Period cramps at 8DPO....what the ????

[1moregirl]

So yesterday I was 8DPO and I woke up feeling anxious and then that changed to overemotional and I shed a few tears in the morning (was my baby's 4th birthday yesterday) and then all day long I had period pains on and off which I haven't had before at this time. I was worried my period was coming but way too early. I kept wiping and checking at every loo stop throughout the day but nothing. Usually my period arrives before the cramps commence or on the same day as the bleeding commences. Then today I have woken up and no cramps or anything. I know in previous cycles I have asked about this cramping at 3-4 days post-O,which I've had, but this time I didn't have that and have only had it yesterday. Today I'm 9DPO. Any ideas ladies?

[MrsGoodies]

Test! Test! TEST! TEST!

:poas:

[1moregirl]

Nah Hun. Way too early for me. I don't think I've ever shown a BFP at 9DPO and I don't have any more money til Monday which is 4 days away, so I'll just have to wait.

[MrsGoodies]

What about that hpt you found under the sink? You could use it on Saturday...didnt you get a +hpt at 10 dpo last time?

[atomic sagebrush]

It's the secondary estrogen surge. I have it sometimes too. you make a big burst of estrogen to sustain the lining longer and enable any egg if present to burrow in and set up housekeeping, and it's very much the same as far as your body is concerned, to that big burst of estrogen you get right before you ovulate. you can have some O pains, EWCM, increased libido, etc.

[1moregirl]

so no reason to get my hopes up Atomic? Bugger! :( I really need to not pay any attention at all to physical symptoms. I don't know why I keep doing it. And last cycle was crappy BD patterns anyway. I really think the ONLY way I can get pregnant now is to BD the SMEP pattern. Do you think DH's sperm volume could play a role in this Atomic? I just noticed yesterday in his sperm analysis we did few months back that his semen volume was low, even though all the other factors were OK. He just doesn't ejaculate much semen. Or is it just my dodgy eggs can only get fertilised if we BD SMEap pattern and as much as possible around O time?

[1moregirl]

Well I'm 11DPO today and am feeling AF must be on her way because I have been so bloody irritable and moody and over-emotional. Things have been getting on top of me very easily, especially money issues and lack thereof. We have an elderly dog on heart medication and I have nearly run out of it but can't afford to buy more as vet needs to do a blood test before he can prescribe us more and blood test along is a few hundred dollars. The dog is 16 yr olds I a week...what do I do? Plus i myself need some dental work done and my mobile needs fixing. argh! Anyway, I'm sure period is on her way as I don't usually feel this down and out when I am pregnant. I have app with FS this Wednesday and will jot down a few questions to ask him. I may have to have the Hysterescopy too, but it's more money as well. In the meantime I am going to get back on the ubiquinol and up it to 200mg daily and go back to doing SMEP as it really does seem to be my only hope of getting a BFP for some reason. Sorry for rambling on and thanks for listening.

[MrsGoodies]

16 years!? I'd say your dog had a good life and skip the $$$ on vet fees. It would be bottom of the pile.

Take care of all the human needs first (and that includes you hun bc i know us mums always seem to put ourselves at the end beneath thfamily dog lol)

[1moregirl]

12DPO today. I woke up this morning and had the cramps again and was expecting to see blood when I went to toilet but nothing. This afternoon just went to the toilet and had EWCM dangling (yuck...tmi I know). I'm still not testing yet either. Tomorrow will be 13dpo so maybe AF might show up then. I'm certainly sick of being stuffed around with these cramps on and off for about 4 days now. I've never had this before. Dear God.....I wish it was a little Emby.

[Girlieplease]

Sounding really positive 1 moregirl, I. Sometimes get cm around when my period is due, but never to the point your talking about. I am tentatively excited for you, keeping everything crossed for you! X o

[ELP]

Hopefully the ewcm was the start of mucous plug, GL :)

[atomic sagebrush]

so no reason to get my hopes up Atomic? Bugger! :( I really need to not pay any attention at all to physical symptoms. I don't know why I keep doing it. And last cycle was crappy BD patterns anyway. I really think the ONLY way I can get pregnant now is to BD the SMEP pattern. Do you think DH's sperm volume could play a role in this Atomic? I just noticed yesterday in his sperm analysis we did few months back that his semen volume was low, even though all the other factors were OK. He just doesn't ejaculate much semen. Or is it just my dodgy eggs can only get fertilised if we BD SMEap pattern and as much as possible around O time?

I think you should not get your hopes up for any reason other than staring at a positive pregnancy test.

I literally just had this exact same thing myself this month with cramps 7-8 DPO and there is no way I am pregnant.

Hubs semen volume goes up and down dramatically, one sample tells you nothing, and interestingly is not always predictive of the amount of sperm in it. We had a guy on here (well, his wife was) and he had a massive semen sample and barely any sperm, and other guys have had small volume but lots of sperm in it.

Please understand that SMEP has nothing to do with "fertilizing dodgy eggs". A bad egg will die fast or not be fertilized (due to impermeable outer shells) or will be fertilized but will just stop growing. All SMEP does is try to ensure there is a lot of sperm on hand at any point in time an egg is released. It's just an additional guarantee of having lots of sperm during your fertile window.

