Swaying under special circumstances Part 3 PCOS

[atomic sagebrush]

Swaying under special circumstances Part 3 PCOS

PCOS, or Polycystic Ovarian Syndrome, is a very common condition believed to be suffered by 1 out of 10-15 women (and this number may actually be higher because many people have some symptoms of PCOS without having the condition full-blown). It occurs when hormones get out of balance in a woman’s body and can affect fertility negatively.

This hormonal imbalance can create challenges for swaying both pink and blue – for pink, PCOS not only makes it harder to conceive, but actually causes your hormones to shift in a way that favors boy conceptions, while at the same time making it more difficult to follow all three of the TTC girl diets. For blue, PCOS can make it tougher to conceive and the medications often prescribed for PCOS can make you more likely to conceive a baby girl and gaining weight on a blue-friendly diet may aggravate PCOS. But don’t despair, there are ways that we can tweak the sways for both genders to help you stay healthy and conceive the baby you’ve been dreaming of.

:crawl:What is PCOS?

PCOS occurs when the body develops a condition called insulin resistance. Normally, after you eat a meal, some of your food is converted by your liver into glucose, a very basic, chemically uncomplicated sugar that provides easy to use energy to the cells. This causes the amount of glucose in your blood****** to skyrocket. But your body doesn’t use glucose well alone; it needs a second chemical, the hormone insulin, to be able to metabolize the glucose. Insulin helps glucose make it into your cells where it then can be used as energy. In addition, insulin bundles up extra glucose into a form called glycogen, which it then stores for later use. This process keeps your blood sugar from getting too high.

Unfortunately, after a lifetime of eating foods that provide the body with massive doses of glucose (refined carbs and sugar, eating excessive calories) our cells start to get a little bit “deaf” to the effects of insulin. They don’t respond to it at regular levels any more and your body must begin to produce more and more insulin to compensate for that. Lifestyle factors such as being overweight, constant snacking, and lack of exercise exacerbate this problem.

Over time, the pancreas, the organ that produces insulin, gets tired. It just can’t make enough insulin to cope with this situation and extra glucose builds up. Your blood sugar stays high all the time, makes it extra hard for your body to lose fat, makes it easier for your body to store fat, and this road eventually leads to Type 2 diabetes, heart disease, blindness, nerve damage, and kidney disease.

In terms of fertility, the excess glucose triggers an odd chain of events. High insulin levels stimulate the ovaries to make extra testosterone. This excess testosterone causes the signs and symptoms related to PCOS (see below), can stop you from ovulating, and can make the eggs you do ovulate, lower in quality and less likely to produce a viable pregnancy.

:crawl:Why do we get PCOS??

Well, that’s a pretty stupid design, isn’t it?? The very thing we need to provide energy to our cells, can actually go haywire and render us infertile, even eventually KILL us!

PCOS, like Type 2 diabetes, is considered a “disease of civilization” meaning that humans in their native environment, probably didn’t get it (we’ll talk more about this below). PCOS was not even described by the medical establishment until 1935 and it was a rare disorder. Yet it is currently so widespread that many doctors no longer refer to it as a disease and consider it more of a genetic variation. In fact, it may be that 75-100% of all women would eventually develop PCOS if their diet and lifestyle promoted it strongly enough. Some women just seem to develop it more easily than others, and particular ethnic groups and the women in certain families are much more likely to develop PCOS than the general population. Some evidence indicates that the youngest woman in a family of mostly brothers may be more likely to develop PCOS than others are.

:crawl:Evolutionarily speaking, then, is there any POINT to PCOS?

Medical research is beginning to conclude that when a condition is widespread throughout the general population, that usually means that condition carries with it some sort of survival benefit that in humanity’s native environment; aided in survival and/or passing down genes to future generations.

PCOS is no exception – if food was scarce and you frequently went for days or even weeks without a good meal, the person whose body was the best at keeping blood sugar elevated for longer after eating and hanging onto every calorie it could in the form of fat, had a distinct advantage over the skinny mini’s who immediately burn off every scrap they put into their mouths.

Even higher testosterone itself carries with it survival benefits – a person who may need to struggle for survival, and even fight over scarce resources, NEEDS to be able to make testosterone. Testosterone in small amounts is imperative for building and maintaining muscle mass, and testosterone in women has been linked to higher sex drive as well. So if one person’s body was a little better at keeping T levels adequate even in times of scarcity, that person would have an advantage for competition for mates and resources, and may be interested in mating when others with lower T levels are not.

Beyond that, some genes are more functional in males vs. females but both genders still carry the genetic blueprints even if they are less important for one gender. An example would be nipples in men – they don’t strictly need them, of course, but since women DO need them, both sexes still develop them, just in different forms. PCOS may be a vestigial form of some metabolic process that is highly important to male survival, but in women serves either no purpose or one that is much less important.

