect for his perspective: in our household, he brings in the majority of the income, which will make him primarily responsible for financially supporting any future children. He's also a very caring and involved father. I do the majority of the childcare and housework, and obviously the negative aspects of pregnancy and birth are mine to carry, but we're a team, and it all takes two, YKWIM?

If my DH agrees to have another child with me, I won't be expecting him to be very excited about it, I'll just be grateful that he's willing to give me that gift. He's never been that excited about the prospect of a baby anyways, and he always takes a bit of time to warm up to babies even after they arrive. But he is a wonderful dad who is always there for our boys, and I trust him 100% to be there for another child once he or she actually arrives. I'm sure your husband will totally be there for his third little one, too. I agree with atomic, they just don't feel the same as us about new little ones.

[Sweetplum]

Atomic and Serenity. Such great thoughts. Thank you.

You are 100% right that I cannot expect DH to be in the same place as me. Most of the time I'm really compassionate and understanding, it's just every once in a while I get frustrated, and more than that, sad, that he doesn't feel the way it did with our first two children. When we were trying for #1 it was so exciting for both he and I. We were both so ready for a baby. For number two it was just as exciting, we suffered through a miscarriage together and supported one another through the long journey of my very scary pregnancy and all the health issues my second son had. Together 100% on the same page.

Since the V things have been different, which is totally understandable. He thought we were done and so did I, but my feelings have changed. I'm more flexible with feelings evolving, he's very firm with decisions - once he makes them he doesn't like to look back. I TOTALLY understand this. We are in a spot now where one of us is going to lose no matter what we do. I'll lose (for a while at least - until I come to terms with it which of course I will) if we don't move forward with trying for a third child. My husband will lose if we do the VR and we have a third child (at least in his mind now - but i'm sure he will come around). Our whole family could lose if things don't go well, but we could also lose if we don't take the leap as I'm sure another child would bring more joy.

Not that I typically look at what I'm losing but I think it's a really important perspective to consider from all sides versus the "What I want" side of the story. We all want things in life - but many things we want we don't get. That is life. More important right now is how can we minimize the loss for us as a team and for our family in general. It's no longer about everyone getting what we want.

Anyway, just rambling. Thank you for the responses.

Another thing to note is that in terms of our family structure I make 50% of the income for the family and I do about 90% of the child - rearing. My husband is amazing and has an incredible job that is creative and contributing to society in many ways - plus he loves it and he's good at it. BUT - he will not foot the whole bill of the child. I will support the child as much as he financially and I'll be more busy with raising it. So it will not put him out as much as me. He's not really worried about this though - we talked again last night a bit and he's just worried about health concerns for all. He did say that if we get through the VR and the pregnancy and come out with a healthy baby he will be very very happy and have no issues. It's the risk that worries him not the end result.

Better get to work.
I really appreciate all the comments and honesty here. It's nice to be able to talk about this!
SP

[Serenity]

Hi Sweetplum,

Just to be clear: I TOTALLY understand your perspective, because I share it! I actually feel like in this situation, assuming all goes well, the only real loss is on the DW's part, because let's face it, good fathers embrace their children and gain so much out of those relationships. Having another child would not be a loss for DH, and not having one would be a huge loss for me.

I just think that your best shot at moving forward happily together is gaining a deep understanding and appreciation of where your DH is coming from. If he feels like his concerns are being heard, he's more likely to be softer towards you. At least that's how it works in our relationship...he sounds like a sweetheart; like he just wants to protect you and your family. :happy:

I completely understand and agree with everything you wrote. I sometimes wish DH and I were on the same page, too. I hope it all works out for you just the way you want. :hug2:

[bigbump]

Hi sweetplum.

I've just found your post, don't know how I missed it before. I remember your original post which really resonated with me at the time.

For me, another 40 year old, who 'should' be done, and doesn't feel that way deep down, it seems to me that the fact that you are continually returning to this question, of 'am I done?' answers it and tells me that you are not.

I also agree with the others that men are not as involved in this as we are emotionally. For me, mine has emphatically said he doesn't want anymore so one of us will also 'lose'. It's tough to lose, but it's also tough to force your husband to 'lose' too. There's no easy answer for that one. When it's 'do we or don't we?' there is no compromise.

However I do think that for our husbands, the objection to the abstract notion of the unborn child would dissolve when that child arrived. I asked my husband if it would really be that bad or life changing to have one more. Of course we could say that forever, if we were younger, but we're not so it really would be one last baby.

My husband had children before we met so I never had that first baby together excitement that you experienced. Some people just don't get that. It's great that you had that joint excitement two times!

Good luck with your decision and the VR. After that, what will be will be. X


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[Sweetplum]

When it's 'do we or don't we?' there is no compromise.

Thank you for writing. This is the crux of it. One of us will have to compromise a lot more than the other and there is always the possibility that this will cause resentment....

You are right, I'm not ready to move on but I'm also feeling bad for forcing my husband to revisit something that we both felt we did decided on together two years ago.
It's more of a life lesson on making decisions now. I made a decision which was OK at the time but now is not....I simply changed my mind.

Do I :
1. Be gentle with myself and move on with the decision to stop having kids and possibly feel a sense of loss but just accept that in life we sometimes have to accept our decisions...
2. Be gentle with myself for making the a decision in the past where now I feel differently and work with my husband to undo it...

I don't think either is right or wrong if they are approached with love and compassion for all parties. They both are OK.

Right now I'm obviously leaning towards undoing it but I'm not totally convinced that is right either. Sure I may get what I want if we do, but is that the "RIGHT" decision? I don't know. Life isn't about me anymore, it's about "husbandwife" as one unit, and about my two beautiful sons too.

I may never know what is right no matter what I do.

[Dreamsister]

Not sure. Atomic, what do you think? More FA or Folate instead? How much?

My husband is being kinda a jerk today about the whole thing. He's willing to do what I want but he's not excited about it. This brings me down a lot. I want him to be as excited as I am about the possibility of a third child. He even said today...I didn't think we would be starting over again, I'm ready to move on from this phase. Sadly, I'm not. Feeling a bit unsteady.

