4 weeks pregnant & worried about my numbers!!

[ABC.2606]

I am 4 weeks 1 day pregnant and had my betas done yesterday at 14 dpo. My numbers were:

HCG: 66
Progesterone: 9

These numbers sound terrible! The doctor suggested progesterone supplements. I'm supposed to get retested tomorrow.

Thoughts on these numbers? Anyone have low numbers like this & what happened? And what gender did you have?

Atomic - did swaying with LE for 5 months maybe lower my progesterone? I believe it was lower to begin with as I have always had short cycles, short LP and lower BBTs.

Please help - I don't know what to think!

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[ksmom]

Individual beta numbers don't matter, it's the doubling time that does. I think I remember XX saying she had low numbers with her DS3? My initial beta was only a 16 with DS3 and the nurse told me I'd likely miscarry again. Turns out I was just super early and my doubling time was 29 hours which is great. I think my progesterone was a 19 which worried me because everything online said it needed to be at least 20. I didn't need progesterone supps. When is your next beta?
Don't worry yourself over gender and beta numbers. It's not indicative of that.

[XXforhubby]

One number means nothing, unless it's 0. We need to see if it's doubling appropriately, thus waiting until the results from your next beta come back.

With my DS2, my HPTs took forever to register I was pregnant- the same with my Beta. Drove me nuts! Ironically, my first scan confirmed my O date despite it taking forever to register! The only explanation I was given was he implanted late.

Hang in there! Let's wait and see what the next one is!


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[ABC.2606]

Thanks ks and XX. My lines on FRER are getting darker, slowly... here's my pic from this morning, 15 dpo.

Do you guys think swaying may have lowered my progesterone further? I never had it tested with my boys - but like I said I'm almost sure it has always been low given my short cycles/LP & low temps. Swaying really did not change any of that - all 3 were virtually the same as they have always been. Only changes I noticed were lighter periods and less acne. I'm wondering if all my swaying (diet and exercise) didn't really change my hormone levels much?

Doc said when I go in for blood tomorrow he'd talk to me about starting vaginal progesterone suppositories. Any thoughts on those? https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20170822/a2f4edf1dacc28467499e8f854ed1718.jpg

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[Mommy2apples]

I think you should do the progesterone suppositories to be on the safe side. Loving the progression on your tests!!


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[ABC.2606]

Geez - as another note, I just got on the scale and I've lost 5 lbs in the two weeks since I ovulated (and no I haven't thrown up!). What the heck? I haven't exercised for almost a week now since I got my BFP, and when I was out of town this past weekend I ate a lot!!! (well, a lot more than I have been eating)

With that much weight loss since our attempt & my low progesterone & the fact that we only had O-4 and O-2 attempts (with DH releasing on his own 14 hours before each attempt to try to lower sperm count)... How am I even pregnant right now?! I'll say this about this baby - he/she is a tough bean so far.

[Mommy2apples]

Everything is going to be okay abc! Can be completely normal to lose some weight in the beginning!!


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[atomic sagebrush]

BEfore I launch into this I want to say, yes, those numbers (the prog in particular) are not what we'd be hoping to see right now.

Let me explain how progesterone works.

You probably already know that at ovulation, your ovary develops a corpus luteum that starts making progesterone. In a normally developing pregnancy, the fertilized egg implants about 7 DPO and sends a signal to your body for your ovary to continue doing that (making progesterone, I mean) If you aren't pregnant, or if the pregnancy is not developing normally, your body will let the corpus luteum break down, progesterone falls, and AF will come. What those low progesterone numbers may mean (and I'm sorry to say, most likely do mean) is that the pregnancy is not viable and your body is just slowly dialing it back to end it naturally. (I'm so sorry!!)

Now, doctors, for the obvious reasons, don't like telling this news to people and thus they will suggest progesterone supplements, but when progesterone supplementation has been studied, it was found to be a placebo - progesterone supplementation did not help anyone get or stay pregnant (even in IVF rounds.) It used to be that doctors did think they helped, and a few still do, but now most doctors know it doesn't and just do it because people do want to feel like they've tried everything to help a pregnancy to make it.