One other side effect of PCOS that is important to us here is ~warning~ nothing other than my own speculation. It occurs to me that in a time of famine, if very little meat was available and people were subsisting largely on pure carbohydrates, the tendency would be for many more girls than boys to be born…maybe even exclusively girls if things got bad enough. If a culture turned its back on meat all together by choice or circumstance, and went entirely vegetarian, over time this could lead to drastic imbalances in the gender ratio. In this scenario, it would then be a “genetically smart” strategy to be able to produce an excess of sons. So if one woman’s body takes a sudden excess of carbs and exchanges them into testosterone and then has 2 sons instead of 4 daughters, those lads may then have a very large genetic advantage – even IF due to PCOS, the woman was only able to achieve half the number of pregnancies! PCOS may be one mechanism by which Mother Nature balances gender ratio and part of the reason why gender ratio hovers at 50-50 regardless of a culture’s diet.

:crawl:How do I know if I have PCOS??

The symptoms of PCOS include acne, weight gain (particularly the “apple” shape), trouble losing weight that may get worse when you eat a lot of carbs, hair growth on places like the face, chest, and neck, thinning hair on the top of the head, irregular, infrequent periods, bleeding between menstrual cycles, repeated ovarian cysts with pelvic pain (your doctor will see these cysts on ultrasound), and frequent positive OPK even when you’re not ovulating. MANY if not all women have some of these symptoms some of the time and do not have PCOS and others have no visible symptoms other than unexplained infertility but DO have PCOS.

For a real diagnosis, you must have your doctor run a series of blood tests that will measure your testosterone level, your blood sugar, your insulin levels, cholesterol, blood pressure, (for a complete list see PCOS (http://labtestsonline.org/understanding/conditions/pcos?start=2)) and also to rule out other things that can cause similar symptoms, like thyroid conditions. You will most likely also need a pelvic ultrasound to check for ovarian cysts (and just a warning to those who have never had this done, it is an internal exam and an ultrasound wand must actually be inserted into your vagina…this is a lot less scary than it sounds and the techs are very kind and sensitive to your feelings.)

It may be a good idea to have these tests run before you sway (especially if swaying for pink) if there is ANY doubt in your mind as to whether you have PCOS or even just mild insulin resistance, because the IGD, FGD, and “crash and burn” variation of LE Diet where people focus more on empty carbs, may aggravate PCOS and make it less likely to get your DG if you attempt to follow it. (The whole-grain, high-vegetable variation of the LE Diet is actually quite good for PCOS as is the HE Diet, with a couple of minor changes we will discuss below.)

[atomic sagebrush]

:crawl:If I DO have PCOS, what do I do?

First of all, don’t panic. I PROMISE that anyone can conceive a boy or a girl, even people with PCOS. One of the most beautiful little girls I’ve ever seen belongs to a friend of mine with PCOS (and three handsome sons besides). Kate Gosselin has 5 daughters and she has PCOS!! It may be a little more difficult for those with very severe PCOS to have daughters than it is for some others, and may be a little more difficult to conceive sons while on meds for PCOS, but it is nothing that we can’t overcome.

Secondly, listen to your doctor. Most people are allowed to manage their PCOS thru diet and lifestyle changes and this is, of course, always the best option. However, if your hormone profile indicates medication, then don’t be afraid of taking it. For a pink swayer, it will help your sway. For a blue swayer, you will want to take the medications for a short period while you lose some weight and get your diet under control, and then see if you can wean off of them because these medications do tend to sway pink.

:crawl:What are the prescription medications given to people with PCOS?

1)Metformin - This is a diabetes drug that will help lower your blood sugar, and in turn, your testosterone levels (sways pink)

2)Clomid – this drug makes you ovulate by temporarily lowering your estrogen levels. (sways pink and can only be used for 6 months in a row maximum.)

3)Birth Control pills – Often prescribed to regulate menstrual cycles in women with PCOS who are not currently TTC, and can help keep hormones working in a more normal fashion (sways pink)

4)Spirolactone – this medication lowers androgens, male hormones like testosterone and the precursor hormones to testosterone in your blood****** (sways pink but unsafe during pg and should be stopped at least a few weeks before you TTC.)

:crawl:What if my doctor won’t give me medication for PCOS?

While we all want a quick and easy fix, PCOS responds very well for most people, to changes in diet and lifestyle (see below) that will only enhance your sway. Doctors only tend to prescribe medication for people whose PCOS is quite severe. If you’re not a person who requires medication, many herbs are used to help control PCOS. If you are on medication, do not mix and match medication with herbs.

1)Vitex – a lot of women with PCOS have claimed great results with vitex. Others have reported that they believe it aggravated their PCOS. Since every woman’s body and hormone profile are unique, it’s likely that both are correct! If you are swaying pink and not on medication for your PCOS, taking 800-1200 mg vitex for a few months in the 2 W on (CD1-CD 13/14 EVEN if you do not ovulate on CD 13/14), rest of cycle off pattern, may help to make your cycles more regular. If you notice any negative changes, stop the vitex. (sways pink, but for blue swayers, if it helps you get off the much stronger and more effective prescription meds, that is a good trade!!)