My DH is not exited at all about a possible forth child. He also feel we are done. But he is such a sweetheart and do it for me. I am deeply gratefull for this. What a gift and offer. After he has comitted to the plan I don't bring the baby subject up. At all. I don't talk about it or show my exitement. My children don't know my desire and that we are TTC'ing. I just work on it secretly. Do my diet, cardio. I pray that I will get a BFP before DH change his mind. He is a very comitted, caring and loving father, so I am sure that if we get lucky he will fell in love with another child but I don't expect him to be exited beforehand. Actually I am truly impressed he has comitted to TTC.

I think it is better you show your DH how much you love him and are gratefull that he is willing to do the VR to make a baby with you. You can't expect him to be as exited as you.

Just my thoughts [emoji120]


DS1 (9) ❤️ DS2 (8) [emoji173] DS3 (5) ❤️ DW (41) [emoji1326] DH (38) [emoji144] TTC'ing pink from May 2016

[Sweetplum]

Dreamsister you are 100% right...as are all who have commented in this....I need to remember that DH is in a different place as me and that is OK.

I want to make it very very clear that although I get frustrated and sad from his reactions sometimes it doesn't mean I am mad at him or don't understand him. I totally do. We are just in a hard spot and it's OK for him to feel the way he does and me to feel the way I do. We are listening to each other and still very close. I just don't feel totally comfortable doing things in secret - I'm too transparent to be successful at doing things undercover - or doing things only for myself.

The boys have been really cranky lately too which is a drain. I think it's the end of summer itch - they need a bit of structure - but they are on each other all the time. The amount of discipline and attention these two take is huge right now....it's a season of course, but it's B.U.S.Y and emotionally tiring. Of course, in between the moments of total exasperation they do the sweetest things that make my heart explode, as 2 and 5 year old boys do.

[Dreamsister]

Dreamsister you are 100% right...as are all who have commented in this....I need to remember that DH is in a different place as me and that is OK.

I want to make it very very clear that although I get frustrated and sad from his reactions sometimes it doesn't mean I am mad at him or don't understand him. I totally do. We are just in a hard spot and it's OK for him to feel the way he does and me to feel the way I do. We are listening to each other and still very close. I just don't feel totally comfortable doing things in secret - I'm too transparent to be successful at doing things undercover - or doing things only for myself.

The boys have been really cranky lately too which is a drain. I think it's the end of summer itch - they need a bit of structure - but they are on each other all the time. The amount of discipline and attention these two take is huge right now....it's a season of course, but it's B.U.S.Y and emotionally tiring. Of course, in between the moments of total exasperation they do the sweetest things that make my heart explode, as 2 and 5 year old boys do.

Sometimes when our boys are cranky, fighting and really enoying DH looks at me while shaking his head in wonder and say: and you want to throw another child in the mix!!! He truly mean we have our hands full with 3 boys aged 6, 8 and 9, a dog, a big house and two full time jobs! He thinks that we have finally reached a stage in our life where we have more freedom as a family and couple. And he is so right so I don't blame him for expressing his doubts about me wanting to carry out my dream for one more child. I also agree with him that I am selfish and egoistic for wanting to go on with MY dream about a big family because he don't want this and despite his opposition. As time goes by he don't express his worries so much anymore. He has given up on changing my mind and is now cooperating. He even takes OLE! And I keep telling him how much I love him and show him lots of surplus energy.

I know how it feels with kids being too long on vacacion being ready for structure and the daily grind.


DS1 (9) ❤️ DS2 (8) [emoji173] DS3 (5) ❤️ DW (41) [emoji1326] DH (38) [emoji144] TTC'ing pink from May 2016

[atomic sagebrush]

Please bump this for me as I do have things to add but out of time for the day. :heart:

[Sweetplum]

Bump.
Atomic. Honest - Honest - Do not hold back - opinion. Do you think I should do this...go forward with the VR and take all the risks on #3.
I need a detached totally blunt opinion.
Thanx.

[Shannshaff]

I am going to jump in here. I just read the whole post and I will say, that you know deep down, in your heart, what you truly want. Just do a bit of soul searching. It is right in front of you. If you can't let this go, then there is your answer.

As for your DH, I have not seen anyone else mention this. Yes, he is willing to do anything to make you happy. Yes, he loves you. Yes, you understand his point of view. But he has some very legitimate concerns:
1. He has to have a long difficult surgery to make this dream happen. And, as a typical person, he does not want to have a surgery. And can you blame him?
2. You had a VERY tramatic pregnancy and birth with you last son. He is VERY scared of loosing you. Again. rightfully so.
So, honestly, I would not expect him to be on the same excitement level that you are. And that is totally OK as you have stated. Just do what you have been doing and support him and your family to the best of your ability.

My DH does not necessarily want another child.(I am not even sure of it some days.) But he tells me regularly that he regrets not being able to give me a little girl. (As you can see we lost our twin girls last pg). And that makes me sad and re-enforces the dream and desire for a daughter. He also does not use protection at all, so since I have not had PPAF yet, we are NTNP at the moment. I am loosely doing the diet, no supps except Folic Acid and just started the exercising (very mild) in the event that we do get pg I can at least know I did my best. I am 40 as well and know that time is not on my side. Hope this helps a little.

[Sweetplum]

I am going to jump in here. I just read the whole post and I will say, that you know deep down, in your heart, what you truly want. Just do a bit of soul searching. It is right in front of you. If you can't let this go, then there is your answer.

As for your DH, I have not seen anyone else mention this. Yes, he is willing to do anything to make you happy. Yes, he loves you. Yes, you understand his point of view. But he has some very legitimate concerns:
1. He has to have a long difficult surgery to make this dream happen. And, as a typical person, he does not want to have a surgery. And can you blame him?
2. You had a VERY tramatic pregnancy and birth with you last son. He is VERY scared of loosing you. Again. rightfully so.
So, honestly, I would not expect him to be on the same excitement level that you are. And that is totally OK as you have stated. Just do what you have been doing and support him and your family to the best of your ability.

My DH does not necessarily want another child.(I am not even sure of it some days.) But he tells me regularly that he regrets not being able to give me a little girl. (As you can see we lost our twin girls last pg). And that makes me sad and re-enforces the dream and desire for a daughter. He also does not use protection at all, so since I have not had PPAF yet, we are NTNP at the moment. I am loosely doing the diet, no supps except Folic Acid and just started the exercising (very mild) in the event that we do get pg I can at least know I did my best. I am 40 as well and know that time is not on my side. Hope this helps a little.

Thank you for posting.

You are so right I do know what I want to do : I want to have another baby and sway for a girl (but be thrilled with either). This is 100% what I want. No question.