So, that leaves you with a decision to make, you can take the progesterone supps and give the pregnancy another chance but it may not help and may just drag it out or you can decide not to take them and let things end when they do. It is totally at your discretion, I can't even say what I'd personally do in that situation (and I do not believe they do anything). Many people want to feel like they've done everything, others don't want to drag it out, and whichever option feels right to you is the one you should pursue.

Swaying can lower progesterone a little, but I really do not believe that's what is going on here. Even with swaying, if you ovulate and conceive, your progesterone should be above 10. There is enough food coming in on LE Diet for pregnancy to occur.

Is there any way that you could have Oed later than you think?

[XXforhubby]

I was just going to ask the same question- could you have ovulated later? Do you have a chart you could post for us to look at?

Let's hang in here for a bit. Let's see what your numbers are when the betas are repeated.
I can speak first hand for swaying twice, and my progesterone levels were just fine upon getting pregnant- 19 and 29 (this pregnancy started out as twins though).

(((Hugs)))


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[ABC.2606]

Thanks, Atomic. While hard to hear, I appreciate your honesty about where I may at. I haven't had a miscarriage before and haven't had betas taken before so this is all new for me. I did feel like it was weird that even though I got a positive HPT at 10 dpo, the lines in the days following were still so light and taking awhile to appear. I did have a little spotting on 8 dpo and 11 dpo - that's why I actually called the doc yesterday to have them run the betas. No - pretty sure I ovulated on day 15... I had a solid smiley advanced OPK on day 13 and a strong temp rise on the morning of day 16... So at the latest, I believe it was day 15. I normally have a 24 day cycle too so that was a little bit late for me (it's usually day 13-14).

Ugh. Well, I get my next betas tomorrow and they said I could talk to them about the progesterone suppositories then so I guess I have until tomorrow afternoon to think about it. If it's not viable, I'd want things to just go ahead and proceed as they will... But yea, it's hard to know what's "right" to do in this situation.

If I do miscarry - do you think it's worth going ahead and seeing a RE to get evaluated, given the low prog. this time, the short LPs, low temps, etc? I really like my OBGYN for pregnancy but I don't think he's going to take a real proactive approach with the fertility stuff, especially not at this point, and would probably just continue to offer progesterone supplementation while I'm trying to get pregnant. Do you think with my situation (even though I've successfully conceived in the past and haven't been trying a long time this time around) a RE would be likely to give me Clomid right away to try to improve progesterone/ LP? I know you said Clomid is a great treatment for LP - does that mean it improves progesterone levels as well?

[ABC.2606]

XX - here's my chart: https://www.fertilityfriend.com/home/6b9cac

[atomic sagebrush]

Thanks, Atomic. While hard to hear, I appreciate your honesty about where I may at. I haven't had a miscarriage before and haven't had betas taken before so this is all new for me. I did feel like it was weird that even though I got a positive HPT at 10 dpo, the lines in the days following were still so light and taking awhile to appear. I did have a little spotting on 8 dpo and 11 dpo - that's why I actually called the doc yesterday to have them run the betas. No - pretty sure I ovulated on day 15... I had a solid smiley advanced OPK on day 13 and a strong temp rise on the morning of day 16... So at the latest, I believe it was day 15. I normally have a 24 day cycle too so that was a little bit late for me (it's usually day 13-14).

Ugh. Well, I get my next betas tomorrow and they said I could talk to them about the progesterone suppositories then so I guess I have until tomorrow afternoon to think about it. If it's not viable, I'd want things to just go ahead and proceed as they will... But yea, it's hard to know what's "right" to do in this situation.

If I do miscarry - do you think it's worth going ahead and seeing a RE to get evaluated, given the low prog. this time, the short LPs, low temps, etc? I really like my OBGYN for pregnancy but I don't think he's going to take a real proactive approach with the fertility stuff, especially not at this point, and would probably just continue to offer progesterone supplementation while I'm trying to get pregnant. Do you think with my situation (even though I've successfully conceived in the past and haven't been trying a long time this time around) a RE would be likely to give me Clomid right away to try to improve progesterone/ LP? I know you said Clomid is a great treatment for LP - does that mean it improves progesterone levels as well?