The exception to the 2W on, rest of cycle off pattern, is if you’re going to take Clomid. Since you cannot take both vitex and Clomid, you may wish to take vitex nonstop for 1-2 full months (while using reliable barrier birth control), then stop the vitex on CD 1 and start Clomid on CD 3.

2)Saw Palmetto – helps to reduce the levels of androgens in your body, that your body can turn into a form of testosterone it easily uses. Take 320 mg SP in the same 2 W on, rest of cycle off pattern and you can also use it nonstop for 1-2 months before starting Clomid as described in the Vitex section. (sways pink, but for blue swayers, if it helps you get off the much stronger and more effective prescription meds, that is a good trade!!)

3)DIM – this is an enzyme found in cabbage, cauliflower, broccoli. It helps you metabolize estrogen, which is helpful for those with PCOS who often have too much estrogen in their bodies or develop excess estrogen when they work to lower testosterone. Lowering androgens like testosterone, sometimes has the side effect of raising estrogen. (not fully known how this supp sways) 100 mg a day taken every day for at least 90 days before you want to TTC, then stop it once you wish to start TTC because your body needs estrogen to get pg.

4)DCI – this is a compound found in buckwheat that has been shown to lower insulin levels and testosterone, and improve ovulation in women with PCOS. 600 mg a day was the dosage used in the study that I read, but you may want to start at a lower dose and work up from there. (not known how this sways, but lower testosterone indicates it would sway pink.)

5)Chromium – a trace mineral that improves glucose and insulin levels. 200 mcg a day. (not fully known how this sways)

6)Cinnamon powder – ½ t per day thru diet OR supps reduced blood sugar, triglyceride levels, LDL (bad ) cholesterol, and cholesterol overall. Lower blood sugar and cholesterol, indicates that cinnamon sways pink – but for blue swayers with PCOS, if cinnamon helps you get off the stronger prescription drugs, it’s a good trade.

7)NO LONGER RECOMMENDED L-Carnitine – Helps to get rid of glucose in the blood that your body isn’t metabolizing and also helps your body turn food into muscle,which will burn off more calories than body fat. (sways blue) LADIES - I no longer recommend this at all due to the fact that it raises T levels and may aggravate PCOS that way. If you have already bought some, you can give it to your husband if you're swaying blue.

8)Magnesium – Magnesium may help preserve insulin sensitivity. 250 mg a day – no more! (some claim magnesium sways pink, but blue swayers, you should either get some mag in a prenatal vitamin or thru foods – trying to avoid magnesium is pointless because your body will simply rob your bones to get it and there will be absolutely NO change in the levels of magnesium in your blood******.) If you're taking a prenatal that will have enough magnesium in it, no need for more.

9)Fiber – People who eat high fiber and whole grains, have better insulin sensitivity than those who do not. Fiber also helps reduce estrogen and testosterone. Vegetarians have been shown to excrete more testosterone and estrogen in their feces than meat eaters because of increased fiber. Pink swayers should take extra fiber supps, while blue swayers, you should simply get ample dietary fiber thru foods.

10)Vitamin X (exercise!!) – when you have PCOS you MUST exercise. Pink swayers, even if you cannot do the 60 min. a day, 6-7 days a week level of exercise, exercise is so good for lowering your blood sugar levels that you must include it even if it is moderate exercise. Blue swayers, moderate exercise and weight lifting will help control your PCOS and will also sway blue for you!

Pink swayers – I would feel good about taking vitex, SP, DIM, DCI, magnesium, fiber, and cinnamon. And don’t forget Vitamin X!!

Blue swayers – I would feel good about taking Chromium, magnesium (via prenatal), and getting ample fiber thru foods. If I was trying to get off prescription medication for PCOS, I would def. be willing to try the other supps, because they will still keep your PCOS under control but not as dramatically as the prescription drugs do. And don’t forget Vitamin X!!

Drinking enough water can help both pink and blue swayers, because sometimes our bodies confuse thirst with hunger and we eat when we are actually just thirsty. You don’t have to drown yourself; you only need 8, 8 oz. glasses of water a day – about the size of a coffee mug.

ALL SWAYERS SHOULD TAKE FOLIC ACID!!!!!

:crawl: Things to avoid for everyone with PCOS –

Caffeine (can spike blood sugar – green tea may be better than coffee/soda)

Conjugated Linoleic Acid (makes insulin resistance worse)

Vit. E (in supplement form, may make insulin resistance worse and also can inhibit cell division which is not good for fertility – both LE and HE Diets will provide ample Vit E thru diet anyway.)