But - I am not sure if what I want is something that is putting my husband, myself and my family at risk so much that I have to let it go. You are totally right about the surgery for DH, he's nervous and I don't blame him - I actually blame myself for even allowing the V. I feel it's my fault for not understanding that I wasn't ready at the time. The guilt from this causes a lot of pain for me too. I just don't know. If something ever happened to him during the surgery, me during pregnancy or birth or a possible baby I would have even more regret than I would just letting this dream of baby 3 go.

That said, I won't know what will happen unless I try.

People typically take risks when they have nothing to lose...their lives are rough or there is a lot of room for improvement. For me that is not the case. My life is very very good, not perfect of course but we are comfortable, happy and healthy and have so much to look forward to.

Is my desire for another baby worth risking this ideal and happy life we are living? That is more the question I'm trying to understand.

[atomic sagebrush]

I do want to address something Sweetplum mentioned - the financial aspects of all this - for those of us who are not equal earners to our husbands. Most of us are in a different boat where our husbands are the primary earners and we are either SAHMs or make a lot less than they do. I know that for me personally this has been a sticking point between my DH and I - that he has "wasted all this money" on "me and my kids" blah blah blah BUT when I stopped to add it all up, I found that the money that I had brought into the marriage, either that I earned myself or that my family had given to me, paid for every penny of my childbearing adventures and then some. And then the things that it didn't, like cars and housing expenses and heat and food and so on - those things were set expenditures that my husband would have been buying anyway.

So this idea that we were in some sort of completely unequitable situation where he slaved away so I could stay at home eating bonbons and popping out babies was really very misrepresented and unfair. His income goes almost entirely towards either set living expenses that he would have had anyway, or things that were primarily at his personal discretion and not mine (our living arrangements which were far more expensive than they had to be due to his pursuing his own personal dream, his choosing to work certain less lucrative jobs than others, etc). The money I have brought into the relationship, while not as much as he has brought in, still was more than enough to cover my kid related expenses and I suspect that a lot of us are in the same boat when we take a closer look at it.

So many of us sacrificed financially in order for our husbands to pursue education or jobs or so on - possibly even sacrificing future earning potential to preserve our husband's future earning potential - working instead of finishing our educations, so he can finish school or not working so we don't have to pay child care. This is often coupled with financial sacrifices that many of us make in terms of our husband's overall career happiness - like we are supportive of him working a less stressful job, fewer hours, or taking up a different career or educational path in mid****** even though it may cause financial hardships that affect the entire family and our futures negatively. But then this one thing, we are just supposed to give up, because, money. Even when their choices are the reason why we don't HAVE the money. It doesn't track at all. Our happiness matters too, ladies, and I just really urge you guys to look out for numero uno (and dos and tres LOL) because no one else will do it for you. :)

[atomic sagebrush]

I don't think the stakes are the same for them as it is for us, Big Bump.

When they "lose" they get another child with their DNA to love. Yes it's a bit more work (but nothing like it is for us) and they may have to spend a little money but the benefits in the long term are huge.

When we "lose" we get nothing except that the door closes for us forever. They can still go on to have more children in future relationships and while I would hope that none of our husbands would ever do such a thing, it happens often enough that I think we must take it into account. Jeff Goldblum, Steve Martin, Alec Baldwin, George Lucas, Bruce Willis, Hugh Grant, David Letterman, a lot of these guys left long trails of childless women behind them to start up again with some new young woman. We can't do that.

Really - they don't lose. In no scenario do they lose. Only we lose. They always win. Look out for yourselves.

[bigbump]

I totally agree Atomic. My Hb and I had this exact conversation. He was all 'one of us has to give' and I said 'would it really be so bad to have another?' Yes, two of our kids would have to share a room, yes we would perhaps need a bigger car, but so what?? These things aren't important. What I'm giving up the chance of is a huge sacrifice in my eyes.

Having said that I am not a woman who always envisioned a large family, so I have shifted the goal posts on him, but that's my prerogative. As it is yours sweetplum. No one has a crystal ball and you didn't realise you would feel this way. Neither did I.



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[atomic sagebrush]

I agree totally that is your prerogative to change your mind. They shift the goalposts on us all the time - want to go back to school, change jobs, move...my husband chose to work 365 days a year for 7 years straight one decade and then the next decade, did not have a job for 2 years - neither of which was my choice or that I EVER saw coming before it happened, and both of which definitely interfered with my plans for my life and family. He had also agreed to 5-6 kids before we ever got married and then changed his mind on that as well. I know I seem kind of "foaming at the mouth" on this topic sometimes but it's only because I feel like just about every other message out there in the media and society as a whole is "Woman should sacrifice everything for man's happiness and allow him to pursue his every bucket-listed whim in order for him to feel fulfilled in life, and if he dumps her, it was her fault because she got fat and didn't put out enough". I don't think it's too much to demand some level of reciprocity especially given the biological reality that for us, this decision is forever.

It was only because I was finally able to see past the cultural brainwashing that I was able to allow myself to be selfish and insist upon my wishes, that I have a daughter and my 2 younger sons as well. I had to bend and even break some rules that had been very deeply ingrained upon me, to get the family that I wanted and so I do encourage you guys not to give up without a fight if it is something that is highly important to you to pursue. :)

[trifecta]

Just a few thoughts: I agree about the cultural bias against women and the unfairness of men monopolizing women's childbearing years only to easily start families with younger women later but I don't think the desire to have a child is in itself a good enough reason to do it.

The worst case scenario isn't the mother not realizing her dream of having more kids. The worst-case scenario is a child being born into a family that is overextended, unstable, or unhealthy.

I think there are all kinds of healthy, happy families, including families with single mothers or tons of kids or other scenarios society tells us are not ideal, but whatever situation you bring a child into needs to be approached with clear eyes. I think our first question should always be what kind of mother/family/situation we would want to have lived with a child.

That said, Sweetplum's husband has said he's willing. I would take it at face value. It's normal for partners to have differing levels of enthusiasm. I guess I would say that if you generally agree but just aren't in precise harmony about it you shouldn't feel bad about being the one to make the decision.

[Sweetplum]

Hi. Really enjoy reading the thoughts and insights right now.

My situation is actually a bit of the opposite in terms of cultural biases. I tend to be the more 'monopolizing' one in the relationship if one of us would be characterized this way.

99% of the time, however, we are equal.