[nicoler]

Atomic is 100% correct with regards to semen volume. Volume doesn't necessarily correspond with sperm concentration at all. If he was a bit dehydrated before his analysis, there could've been less semen volume. If your DH had another analysis tomorrow, it would likely come out almost the same as the one he had a few months back regardless of what his volume was. If you had 2 glasses with 5 marbles in each glass and added a cup of water to one glass and a 1/4 cup of water to the other glass, there would still be 5 marbles in each glass! Kind of the same thing with sperm concentration in seminal fluid.

[1moregirl]

Thanks for that info about semen volume. Totally makes sense and there was nothing wrong with the number of sperm in it so yeah...all good. 13DPO today...as soon as I woke up I was thinking...yep, AF is going to be here as I just felt like it was here, but still no bleeding. I hate this...I wish if it were coming that it would just hurry up and arrive already. I don't believe I'm pregnant so I'm not going to put myself through the disappointment of doing a test. I've been feeling really tired and really grumpy so AF has to be on her witchy way some time today. I'll be fine if it arrives. I really need to go out and buy some more ubiquinol today and up it to 200mg instead of 100mg and see how it goes. I usually get AF today at 13DPO but it is possible I am a day ahead since I didn't BBT this last cycle.

[atomic sagebrush]

Atomic is 100% correct with regards to semen volume. Volume doesn't necessarily correspond with sperm concentration at all. If he was a bit dehydrated before his analysis, there could've been less semen volume. If your DH had another analysis tomorrow, it would likely come out almost the same as the one he had a few months back regardless of what his volume was. If you had 2 glasses with 5 marbles in each glass and added a cup of water to one glass and a 1/4 cup of water to the other glass, there would still be 5 marbles in each glass! Kind of the same thing with sperm concentration in seminal fluid.

I am officially stealing this analogy! :agree:

[atomic sagebrush]

:cheer: go Goldie go :cheer:

The place I got to, it was like if it happened, it happened, but it probably wouldn't. It made it easier as the months passed to just decide I was gonna expect not to be pregnant and then if I did it would be like winning the lottery. :)

[1moregirl]

Thanks Atomic. I have been trying to think like this exactly. Obviously there was no BFP for me this time as AF arrived yesterday. I was a bit relieved though as at least my LP was 13 days long instead of 9 days from when the pains started. I have a new plan as from now. I do have to get myself back on ubiquinol, but otherwise I am going to make sure we BD right ON O day as I've been studying each of my charts from last year and the ONly 2 times I've gotten BFPs, my charts had SOLID crossroads indicating definite O on that day...plus we had BD ON O day. Maybe it's just a coincidence, but it damn well is worth a try. Desperate times call for desperate measures right? Lol! ;)

[atomic sagebrush]

As long as you also DTD at least on O-1 or O-2 as well as they both have been shown to have much higher odds of conception than O Day. :)

[1moregirl]

Thanks Atomic. From now on I will do SMEP. I saw my FS yesterday and I didn't really learn any more that I didn't know already, but he did say we could do a Hysterescopy on me using a 'twilight' anaesthetic (more like a sedation) instead of a full GA, so I was really happy about that. We made a tentative booking for November, but I think I might move it to January as it's going to cost us almost $1,000 and that's not a good time of year with rates due and Christmas around the corner. I just have to lift my game and try harder. I should've been doing this SMEP thing AGES ago. What have I been thinking? The FS advised that we should be BD every second night from CD 12 on ward....but this would sway more boy shouldn't it Atomic? He also advised me to take baby aspirin as soon as I get a BFP. But you know what? He only advised this after I told him I know of quite a few ladies in their 40s in the US where their FS's have advised them to take baby aspirin and progesterone. WTH? He said he didn't think it would hurt and might even help, since I have already had 2 miscarriages in a row. I wasn't really impressed with him yesterday. He clearly hadn't read his notes before I came into the room and he was under the impression he had already given me the Hysterescopy we'd discussed on previous appointments. I had to say 'NO. I haven't had one becasue I was too scared of having a general anesthetic.' Why do we often have to go round and round in circles with some doctors/specialists before we finally feel like we are getting heard or getting the treatment that we wanted to start off with? VERY frustrating.

[atomic sagebrush]

It's not that it would sway more blue in and of itself but that it sways more blue and it ALSO doesn't really up odds of conception that much. If you end up with attempt on O-2 and O Day, and the sperm from O Day haven't time to capacitate yet, that's really only one attempt in fertile window. So you incur the possible risks of the regular BD (since we have no clue how that works for swaying blue) and you haven't even improved your chances of conceiving. SMEP does raise odds of conception, even if it may be more blue friendly.

RE the aspirin, there is some new evidence that taking it when you don't need to may actually increase chances of miscarriage for some people and taking it has never been shown to help prevent miscarriage in anyone without known clotting disorders. So this is another nail in the coffin of me recommending aspirin. I just no longer feel good about having you guys take it without proven medical need. Could taking aspirin trigger a miscarriage? | Daily Mail Online (http://www.dailymail.co.uk/health/article-19962/Could-taking-aspirin-trigger-miscarriage.html) Additionally given your previous experience with the bad miscarriage I am extremely, extremely hesitant for you to take it without a proven medical need (meaning, a demonstrated clotting disorder).