Smoking (aggravates insulin resistance and lowers egg quality, contributes to miscarriage) NOTE to blue swayers – move heaven and earth to get your husband to quit smoking if you want a son!!! Smoking is terrible for sperm quality and it has been proven that men who smoke father more daughters.

Constant snacking (eating constantly keeps blood sugar elevated. Some people find that by eating less often, their insulin response improves because it’s as if they’ve given their insulin receptors a “rest”.)

Irregular meals when you NEED to eat (some people find that regular meals and snacks – not CONSTANT eating but every few hours – keeps their blood sugar levels stable and helps to avoid hunger and cravings for carbs.)

Eating refined carbs/sugars at all, and eating large amounts of even whole grains. (whole grains are ok in moderation because the fiber in whole grains helps rises and falls in blood sugar - but just watch your portions and limit yourself to 2-3 servings of whole grains a day)

Milk – (milk has a LOT of carbs in it in the form of lactose, which is a type of sugar that your body easily converts into glucose. Cheese, yogurt, and kefir are ok because the microorganisms that turn milk into cheese/yogurt/kefir also digest most if not all of the lactose. Cheese has NO carbs, while a cup of milk has 13 g carbs per cup…it’s easy to see how the high-milk intake of the IGD and FGD can really aggravate PCOS. If you are sold on cal-mag and swaying, it’s best for you to get cal-mag via supps rather than milk.)

Eating too many calories (pink swayers, you should be limiting calories to 1500-1800 (if you are very short or have a lot of weight to lose, you may drop down to 1200-1500, no lower) which will help your PCOS anyway. Blue swayers, you will have to aim for the lower end of the HE Diet guidelines. 2000 cals - this seems like a lot, but you should be exercising and even if you do not lose a pound, by virtue of adding exercise, you will be converting some body fat to muscle mass and improving your insulin resistance as you do. Blue swayers, if you have a LOT of weight to lose or your weight plateaus, you may even want to drop down to 1800 calories but no lower. It may even be best for you to take a year and lose weight safely and slowly at lower caloric intake, while adding muscle mass thru exercise, and then resume your sway at that point.)

Gaining weight (and in fact you should LOSE some if you can. Pink swayers, you should be losing a bit of weight anyway. Blue swayers, if you are lifting weights and eating enough protein, gradually reduce your weight by 5-10% of your body mass – you don’t need to waste away to nothing. Remember, you are trying to get off of medications that are swaying pink for you and a little weight loss may be just what the doctor ordered.)

[atomic sagebrush]

The DIETS!

There are two schools of thought on diets for PCOS. One school of thought allows small amounts of whole grains in an otherwise PCOS-friendly diet, and the other school eliminates grains all together and focuses more on vegetables and meat, fruit in smaller amounts. I personally prefer that whole grains are eaten in small amounts (esp. for pink swayers) and I explain why below – note, I am aware the following essay goes pretty far afield but I want people to truly understand that I have legitimate reasons why I believe the things I believe…not to mention that I find it way more interesting to talk about than how many times to BD or how much RepHresh to use and I hope that you all find it interesting as well. ;)

Of course, above all you must do what works best for you and your body.

The higher protein, no-grain diets include the Paleo/Primitive/Caveman Diets, along with the Atkins Diet in the induction phase (Protein Power and South Beach and later phases of Atkins, do allow small amounts of whole grains). The basic idea underlying the Paleo-style diets is that humans did not evolve eating grains in large amounts and so grains should be eliminated all together from the modern diet, fruits should be limited due to the sugar content, and people should get most of their carbs from vegetables and eat more meat.

While at first blush this does make some sense, it isn’t quite borne out by historical fact. In nature, our closest living primate relatives eat a LOT of fruit and seeds and insects, not a lot of meat and their diets are higher in carbs, lower in protein than one might think (while seeds and insects do have protein, you have to eat quite a few to amount to much in the way of protein). The amount of evolutionary time in which proto-humans were avid hunters eating a lot of meat, is miniscule compared to the amount of evolutionary time they spent eating mostly fruit, seeds, insects, and the occasional bit of scavenged meat. In fact, it was probably an increase in meat eating that caused protohumans to evolve into modern man. The earliest tools found for butchering meat date to 2.5 million years ago and modern man appeared 200,000 - 300,000 years ago.

Furthermore, there is a fundamental difference between fruits and vegetables – the entire purpose of fruits is to be eaten, because when animals eat fruit, they spread the fruit seeds far from the parent plant and that’s how the parent plant manages to spread their offspring far from home (if you’ve ever planted too many seeds in one spot, you know that for a plant, having your babies sprout under your feet is bad for both you and your offspring because there’s not enough resources for them all to live in such a confined space). Fruits are sweet and luscious and high in carbs, because they WANT animals to eat them so they can reproduce their genes. Fruits have ALWAYS been sweet and luscious and high in carbs because it’s in their best interest to be that way and any animals that eat a lot of fruits, get a lot of calories from carbs.