My husband and I are both Architects, we make mostly the same salary (based on bonuses and how our small firms do each year), we both serve on boards in our community and we both respect one another in terms goals, dreams and hopes for the future. I am older however (4 years) and have had more life experiences through travel and my education so often my husband's career defers to mine as I am an Associate in my firm and my husband is not. My husband works very hard and is doing really innovative work - which he doesn't get paid for but he enjoys, he's also new at this position so he has to 'pay his dues', I don't really - my position is pretty stable and I can ask for pretty much anything I want (I took 9 months off with both boys and I would do the same with another baby)....and now I only work 4 days a week for 6 hours a day and get paid well, I've worked really really really hard in my past (20s and 30s) so now I'm reaping the benefits of waiting and working for two decades.

Anyway - this dynamic kinda complicates things a bit since I know my husband feels that we often defer to my wishes in the relationship since I can be the more powerful one in many ways.

Another factor that comes into play is my family. My dad is successful and my parents are really generous so they give us a lot and loan us $ at low rates for building our lives. I think my husband feels he owes my dad for all that he does for us, so sometimes he gives into every single wish of mine in order to 'keep me happy' and thus my dad pleased. I don't like him to give in to me too much but he is very accommodating in general - his personality is just this way. He's moderate. Thankfully I'm aware of this and I try not to take advantage of my husband's willingness to do anything for me or lean on my parents more than they offer...but all this creates a dynamic that allows me to always "get what i want". It's always been like this for me. I'm kinda spoiled, and it has caused issues in my life, I'm trying to learn how to 'not always get what I want' I guess.....

With a third child I'm so realistic and hesitant because i'm not sure if what i want is good for our current family. A third child would be loved, nurtured, well taken care of and adored for his/her whole life, I just don't know if my body can produce a healthy child at this point and if I should continue to always get everything i want in life.

SP.

PS - Our current plan is still the same - he is scheduled for the VR on October 21st. My husband finishes up a huge deadline in early October, my eldest son is beginning Kindergarten at a French Immersion school in early September and we are planning on remodeling our home significantly - so the next few months are busy. We plan to see how we handle the first few months of my son's transition while we are all busy with work and home remodel - if it goes well and both sons are happy and doing well and relationship between DH and I is strong and loving we will proceed. If any of us are struggling or overwhelmed we will re-evaluate.

[trifecta]

No couple is totally in sync at all times, but from your description it seems like you have a true partnership and you both consider each other's feelings.

(Above, I was just responding to the general discussion of whether women should TTC in spite of an unwilling partner. I've known at least three couples who went ahead with their plans to have more kids in spite of truly vicious, unhealthy fighting and it always struck me as a horrible decision.)

One other thing you might want to consider is that if he goes through with the reversal he might then really want to go ahead with TTC to make it worthwhile.

[atomic sagebrush]

There are certainly gals who ride the baby train too long but I think in a convo of what is pretty clearly well off women contemplating going from 2 to 3 that's not what we're dealing with here. Please view my statements thru that lens.

I think let's all be careful with tossing around worst case scenarios. I'm sure there are many of us who experience judgement from others based on things that may to outsiders look chaotic, unstable, unhealthy, etc. Sometimes things get better. Some of us are just emotional Mediterranean types that fight and make up and are loud and emotional. Sometimes, things are beautiful, calm, and peaceful to outsiders and everything is a disaster inside (a cold, quiet, unhealthy disaster) or a sudden decision out of the blue turns everything upside down.

I think that we're here to discuss growing our families and since I have an admittedly unique take on that I feel compelled to share a different angle, for whatever it is worth. :)

[Sweetplum]

Yes. Strangely the couples that seem so happy and perfect and well adjusted are always the ones that don't seem to make it. We try to be authentic which some times is messy and imperfect, and I like that in my friends too. Better not to care at all what others think since there will always be a huge group that don't see life the same way and will judge.

On another note, is drinking Coke Zero (aspartame) going to totally ruin my girl sway?
I can give up for a few weeks but then I cave....
I will be strict and cut out if it's important but if not, I'd rather not freak out over it.
How many is too many per day if it's OK....

[trifecta]

I don't know any perfect families (you know the saying "The only normal people are the ones you don't know very well") but bringing up a child together is a big undertaking--it's good that you and your husband like as well as love each other and you respect each other's opinions.

If anything I think Diet Coke would help because it's so unhealthy.

[essnce629]

It sounds like you have a great relationship and DH and if I was in your situation I would 100% go for it and not look back. A reversal doesn't guarantee a baby, but you'll never know if you don't try and I would personally regret not trying.

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[Sweetplum]

Thank you.

I'm struggling with the sway to be totally honest. We are still moving forward with our plans and husband jokes a bit about it now which means we are turning the corner from serious to just a fact of life. But the sway is kinda hard for me....

I struggle to 'fast' for long periods of time and really like breakfast.

I can absolutely not fit in 60 min of exercise everyday let alone 4-5 days a week. I'm just sitting down at my computer at 10.30pm after running around non stop at work, kids stuff and evening events. I'd have to give up time at work, with my children or with my other commitments to fit in exercise and there is no way I can wake up an hour early to do it as I'm really tired as it is. I feel like I'm already stretched too thin to fit this in. I'm not a 'workout' person anyway, i'm fit but I never go to the gym, just walks around the block and mostly chasing after boys.

I like 'calorie dense' healthy foods like nuts, cerals, avocados, etc. I don't eat tons of them, but I like them....

I don't like feeling deprived. I'm so busy and tired a lot of the time that eating well and regularly keeps me mentally, emotionally and physically fit...I feel off on this diet. I basically hate any sort of diet or plan for my eating and drinking....I don't like strict routines at all.

Maybe I'm doing it wrong?

Being veggie is easy for me though, I'm not a huge meat eater so I like this part of the sway.

I guess for the most part I'm starting to wonder if I care enough to do the sway - I'm feeling lazy. I want a baby, would love a girl but excited about a boy too, but not sure if I'm dedicated enough to plan all this stuff out and follow through with it now, during TTC and until we possibly get pregnant. Maybe it's my growing indifference towards gender and excitement about another child that is making me lazy.

Oh well.

[Dreamsister]

Yes. Strangely the couples that seem so happy and perfect and well adjusted are always the ones that don't seem to make it. We try to be authentic which some times is messy and imperfect, and I like that in my friends too. Better not to care at all what others think since there will always be a huge group that don't see life the same way and will judge.