There's nothing they can do. That's the thing. The progesterone supplements are a pretend thing they do but if it's not working out, they can't go in and fix the DNA that isn't right (and again, I know this is not what any of us want to hear.)

The reason why Clomid works is that it likely makes a better egg to begin with. Better egg, better corpus luteum, higher progesterone. Adjusting the progesterone level can't go back in time and fix the egg, if that makes any sense. it's treating the symptoms but not the problem (and again, again, I know it's absolutely sucky that we have to ever deal with any of this, I'm so sorry)

Your chart looks to me like you ovulated on exactly the day you think and thus this low prog is not at all a good sign. I honestly do not know what I'd do, if I'd use the supps or not. I don't think they work, but I might do it anyway just to feel like I tried everything.

Clomid is the best of the best for swaying and for conceiving; if there is any way to get it, do.

[ABC.2606]

Thanks, Atomic... I guess there's not much I can do but wait. My doctor should call tomorrow with today's blood results... So I'll ask him very directly if he thinks the pregnancy is not viable. He seems like a pretty straight shooter (he's a newer doc but I've seen him a few times already and have discussed my whole medical history with him), so I think if I pushed he'd be honest about what he thinks is going on.

As far as my question about the RE/Clomid - I did mean that to say if this pregnancy does end in miscarriage, not to go back and correct this current pregnancy. If I do miscarry I will ask my doc directly for Clomid - given my long history of short LPs. I think he may resist it, but I would definitely try.

[Burakoam]

ABC my fingers are crossed for you..please update this thread when you know what your new betas are..my progesterone was 9 for my first beta with DD4...it is very nerve wrecking...by my next beta my numbers had more than doubled and progesterone was up just a little bit..i think docs were pleasantly surprised and so was atomic and pink because yes probably in a majority of cases those numbers arent ideal..but what i later found out was despite temping myself, charting and taking OPK's..my o date HAD to be wrong. 1, because the pregnancy was perfectly viable and 2 because her first ultrasound which is supposedly the most accurate for dating had me 2-3 days off from where i thought i should be, and that makes all the difference. So i thought i had a positive pregnancy test at 10 DPO and i really had it at 8 DPO..in your case that could also be why your lines started so light..you may have caught the pregnancy much earlier than you think!

and really if thats what you find out i dont know that it matters what your chart or opks or temp says..if your baby is healthy and happy who cares when you O'd to conceive her/him :)...i dont know if we have enough data on it but im inclined to believe with my last two babies and how much i had going for me for blue (including the actual HE diet with DD4..) that delayed ovulation sways heavily pink. not that it always ends in pink, but i bet the stats for it are high.

[Houseofblue]

Just happened to see this and wanted to send hugs! I've had 4 miscarriages in the past (also have 4 boys). 2 of my losses had awesome betas and the embryos had heartbeats (one had a low hb that kept getting slower, the other had a great normal hb). My other 2 m/c's were earlier losses (around 5-6 weeks). One of those early losses had good betas but turned out to be a blighted ovum.
Otoh, like a pp said, "bad" numbers don't always spell doom...that's the thing about very early pg, it could literally go either way. With my DS2, around 6 weeks, I started gushing red blood and cramping, and I knew it was over. But, it wasn't. Never found out why that happened. I guess what I'm saying is everything can look great and turn out bad and everything can look bad and turn out great, you just never know and I just don't want u torturing yourself over every symptom or spotting incident etc.
It's awful waiting to find out, I know. :((( FXed all will be well!!

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[ABC.2606]

Thanks Burakoam and Houseofblue for the encouragement.

Doctor called. Hcg went from 66 to 92 in 48 hours. 50% increase - I know that's not encouraging.

Atomic - should I officially start preparing for the worst?