Vegetables on the other hand, are generally consumed earlier in the life cycle than fruits (bear in mind that tomatoes, squash, avocado ARE fruits, and seeds that are consumed when mature or nearly so, like legumes and grains, also depend on animals to spread them about and behave in a similar fashion and all these veggies tend to be higher in carbs than some of the low carb diets allow).

Low carb vegetables such as lettuce, broccoli, spinach, asparagus, and more primitive ones like fern heads, nettles, etc have no evolutionary motivation for being tasty and high in carbs because if they are eaten before they reproduce, they die without handing down their genes to future generations. Root crops do have some sugar in them because they store it for their plant’s future use but they also often contain high levels of toxins that require cooking/processing to eliminate before they can be eaten (I’m sure we’ve all seen green potatoes at the supermarket – that green color is a toxic chemical that the potato develops when exposed to sunlight, to prevent animals from eating it). Most plants in nature that aren’t fruits/seeds, contain high levels of toxic chemicals as a deterrent against being eaten in large amounts. People DID NOT eat many of these low-carb vegetables at all in their native environment, nor do other primates, and when they did, it was often only in times of severe hardship.

In fact, I have read two very plausible theories that claim that morning sickness and also children’s aversion to green vegetables and anything “bitter” is actually an evolutionary tactic that causes the most sensitive individuals to avoid ingesting too much of these plant-related toxins during critical phases of development. The only reason why we eat vegetables at all now, let alone in the high quantities we now eat them, is due to the fact that over centuries of agriculture and selective breeding, we managed to develop veggies that have lower amounts of these toxic chemicals, actually taste good, and are edible in more than just a mouthful here or there. If you research the history of vegetables, you will discover that many vegetables we now take for granted, actually were not even EATEN by anyone, let alone the majority of people, until the 1500’s or even later. Since many of us had not heard of arugula until 10-20 years ago and now no one will shut up about the stuff, I can totally believe this is true LOL!!

Where do the grains come in, then?? We know that grains were in cultivation by humans at least 11,000 years ago and evidence indicates that humans were grinding and storing grain they had gathered in large quantities from the wild (they’ve discovered the grindstones and found grains in storage buildings) hundreds of years before that if not longer. That’s right – we’ve been eating grains and high carb fruits and vegetables, milennia longer than we have low carb vegetables!!!

Additionally, it is HIGHLY likely that humans were eating grains long before they developed technology to grind them and store them in storehouses. Our teeth themselves bear this out – the reason why so many kids have to have orthodontic work is because most of human existence the human diet was heavy in foods that required significant chewing in order to be digestible (fruits, seeds, grains - all high in carbs) and as a result, our teeth are too big for our skulls. Our skulls shrank as a meat-heavy diet caused our brains to grow and we needed more room for brain – but too large a head size made it too risky to give birth to large-headed babies and so evolution struck a compromise…less bone, more brain. Our teeth have not caught up yet because even as our brains grew and skulls shrunk, we were continuing to eat large amounts of high fiber, chewy foods - and history supports that these foods were predominantly grains.

Putting this all together, it is highly likely that for at least the last portion of the evolution of modern humans, all our ancestors were eating at least SOME grains and for much of that time, most human diets were based primarily around grains/seeds because unlike fruits, vegetables, and meats, grains and seeds are easy to store.

Fans of the Paleo-Style Diet claim that 12,000 years of eating grains, is not enough time for any human traits to evolve, but that is nonsense. Dogs, cattle, vegetables, have all evolved significantly in that time, with a little help from their humans. Animals in the wild including guppies and finches have been observed to significantly evolve within only 10 years! We know for a fact that many humans evolved the ability to digest lactose in adulthood within the last 8000 years. And the higher the population, the greater the odds that favorable mutations will take hold and spread…since the human population has skyrocketed since the domestication of grains, it is EXTREMELY likely we are more able to digest grains now than ever before. Also, I would point out that since the human population has increased exponentially since the advent of agriculture, it's really unlikely that grains are rendering wide swaths of humanity, infertile due to PCOS or any other reason.

Virtually all humans on the face of the planet eat starchy, high carb, grain/seed/root crop foods as dietary staples and yet only humans eating the high calorie, highly refined modern Western Diet is suffering these rampant health problems that the promoters of the high protein, Paleo-style Diet claim are being caused by grains and starches. The McDougall Newsletter - For the Love of Grains (http://www.drmcdougall.com/misc/2008nl/jan/grains.htm) PCOS was not described in medical literature until 1935 and was a rare condition at that point despite most humans around the world having lived on a grain/starch based diet for milennia previously. Whole grains and starchy carbs in and of themselves, just cannot be the issue here.

I feel that the logical conclusion that must be drawn is that PCOS is NOT caused by eating small amounts of whole grains or fiber-rich carbs in an otherwise low calorie diet. PCOS is caused by eating LARGE amounts of refined grains/sugars in an unnaturally high calorie diet (the human diet has NEVER been as calorically dense as it is today...even when we were born!)