On another note, is drinking Coke Zero (aspartame) going to totally ruin my girl sway?
I can give up for a few weeks but then I cave....
I will be strict and cut out if it's important but if not, I'd rather not freak out over it.
How many is too many per day if it's OK....

You are so right about that Sweetplum. Perfect is boring.

I was told that Coke Zero is good for pink swayers. I drink it, but not everyday.


DS1 (9) ❤️ DS2 (8) [emoji173] DS3 (5) ❤️ DW (41) [emoji1326] DH (38) [emoji144] TTC'ing pink from May 2016

[atomic sagebrush]

Ok. I HAD TO make a diet because people wanted me to. But the secret is that you don't HAVE to do the diet perfectly, mostly, or even at all to get a girl. you can do none of it, and still get a girl. That is ok. What I would strongly suggest that everyone do is not look at the LE Diet as this "you must do everything exactly like this or you will have a boy" and instead, look at it as like a set of goalposts to aim at. But at the end of it all, all you really need to do is move your diet in a more "pink" direction than it was when you got your boys. That is what your body knows. your body doesn't know some crap I wrote on a piece of paper 6 years ago. It knows "I was getting this much food, and now I'm getting this much".

Boy moms tend to be all or nothing thinkers and so people get overly hung up on following every letter of LE but all you have to do is be more pink friendly than you were. :)

So, what I would do is just go vegetarian (being sure to get your protein and fat from primarily vegetable sources), drink coffee, some wine if you like it, Diet Coke is said to sway pink anyway. you can have things like nuts and avocado now and then. There are no forbidden foods on LE (altho I would keep the cereal to a dull roar if you can)

Walking counts as exercise and if you live in a city and walk for an hour at any point during the day, that counts. I would try to get it in one burst if you can.

[Dreamsister]

Thank you.

I'm struggling with the sway to be totally honest. We are still moving forward with our plans and husband jokes a bit about it now which means we are turning the corner from serious to just a fact of life. But the sway is kinda hard for me....

I struggle to 'fast' for long periods of time and really like breakfast.

I can absolutely not fit in 60 min of exercise everyday let alone 4-5 days a week. I'm just sitting down at my computer at 10.30pm after running around non stop at work, kids stuff and evening events. I'd have to give up time at work, with my children or with my other commitments to fit in exercise and there is no way I can wake up an hour early to do it as I'm really tired as it is. I feel like I'm already stretched too thin to fit this in. I'm not a 'workout' person anyway, i'm fit but I never go to the gym, just walks around the block and mostly chasing after boys.

I like 'calorie dense' healthy foods like nuts, cerals, avocados, etc. I don't eat tons of them, but I like them....

I don't like feeling deprived. I'm so busy and tired a lot of the time that eating well and regularly keeps me mentally, emotionally and physically fit...I feel off on this diet. I basically hate any sort of diet or plan for my eating and drinking....I don't like strict routines at all.

Maybe I'm doing it wrong?

Being veggie is easy for me though, I'm not a huge meat eater so I like this part of the sway.

I guess for the most part I'm starting to wonder if I care enough to do the sway - I'm feeling lazy. I want a baby, would love a girl but excited about a boy too, but not sure if I'm dedicated enough to plan all this stuff out and follow through with it now, during TTC and until we possibly get pregnant. Maybe it's my growing indifference towards gender and excitement about another child that is making me lazy.

Oh well.

Sweetplum, you sound a lot like me! I think you are in a wonderfull position where you care less and less about this fucking gender thing. Do what you can, don't obsess, have faith and certainly also try to have fun doing it. Life is so short so we better enjoy the best we can. Happy your DH seems to have accepted the fact that you might be parents again. Have a great weekend.


DS1 (9) ❤️ DS2 (8) [emoji173] DS3 (5) ❤️ DW (41) [emoji1326] DH (38) [emoji144] TTC'ing pink from May 2016

[atomic sagebrush]

^^^ I think we need a new acronym - this FGT (fucking gender thing)!! :rofl:

[Sweetplum]

Hello all.
I wanted to just give you an update and say farewell. After a few weeks of deep thinking, soul-searching and meditation I've decided to move on with my happy and full life with my two boys.

I know I will always have a bit of baby-fever and will never fully accept being done with the 'childbearing years', I loved being a new mom, nursing, birthing, long walks, anticipating each new milestone while watching my babies change in incredible ways each day. It's like being high for me really, being a new mom, full of so much joy and love - there is nothing else like it.

But two weeks ago life offered us an exciting new adventure, a really amazing opportunity for me professionally. This new door being opened for my life and ultimately for our family has made me realize that although wrapping up the baby stage is not easy for me, I'm ready to move on with my dear husband and our two wonderful little boys and appreciate all I have in the present. Turning down this opportunity would be a poor choice for me, it just sounds too fun and too exciting. And I cannot take on this new career path and go through a vasectomy reversal, TTC, pregnancy and birth again. I had to choose and I'm choosing my two sons and my husband and fulfilling my childhood career dreams for myself. This choice is very much about me and my life goals and also about ensuring less risk for my two children I have as well as my husband's health.

This opportunity sealed the deal for me, it's time to move on.

Best wishes to all of you. Thank you for being here and allowing me to process this all over the past year, it has been really emotional for me and depressing at time to feel so unsure of everything. Going through all this alone would have been very lonely, thank you for the support.
XO Sweetplum

[Complex Emotions]

Congratulations Sweetplum, how exciting! From what I've read on this site, finding new opportunities for personal growth and or career fulfillment is a great way to combat lingering GD feelings. Your decision is inspiring!

[Dreamsister]

Wauhh, Sweetplum. What a decision. It sounds that you have finally made up your mind. I am really happy for you. GL with moving forward with new challenging adventures.

I once asked a wise woman about her opinion about my yearning for a baby and she urged me to rack my soul because the solution was not necessarily a baby. It could also be a new and more creative job, a travel, more love or changes in my private live.

The right decision is NOT always the easiest one to make. It takes a lot of courage. Your decision is in particular inspiring to me. I am sure you will find peace with it because this is the right thing to do for you and your family.

I will definately miss your company and want to thank your for all your straightforward and honest posts.

Take care and enjoy.