Progesterone has been shown pretty convincingly to me to be nothing more than a placebo for anyone with a 8 day or longer LP. It is not helping anyone get or stay pregnant even when it does extend the LP (even in those going HT!! surprisingly). I believe doctors either have not heard about it yet and are still operating under their old med school playbook or else they hand it over to women to basically shut them up rather than taking the time to educate them Progesterone May Not Help Prevent Repeat Miscarriage, Study Finds | Health | US News (http://health.usnews.com/health-news/articles/2015/11/25/progesterone-may-not-help-prevent-repeat-miscarriage-study-finds) If the pregnancy is developing normally it will send the signal to your body to sustain the pregnancy, if it isn't, the pregnancy will end no matter what and all the prog. supplementation does is possibly make a doomed pregnancy last longer and leave you in the hard position of having to decide to stop taking it if things are not seemign to develop normally. :/

Doctors are by and large horrible. If you find a good one, cling to them like Super glue because they are few and far between.

[1moregirl]

Thanks Atomic. Yes I was feeling uneasy about the idea of taking baby aspirin. The odds of me having a blood clotting disorder must be very minute surely, since I've had three successful pregnancies and three healthy babies already? I guess I could get a normal GP to give me a slip to get my blood tested for these? Or should I not? Soooo tricky to know what to do. I know of a 46 yr old lady in the US (from that fbk page of women in their 40s getting pregnant) and she had one MMC and one cP whilst taking 200mg ubiquinol, but when she upped it to 400mg and was taking baby aspirin and progesterone, she had a successful pregnancy and now has a little baby boy. Just coincidence with aspirine and progesterone? Maybe it was the ubiquinol or maybe just luck? I certainly don't see why women should be advised to take either aspirin or progesterone unless a doctor or FS has tested us and found a viable reason that we should take them.

I visited my friend yesterday who is 43 and has a 4 week old baby boy. We worked out that the FS/Ob/gyn I have been seeing is one who she was seeing when she conceived her first child (now 3.5) and delivered her child and gave her a horrendous birthing experience. She described him as a 'butcher' as he kept pushing her for an induction (whilst looking at the clock coz he wanted to leave work by 4 that afternoon) and gave her a traumatic and painful 'stretch and sweep' without asking her permission and without warning her. She was so traumatised that her next baby was a home birth. Some of these doctors are truly horrible and soooo lacking in bedside manners. This same doctor yesterday was pushing me for IUI or the Hysterescopy. You have to wonder whose benefit it's for? Do they really have our best interests at heart or their own agenda?

[atomic sagebrush]

Everybody has their miracle "I started taking this and had a baby" story BUT what I do want you to understand is that since most losses are caused by chromosomal issues with egg or sperm, and since most people start taking "Magickal Mysteree Herbz" after having a loss, what happens is that they make a good egg and get pregnant from it. It would have happened anyway because the egg was a Goldie, but we are just overly programmed to see things in a cause-effect kind of way.

Studies have proven that the prog does nothing. Even the doctors are agreeing now that it doesn't (and for them to eat their words on something to this level is kinda huge!!) It does seem relatively harmless. The aspirin is another story, where you may be causing yourself serious harm, even death, and for many people may make matters worse making them more likely to miscarry than not. So to me, I'd I agree with your assessment that 3 healthy babies and then losses in your mid 40's is not indicative of a clotting disorder to me (especially given that you lost a lot of blood the one time). OF course I can't say that without testing, but I probably wouldn't do the testing in your shoes.

Re the ubiquinol, again, there are no fixes like that. Even ubiquinol, which I do have people take, is NOT going to take a woman who had no chance of pregnancy and get her pregnant. If it did, there would not be websites full of people who were going through infertility. They all take all the "fixes" and still can't get pregnant. I mention this not to be discouraging but just to help you understand that the reason why a gal had a couple losses in her mid-40's and then went onto have a healthy pregnancy is because she had a good egg show up. That's all. It wasn't a vitamin or mineral or magic herb, it was a good egg. We all make em up to some point, just that over time we make them less and less. Some of us only may make 1 or 2 a year. But it takes a good egg to make a baby and not a miracle pill, unfortunately.

What you have to understand about the docs is that "to a little boy with a hammer, every problem they encounter is a nail in need of pounding" meaning that since they have the technology, it takes a lot for them not to use it. When their patients show up asking for help, I'm sure the temptation is to use the technology at their disposal even if it's really not necessarily indicated by the circumstances. As an example, the progesterone supplements, a lot of patients will get furious with their doctors for doing what I believe is the right thing and not using them. So I can have some sympathy I suppose, when they view everything from an invasive position - people expect them to DO stuff, so stuff they will do. I do think that most of them go into medicine for the right reasons but the training they receive and then just human nature conspire to make them not always as receptive to our needs and interests as we would hope they would be. :/