I personally believe that whole grains in sane, healthy portion sizes, are fine for those with PCOS. According to the book Fertility Foods by Dr. Jeremy Groll, a diet that is overly high in protein (50% or more of cals from protein) is not good for fertility because your body produces something called ketones that it needs MORE insulin to break down!! More insulin, wheter it comes from carbs OR protein, is bad for PCOS. We will be including a good amount of insulin-healthy, high fiber carbs and also good fats so we aren’t getting too many cals from protein.

[atomic sagebrush]

PCOS PINK Sway Diet!!!!!!!!!!

When swaying with PCOS, insulin resistance, have a significant amount of weight to lose (more than 30 lbs), or are having trouble losing weight on the "crash and burn" style of LE Diet (this may be a sign that you are a bit insulin resistant), empty carbs are not going to help your sway. They may in fact harm your sway by sending your testosterone levels skyrocketing (other people would see T drop on the "crash and burn" style of LE Diet).

So if you fall into one of these categories, you need to change the proportions of protein and fat to carbs (cutting carbs overall in favor of more protein and fat) and get most, if not all, your carbs from small amounts of whole grains and fiber-rich fruit and vegetable (fresh or lightly cooked is much better than canned/well-cooked). This is what we call the "slow burn" style of LE Diet.

How does this work?? Protein and carbs have the same amount of calories in them - about 4 calories per gram. Fat has 9 calories a gram. So by getting more protein and more fat, you make up for any caloric deficit that you would incur by cutting back on carbs somewhat, and yet you are still sticking within the overall limits of LE Diet in terms of calories. Don't just cut out carbs, you'll starve that way! Remember, no one should ever drop below 1200 calories!! Also keep in mind that low carb vegetables are free for everyone on both types of diets - you do not count them for calories, fat, or protein and you can eat as much as you want.

Protein - increase to 50-60 g (up from 40-50 g) and if you are super tall and/or are working out a lot, you may want to even increase this a bit more. I would not increase over 70 g protein no matter what and if you're less than 5-10 (178 cm), I would not increase above 60 g unless you are exercising a lot.

Fat - should be at upper limits for calorie intake, so 30% of your calories from fat. On a 1200 cal diet this will be 30 g fat (although we've seen best results with more like 50+, on 1200 calories that may not be possible) on a 1500-1800 cal diet this will be about 50-60 g fat. VIRTUALLY EVERYONE SHOULD BE EATING 50-60 GRAMS FAT ON PCOS DIET. Please make an extra effort to get the majority of your fat calories from Omega 6 and transfats as described in this essay The Skinny on Fats for pink and blue! (http://genderdreaming.com/forum/gender-swaying-general-discussion/39013-skinny-fats-pink-blue.html)

So while a traditional "crash and burn" type diet would look like this (and please try not to get too hung up on the numbers, this is really just ballpark for illustration only):


1500-1800 cals Roughly 1000-1500 cals are going to be from carbs, depending on the amount of calories overall and the proportions of protein/fat you are eating. These carbs can be in the form of empty white carbs but can also include small amounts of whole grains and also fruit and higher carb vegetables.

40-50 g protein 160-200 day's cals from protein

30-60 g fat 250-540 day's cals from fat
(and while you might wanna try to get more Omega 6 fats, if you're eating low fat in the 30 g range, it becomes less important to do this, and in fact you may need to make some effort to get at least a bit of saturated fat to ensure you continue ovulating.)

The "slow burn" type of diet would look more like this:

1500-1800 calories Roughly 750-1000 cals from carbs and these carbs will all be in the form of whole grains, fresh or lightly cooked fruit and higher carb veg with lots of fiber to help with insulin resistance
(and while I rarely LIKE to see anyone drop to 1200-1500 calories, some gals with PCOS/IR may benefit from this low a caloric intake at the beginning - as the weight comes off, insulin sensitivity will improve and you can increase calories at that point)

50-60 g protein 200-240 cals from protein, and if you're tall and/or are working out a lot, you can up this as high as 280

60 g fat 540 cals from fat
(and if you can get primarily Omega 6 fats, that's going to help your sway a lot - you don't need to worry about getting any Omega 3 or saturated fat, because your protein foods and the Omega 6 fats will have a little bit in them and that will maintain ovulation)

Wow that was a lot of writing and mathematical equations there! I know, I know, very confusing. So, here is a simplified version LE Diet I made for custom swayers with PCOS/IR - while it's not going to be right or necessary for everyone to be quite this strict, it will help you kinda envision what a "slow burn" type of LE Diet is going to look like.