[Pink Pony]

Wishing you everything of the best for your future and your new opportunities

[atomic sagebrush]

Excellent!! Wishing you all the best moving forward with this new opportunity! :heart:

[Sweetplum]

Well. It has been about a year since I joined this site and a few months since I left...

My new job is amazing. I absolutely feel fulfilled,challenged and excited by it.

But I keep coming back to thoughts of another baby. I'm starting to realize that these feelings will not go away for a while, most likely menopause but maybe never.

I told my husband that I think I have to just schedule the reversal, that it's now or never. That if I don't I may not really bounce back. That sounds so dramatic and I'm embarrassed by the way I feel to be honest.

Why can't I just move on?

I want a girl desperately yes, but the thought of a baby boy makes me happy too. I want the craziness of more...sadly my husband really doesn't and time is not my friend.

I am just worried I'll never feel totally happy again, which, once again is depressing since I have a perfectly amazing life and family as it is.

[XXforhubby]

I've been thinking of how you are getting a long! I'm glad you like your new job!

Be kind to yourself. When it comes to matters of the heart, they cannot always be rationalized while at the same time being completely valid. The heart wants what the heart wants. I don't think it is a matter of being fulfilled by what you have- you seem very satisfied with your family. Rather it seems that someone else is missing.

I hope that your DH becomes on board with the decision to TTC, since he is the one getting a procedure done to make it happen. Don't beat yourself up over this, if it is something you truly want. From my experience with having a DH waffling with having another child, it may be easier for him to come around to the idea if he can see that you really want it and can handle it. My DH cancelled his vasectomy last month and is excited about having a 4th child after spending all of last year not wanting another. He said that my unwavering desire and calmness about our current family made him able to see how we can manage having a 4th child. I'm not saying it will be easy, but having the right frame of mind about adding another child to the family and talking it through with him will help.

I'll be sending you clarity of mind and strength your way! Hang in there sweetie!



[emoji170][emoji1379]DS1, [emoji577]DS2, & [emoji602]DS3[emoji170]
[emoji166]One Last Pink Sway[emoji166]
https://www.fertilityfriend.com/home/579920/thumb.png
My Ovulation Chart (https://www.fertilityfriend.com/home/579920)

[atomic sagebrush]

Because I had my two boys, and then 13 years later, had the three little ones, I think people tended to open up to me about this issue more than they do normally. And I would guess a good 30 women, at the least, told me that they had always wanted one more child but their husband said no. These were strangers - people I met in doctors offices or the supermarket or the library. They would ask about my weird family and then immediately tell me the story - women of all ages, too. Young, old, everywhere in between. It was just an immediate reaction so it was something that was obviously a part of them, something that was on their minds, almost like it was a shared female emotion or something :)

There are two things I take away from that experience:

1)That many of us just have the desire for one more. I feel done, but I often wish I had sneaked in an extra one or two between DS 2 and 3. I was just thinking about it this morning. sometimes dream that I'm pregnant and I feel happy about it (even though it would probably kill me LOL - kids and I have been sick for a month straight and I feel like one germ away from the asylum) So this may be a natural feeling that we all have from time to time, and maybe just something that never totally goes away. (although I do know a fair number of women who just aren't that into it, no right or wrong of course)

2)That at the same time, since so many women do have this feeling, maybe, just maybe, it's worth listening to. Do some women ride the baby train too long and have more kids than they probably should, yeah, but most of us are NOT those people. Most of us have 1-3 kids and could easily take care of 1-2 more without any great suffering on anyone's part. It may even be good for our husbands and other kids - my husband dotes on our littler ones in a way that he never did with our older two, and I think that overall it's been highly beneficial for my 3 to have just that much less one on one time. Yes, you read that right. I was my parents' only child and ALL the attention was on me for better or for worse - usually for worse. I find that my 3 smaller kids benefit hugely in terms of me not doing everything for them, having more independence, being self-starters, etc than my first two did. So it's not always a question of us "doing bad things" to our hubbies and kids, and if we find it fulfilling, maybe that is all the justification we need. :)

YOLO.

[Sweetplum]

I am going to do it. VR will be on February 17.
Will need a lot of vibes and prayers for health....

[XXforhubby]

I am going to do it. VR will be on February 17.
Will need a lot of vibes and prayers for health....

You got it sweetie. I'm sending lots of strength and health your way [emoji8][emoji94]



[emoji170][emoji1379]DS1, [emoji577]DS2, & [emoji602]DS3[emoji170]
[emoji166]One Last Pink Sway[emoji166]
https://www.fertilityfriend.com/home/579920/thumb.png
My Ovulation Chart (https://www.fertilityfriend.com/home/579920)

[Birthfree]

I have 5 kids, I'm 40, I was done having kids... and here I am. I suffered huge depression and anxiety for more than a year - like take medication for it, see a counselor kind. Because of wanting another baby so much and my husband really not.

It was quite the year...

My husband decided after I spent some serious soul searching trying to take note of what he was trying to tell me (and finally succeeding)... that he's great with another baby. [emoji15] Astounded sort of doesn't cover how I feel about it. We met with our counselor to be sure (for me to be sure) he wasn't changing his mind just to make me happy. I was afraid of moving forward with a husband who hated being a stay at home Dad to a new baby.

I feel like sometimes we can't get rid of that feeling because we aren't supposed to... that someone else is waiting for us. Maybe that's hokey.

I wish you the best of luck and health, moving forward. [emoji175]

[Dreamsister]

Sweetplum. Yeahhhhh. VR-date set. That's great news. I am sure you are doing the right thing. So happy your DH is on board.


Mother to 3 handsome boys ❤️ and pregnant with a baby girl due in June 2017 [emoji120]. DW (41) [emoji1326] DH (38) [emoji144]

[Sweetplum]

Thank you all :)
I just purchased the TTC girl bundle. Can someone tell me how to access the questionnaire I need to fill out for Atomic?
Other tips. Having a hard time figuring out next step.

[atomic sagebrush]

Thanks for your purchase!! The questionnaires are here in this link (you have to scroll down past another couple of questionnaires though) http://genderdreaming.com/forum/misc.php?do=forms

[atomic sagebrush]

Thank you all :)
I just purchased the TTC girl bundle. Can someone tell me how to access the questionnaire I need to fill out for Atomic?
Other tips. Having a hard time figuring out next step.

Once I get the questionnaire I'll make the plan but you can always hit me up between then and now with any questions or concerns.