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[MiaMelb]

:hugs: Abc I'm very sorry to read you're going through this. The waiting and not knowing is so difficult. I've never had betas done so don't have any experience with what the numbers likely mean but I did have some bleeding at 5.5 weeks with my second pregnancy and decided to let whenever be be. Ended up having a scan at 7 weeks and found one healthy growing baby and one blighted ovum. That was the longest week and a half and I imagine similar to how you're feeling. :bighug:

[atomic sagebrush]

Thanks, Atomic... I guess there's not much I can do but wait. My doctor should call tomorrow with today's blood results... So I'll ask him very directly if he thinks the pregnancy is not viable. He seems like a pretty straight shooter (he's a newer doc but I've seen him a few times already and have discussed my whole medical history with him), so I think if I pushed he'd be honest about what he thinks is going on.

As far as my question about the RE/Clomid - I did mean that to say if this pregnancy does end in miscarriage, not to go back and correct this current pregnancy. If I do miscarry I will ask my doc directly for Clomid - given my long history of short LPs. I think he may resist it, but I would definitely try.

I think it is medically warranted and they should give it to you. :heart:

[atomic sagebrush]

Thanks Burakoam and Houseofblue for the encouragement.

Doctor called. Hcg went from 66 to 92 in 48 hours. 50% increase - I know that's not encouraging.

Atomic - should I officially start preparing for the worst?

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Mentally, I would prepare, but physically, continue eating normally and taking prenatals, trying to get rest, etc. Numbers are not destiny and I know several people on this site and elsewhere, where things weren't looking great and then the pregnancy hung on. Thinking of you. :hugs:

[ABC.2606]

I did get the progesterone capsules today. I guess I should just try them??

I'm starting to feel light cramping tonight. I'm really not optimistic at this point. But I will try to take care of myself.

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[Burakoam]

You can prolong your suffering if you are miscarrying if you take the progesterone abc.. I would advise at this point to not take it but you have to do what you are comfortable with...

I am still holding out that baby is a fighter. Hang in there little one..

Some docs say as long as you double by 72 hrs baby has a very good chance at viability. If baby went up 50% in 48 it could very well go up 100% in 72. You gotta remember also that if you are off on your o date your numbers can be doubling on different days than they are expecting.. I remember testing with the clearblue estimator tests and getting discouraged that my levels didn't seem to be changing from 2-3 to 3+ and then the very next day by afternoon they did finally change.

I think atomic has the best advice, prepare yourself but please also take care of yourself and have some positive thoughts because there is still a chance

[LMSM]

ABC, so sorry to see you have to go through this terrible limbo...
I hope you heard back from your doc, but as for the progesterone, I would only take it if the pregnancy seems viable, a son it otherwise would just delay m/c if that is where things are heading (I.e. If there is say an abnormality with the embryo, artificially keeping the pregnancy by prog supps could just prolong things unecessarily). I really hope all is well, and your bean is a strong healthy one..numbers don't tell us all so FX and big hugs !!! :hugs:

[ABC.2606]

Thanks Burakoam and LMSM for your kind words. And yeah that's my fear with the progesterone too - that it will just delay the inevitable. I'm having some cramping and a few other issues tonight that ultimately warranted me calling the on call doctor. She said I should go into the office tomorrow to get checked out. So hopefully I can ask more questions then.

The being in limbo and not knowing is awful!

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[atomic sagebrush]

Yes, just try them (unless they make you very miserable/sick which they can do to some people.) HCG IS going up and it has gone up enough so I personally would not be quite ready to give up yet - not only can pregnancies with lower numbers turn around sometimes, but doctors can get things wrong too. I'm thinking of you. :heart:

[LMSM]

Thinking of you ABC!!! :hugs:

[Pepper]

Thinking of you.

[ABC.2606]

I miscarried :(

I guess at least if it had to happen it's better that it happened earlier rather than drag on for weeks.

Atomic I think I need a day or two to let this settle - mentally and physically. And then do you mind if I PM you with a few questions on how I should proceed? Thanks.

[Mommy2apples]

Abc. I'm so sorry it still ll hurts no matter how early the miscarriage is. So many hugs!


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[Burakoam]

I am so sorry ABC...biggest hugs to you.

[Throwaway_panther]

I am so, so sorry for your loss :( ♡

[atomic sagebrush]

I have your PM and have set aside time to answer it ASAP. :heart: I'm so sorry.