(Where it says "eat X number of times a day" that means you eat that amount that many times per day. It's like the Weight Watchers points system - you can have 2 or 3 servings at one meal or 1 at 3 meals or however works the best for you. You do not, and in fact shouldn't, be eating 5 times a day on any form of LE Diet. On the "slow burn" style LE Diet, it can be very beneficial to your insulin response to have a nice long fast period up to 16 hours every day with no food coming in and this also seems to sway pink.)

--Eat every day:

1 full fat Brown Cow yogurt (or any full fat yogurt) OR 3/4 c whole milk
1 Taste Nirvana Coconut water (or any coconut water, that one is good tasting while some other brands are ucky)
(this will ensure you get a decent amount of potassium and will help with fat and protein)

--2-3 times a day, pick one :

(You can split them into smaller servings and have more often if you would prefer this. These products are not going to be available in all areas and in that case you just would substitute an equivalent product. The salt limits are only for those who are limiting sodium.)

½ c brown rice
½ c cooked whole wheat pasta
1 slice whole grain bread (NOT wheat bread, must be 100% whole grain)
4 Ry Krisp crackers (unsalted)
8 Hint of Salt Triscuits
16 Hint of Salt Wheat Thins
One graham cracker (this is a treat to be had when you’re craving something sweet and you MUST top with the peanut butter option below.)

2 times a day, pick one:

1-2 cup fruit (if the fruit is chunky and not too sweet like watermelon, you can have more; if it’s kind of dense like blueberries, stick with the smaller amount.
1 baked potato (pick a smallish one)
1 baked yam (smallish one)
Carrot Sticks (you can have quite a few, like 2 carrots’ worth)
1 banana
1 apple or pear (I actually want you to leave the skins on these for extra fiber that will keep your blood sugar in check.)
1 corn on the cob
½ c storebought pasta sauce

5 times a day pick one:

2 egg whites
1 whole egg (best to keep these to a few times per week to prevent getting too much saturated fat)
2 T hummus
½ c beans, lentils, or peas
1 1x1 inch **** of cheese
2 chick. nugget size pieces of chicken (use on top of salad or on taco)
1 oz. turkey (ground or sliced deli meat)
Piece of tofu about the size of a deck of cards
1/8 of a cup of nuts or seed (use to top a salad)
3 large shrimp or scallops (this is an occasional treat – no more than 2x a week)
2 T peanut butter (eat on top of the graham crackers if you are craving something sweet)

(eating that amount of the above foods, plus the protein in the yogurt/whole milk and grains, will ensure you get enough protein)

3-5 times a day pick one:

If you don't NEED to eat them, this is a place to cut some cals, but please feel free to include them if you would like.

1 T oil (corn or vegetable oil with Omega 6 fats are best)
1 T butter (margarine with Omega 6 fats may be better)
1 T mayo
1 T not-very-sweet salad dressing like vinaigrette or ranch
1 T whipping cream (can pour over berries)
1 T parmesan cheese

UNLIMITED

You can have as much as you want.
Mustard and unsweetened Salsa
Mushrooms
Herbs
All low carb veggies (asparagus, bell pepper, broccoli, cauliflower, eggplant, green beans, lettuce, spinach, spaghetti squash, tomato, zucchini)
If you can, use leeks and green onions instead of garlic and onion

REMINDER - the PCOS Pink Diet and atomic fertility diet are meant to be SUGAR FREE. If you are doing these diets and are eating sugar more than just as the occasional cheat when you're dying for some (meaning, several times a day or week) you are not doing the diet correctly and are not going to get the superior results achieved by those who avoided sugar.

Quite a few of our opposites this last year were in people who ate lots of sugar when they had PCOS or had 30+ lbs to spare against my recommendation. Most of them simply didn't understand it was an important recommendation and assumed I was being overzealous about this and/or thought I was trying to get them to lose more weight. Weight loss is NOT why sugar is avoided on these diets. It is because the people I recommend to be on these types of diets have poor insulin response so their blood sugar stays elevated longer after eating sugar. Avoiding sugar with PCOS is BY FAR more important than weight loss so if you're justifying eating sugar because you're losing weight anyway, please stop eating a bunch of sugar.

YOU ARE HURTING YOUR SWAY BADLY if you eat sugar when you have PCOS or have a fair bit of weight to spare. For best results stick with little to no sugar till your BMI drops to 21 and then add it in in reasonable amounts as a braking mechanism on weight loss, ONLY if you need it, and ONLY if you don't have moderate to severe PCOS even when your BMI is on the low side.

[atomic sagebrush]

The atomic Fertility Diet - aka an alternate diet for Pink Swayers needing to boost fertility (if you've swayed a long time or are going HT) and for blue swayers needing to lower blood sugar (if you have PCOS or are going HT)

THIS IS ONLY FOR PINK SWAYERS WHO HAVE GONE ON A LONG TIME SWAYING, AND/OR HAVE LOST TOO MUCH WEIGHT, AND WHO ARE IN LATE 30'S-EARLY 40'S. BLUE SWAYERS WITH PCOS/PCO-TENDENCIES, OR WHO HAVE GAINED MORE THAN 30 LBS (OR EVEN LESS IF YOU WERE HEAVY TO START WITH), AND THOSE WHO ARE PLANNING ON GOING HT. THIS IS NOT THE DIET I RECOMMEND FOR THE AVERAGE PINK OR BLUE SWAYER.