One thing that jumps out at me right this minute is PLEASE do not have your husband start any supps until after he is fully recovered from his surgery. Even if tons of other people are on them, they may cause harmful side effects were a person to take them prior to surgery. :)

[Sweetplum]

Once I get the questionnaire I'll make the plan but you can always hit me up between then and now with any questions or concerns.

One thing that jumps out at me right this minute is PLEASE do not have your husband start any supps until after he is fully recovered from his surgery. Even if tons of other people are on them, they may cause harmful side effects were a person to take them prior to surgery. :)

Thanks Atomic. I just filled out the questionnaires. I plan to go to Whole Foods tomorrow to pick up a few things - if you get this note in the next few hours let me know if I should pick up any supplements for myself. I'm currently taking 120mg of Ubiquinol and 800 MCG of folic acid (not folate). If you have suggestions I'll grab stuff trmw...

[Godislove]

Hi!! I'm new here... well I read the girl sway threads all the time but I never post. Congrats on the vr and girl sway!! Lots of luck to you!!
I was actually curious though if atomic had any thoughts on whether vr swayed pink??
Iam 31, my dh had his vr in March of last year only to find out last month that it was unsuccessful and he will have to have a redo vr. I had cut out cereal, meats (except egg whites), no breakfast eat around 11:00 am and cut off at 6;00. Sometime I broke it cause my sugar would drop when I exercised to much. Sorry I'm getting off topic �� Now with me not knowing if he'll even be able to have kids Im seriously dreading starting a diet again... so I was curoius if after our 2 boys and two reverse vasectomies is the chance of a girl away increased because of his lower sperm count?
Any input on diet and anything else is GREATLY appreciated!!
Sweetplum, I just wanted to say congrats again on your job and vr!!! Best wishes to you and yours!!!!!!!!!!!!

[atomic sagebrush]

I do think VR sways pink - no guarantee but yes.

You would still need to do a diet. But you were eating a pretty restrictive diet by the sound of it, we may be able to work it out so it's much easier for you to stick with, please start a thread where I can help!

[atomic sagebrush]

Thanks Atomic. I just filled out the questionnaires. I plan to go to Whole Foods tomorrow to pick up a few things - if you get this note in the next few hours let me know if I should pick up any supplements for myself. I'm currently taking 120mg of Ubiquinol and 800 MCG of folic acid (not folate). If you have suggestions I'll grab stuff trmw...

I have your questionnaire!! I am of the less is more approach with the supps. Some take fiber but I am probably not going to have you do that to hopefully boost odds of conception a bit.

[Sweetplum]

I have your questionnaire!! I am of the less is more approach with the supps. Some take fiber but I am probably not going to have you do that to hopefully boost odds of conception a bit.

Sounds good. Looking forward to hearing your insights. Have a great weekend.

[Sweetplum]

Hi!! I'm new here... well I read the girl sway threads all the time but I never post. Congrats on the vr and girl sway!! Lots of luck to you!!
I was actually curious though if atomic had any thoughts on whether vr swayed pink??
Iam 31, my dh had his vr in March of last year only to find out last month that it was unsuccessful and he will have to have a redo vr. I had cut out cereal, meats (except egg whites), no breakfast eat around 11:00 am and cut off at 6;00. Sometime I broke it cause my sugar would drop when I exercised to much. Sorry I'm getting off topic �� Now with me not knowing if he'll even be able to have kids Im seriously dreading starting a diet again... so I was curoius if after our 2 boys and two reverse vasectomies is the chance of a girl away increased because of his lower sperm count?
Any input on diet and anything else is GREATLY appreciated!!
Sweetplum, I just wanted to say congrats again on your job and vr!!! Best wishes to you and yours!!!!!!!!!!!!

Godislove,
Thank you for the post. I'm sorry to hear about the VR not working out the first time. Wanted to ask how your DH handeled the VR, was it painful - how was his recovery? How is he handling things knowing he will be having another surgery? Why did it not work the first time around? Just curious - would like to hear as much as you are willing to share.

Interesting point about VR swaying girl.

In terms of my own personal diet. I've been experimenting with LE for about a year now : cutting out breakfast, no snacking, lots of coffee, an alcoholic drink at night, pretty much cut out meat, lots of veggies. We will see...

Best wishes to you and keep in touch.
Sweetplum.

[Godislove]

Godislove,
Thank you for the post. I'm sorry to hear about the VR not working out the first time. Wanted to ask how your DH handeled the VR, was it painful - how was his recovery? How is he handling things knowing he will be having another surgery? Why did it not work the first time around? Just curious - would like to hear as much as you are willing to share.

Interesting point about VR swaying girl.

In terms of my own personal diet. I've been experimenting with LE for about a year now : cutting out breakfast, no snacking, lots of coffee, an alcoholic drink at night, pretty much cut out meat, lots of veggies. We will see...

Best wishes to you and keep in touch.
Sweetplum.




Hi Sweetplum!! Thank you for your diet input!! I'm trying to slowly start back... I have skipped breakfast past few days, I still have my warm lemon water in the am (I know I gotta quit that once I run out of the lemons in the fridge lol) and I'm working out 5-6 days a week so maybe I can get diet under control again. As for his vr (sorry if this is too much detail) but doc said the procedure should take 2 hrs for each side. After 6 hrs in surgery (instead of 4) the doc said one side was cut to severely and there wasn't enough tube to reconnect it. he said the other side was successful (vas to vas connection) so as long as it didn't scar or blow out then he suspected 80 percent success on that side. The thing is we live far away from the surgeon so three days after his surgery he Started having pain and severely swelling .. that lasted about a month. Because we lived far away the doc said to go to the ER if it leaked (but it didn't) otherwise wait it out. (He suspected he had a blowout due to swelling) We tried for a few months and I knew (cause we got bfp with both boys first try). Anyways doc set up sa testing found it wasn't successful and referred us to the doctor with the highest success rate in our state because the next doc performs a Vasoepididymostomy instead of a vas to vas procedure. Not sure if your formulaic with the reversal techniques or not... the Vasoepididymostomy is a much more delicate procedure that not all urologist can perform and they don't usually know if it will be needed till the surgeon is in surgery. So, I would suggest to ask the surgeon if they also perform the other procedure if it is needed, otherwise he may need to have a second surgery. That being said, i was told it is not that common to need Vasoepididymostomy instead of vasectomy procedure so I'm sure yours dh will go great!! My dh said this will be last attempt as it was too painful. And I really don't want him to have to again anyways. Sorry it's so long... but I know I tried to research and research and didn't find much experience or information about the procedure. I'm sure yours will be a far better one than ours!! Bag of frozen peas are best and Motrin for the scaring (if he can take Motrin). Good luck!! And baby dust!!! God bless!!!! Thanks again for your reply!!

Ps I had thought low sperm count swayed girl so I thought it would stand to reason that a vr would sway girl??.... just a thought (or wishful thinking lol)

[atomic sagebrush]

I do think it sways girl. Good luck ladies! :)

[Godislove]

I do think it sways girl. Good luck ladies! :)

Thank you Atomic!!! 😊 lots of baby dust Sweetplum!!

[Sweetplum]

Less than 20 days to my husband's VR. After a rough patch for us about two weeks ago, he has come around and he and I both feel very close. I don't blame him for being nervous and unsure. My swaying is going OK. I'm probably not as strict about it as I should be. Maybe when things get more real after the VR my motivation to be 100% diligent will kick in? To be honest, the idea of either a girl OR a boy is delightful to me - which is probably part of the reason for my relaxed attitude.

[atomic sagebrush]

That is actually a GOOD thing. For reasons we don't totally understand, the people who are the most highly motivated, dotting every i, crossing every t, end up having opposites more than I'd like to see. Something about the rigorousness and level of constant committment to juggling tons of swaying balls in the air may sway more blue than any of the details they are worrying about. :)

[babybells]

Just wanted to say GL Sweetplum!!! Read through the whole thread and hope everything works out for you! :)

[Sweetplum]

Tomorrow we will go in for my husband's vasectomy reversal.

We have come so far from a year ago at this time. Many ups and downs, but we are both happy and although I have my worries I know that in the long run this is not the wrong move for our family. I hope that makes sense...I don't know what the future will bring us but I do know that this step tomorrow is the right one.

Despite the fact that I have been ambiently swaying for over a year now, it is difficult for me to get excited about TTC until I know my husband is ok and makes it through the surgery ok. I am very lucky to have a man who loves me enough to understand the regret I have over the V and put this in context with the concerns he has about the procedure.

Wish us luck tomorrow.

[atomic sagebrush]

Good luck and wishing him a speedy recovery!!

[Sweetplum]

The VR procedure was a success...just talked to dr. He was able to direct connect both sides with ease and found moving sperm and copious clear fluid. All great news. Also, he may have actually remedied a blockage/leaking sperm issue that has been causing DH pain since the V.

Now looking forward to spending the weekend spoiling my sweet husband rotten...

[XXforhubby]

That's great news! I'm dropping off baby dust for you [emoji597][emoji92][emoji93][emoji94]! Enjoy your weekend [emoji6]!



[emoji170][emoji1379]DS1, [emoji577]DS2, & [emoji602]DS3[emoji170]
[emoji166]EDD 9/30/2017 [emoji1317]for pink[emoji166]
https://lmtm.lilypie.com/Tub9m6.png (https://lilypie.com)

[atomic sagebrush]

Oh that's great news!!! :cheer: :cheer: :cheer:

[Dreamsister]

Great. So happy VR is over and went great. Now you can look forward to the fun part. So exited for you. Cheers


Mother to 3 boys ❤️ and pregnant with a baby girl due in June 2017 [emoji120]. DW (41) [emoji1326] DH (38) [emoji144]

[Sweetplum]

Thank you all. DH is resting at home and in the best mood. :) He even said on the way home that he's looking forward to a third baby and asked me if I had thought of any names....I told him right now I just want him to heal up.

I knew for him it was the fear of the VR. He said so far it's been smoother than the original V. To be continued.

I am very thankful for my husband....regardless of what this next chapter brings us. I'm happy to turn the page on this past chapter.

[atomic sagebrush]

:heart: Give him an extra big hug for all of us.

[Sweetplum]

First day back at work was good for him. He hasn't needed any pain meds other than 1-2 Tylenol a day. I'm very impressed. He's so happy and chipper ❤️

[Godislove]

Yay!! That's amazing!! So happy everything went smoothly! Wishing you lots of Baby dust and God bless you all on your family's journey!!!!!

[Sweetplum]

Got the thumbs up from the urologist this afternoon. Husband is feeling great. Here goes nothing!

[XXforhubby]

Woohoo! Sending loads of baby dust your way [emoji597][emoji92][emoji93][emoji94]



[emoji170][emoji1379]DS1, [emoji577]DS2, & [emoji602]DS3[emoji170]
[emoji166]EDD 9/30/2017 [emoji1317]for pink[emoji166]
https://lmtm.lilypie.com/Tub9m6.png (https://lilypie.com)

[Dreamsister]

So happy for you that you passed this chapter with bravour. When are you attempting?


Mother to 3 boys ❤️ and pregnant with a baby girl due in June 2017 [emoji120]. DW (41) [emoji1326] DH (38) [emoji144]

[Shannshaff]

Wonderful news!

[Sweetplum]

Thank you ladies!
We tried a few nights ago and I'm probably ovulating today or tomorrow, so technically I guess we've already begun :)

All went well, my husband had been experiencing pain as a result of the vasectomy and he is over the moon that the pain is now gone. The urologist had said the reversal should fix the pain and it has.

I'm so happy for him and we feel very close.

We shall see what happens, I'm not wasting any time getting started...but I'm also not super hopeful to be honest.

[atomic sagebrush]

:cheer: great news! Good luck and pink dust!

[Sweetplum]

Still here, TTC. Period is on its way tmrw, can feel it coming...
Feeling like odds are stacked against us.

[atomic sagebrush]

They are, but the odds don't tell the whole story. People do things that go against the odds every day!

Remember, your odds are higher than if you hadn't done all this!

Can you give me a rundown of everything you're doing and I can tell you what to tweak??

36161

[Godislove]

Still here, TTC. Period is on its way tmrw, can feel it coming...
Feeling like odds are stacked against us.

I'm sorry 😐 but yes at least your trying! We had second vasectomy reversal done and had a cycle and found out for sure no baby dice by way of af today. Maybe baby sway is hindering chance of pregnancy. 🤷🏼*♀️
I'm sure atomic will have lots of excellent advice to help :) try to keep positive and have fun :) wishing you lots and lots of baby dust!! I know being possitive is easier said than done :(