Pink swayers, if you have been TTC a long time, have wasted away to nothing, and/or need to adjust your diet to help you get pregnant, this is the diet for you. It is also suitable for those with PCOS, if you find the diet above to be too restrictive and you just can’t manage it, this may be a different option. I believe it is more blue-friendly than the alternate diet posted above. Pink swayers, if you are going HT or even just thinking about it and are not ready to totally give up on a sway diet just yet, this diet is also suitable for you.


Blue swayers, if you went onto HE Diet and gained more than 30 pounds and/or developed PCOS-tendencies (your cycle got long and irregular, your LP got short, and this is NOT explainable by supplements you are taking) OR anyone who wants a boy and is going HT or just thinking about it and not quite ready to give up on a sway diet just yet, this is the diet for you.

Brief note about carbs and fertility particularly for those going HT:

I know that a very low carb diet is “trendy” right now for those going HT but it is not right for everyone. The study that originally found a link between carb intake and IVF success found that keeping carbs below 40% of day’s cal intake, and keeping protein at 25% or more, helped boost IVF success. http://www.medscape.com/viewarticle/803821 https://www.acog.org/About_ACOG/News_Room/News_Releases/2013/High_Protein_Low_Carb_Diets_Greatly_Improve_Fertil ity The way this was reported in the media with several articles claiming “high protein, low carb diets boost fertility and IVF success” is highly misleading. 25% protein is not high protein, and 40% of carbs or less is NOT low carb. Many of the women who were poor responders were eating as much as 70% of their day’s calories from carbs and little to no protein.

NOWHERE was it found that super high protein, very low carb diets such as Atkins are necessary or beneficial for most people’s fertility and yet that is the diet I am seeing people attempt in the HT forums. A very few people who have severe PCOS, IR, or have a much higher than average BMI may benefit from a very low carb diet, but I am seeing people with low BMI and no problems metabolizing carbohydrates going onto Atkins Diet because they think it will boost their chances of IVF success. Based on what?? On misleading titles of articles about a study that found no such thing whatsoever!!

IF you eat too much protein, your body converts it into glucose ANYWAY. Low-Carb for You: How Can Eating Excess Protein Raise Blood Glucose? (http://lowcarb4u.blogspot.com/2009/07/how-can-eating-excess-protein-raise.html)

Women NEED carbohydrates to stay fertile. Paleo for Women | Carbohydrates for Fertility and Health (http://www.paleoforwomen.com/carbohydrates-for-fertility-and-health/) Higher Carb Dieting: Pros and Cons - Perfect Health Diet | Perfect Health Diet (http://perfecthealthdiet.com/2012/02/higher-carb-dieting-pros-and-cons/)
Why I Ditched Low Carb - CHEESESLAVE (http://www.cheeseslave.com/why-i-ditched-low-carb/) And VLC diets may actually make it harder for your body to sustain a pregnancy by causing your thyroid to go wacko. (long but interesting) Is a Low Carb Diet Bad For Your Thyroid? « AnthonyColpo (http://anthonycolpo.com/is-a-low-carb-diet-bad-for-your-thyroid/) and Carbohydrates and the Thyroid - Perfect Health Diet | Perfect Health Diet (http://perfecthealthdiet.com/2011/08/carbohydrates-and-the-thyroid/) This may be even worse if, as I’ve seen several HT ladies do, you make a sudden, drastic dietary switch 90 days before you plan to cycle Going Low-Carb too Fast May Trigger Thyroid Troubles and Hormone Imbalance | drcate.com (http://drcate.com/going-low-carb-too-fast-may-trigger-thyroid-troubles-and-hormone-imbalance/)

So without any further ado here is the diet I have come up with that is suitable for:

Pink swayers who have gone on swaying a very long time and/or lost too much weight, and have lowered their fertility too far, and need to correct it.

Blue swayers who have gained too much weight (over 30 lbs or even less than that if you were heavy to start with) and/or have found the HE Diet has aggravated PCOS-tendencies

Pink swayers who are going HT

Blue swayers who are going HT

Comments and variants are in the colorcoded comments following the statements below.

This diet is based on Doctors Paul and Shou-Ching’s book “The Perfect Health Diet”
The Diet - Perfect Health Diet | Perfect Health Diet (http://perfecthealthdiet.com/the-diet/)

and Dr. Jeremy Groll’s “Fertility Foods” Fertility Foods: Optimize Ovulation and Conception Through Food Choices: Jeremy Groll M.D., Lorie Groll: 9780743272810: Amazon.com: Books (http://www.amazon.com/Fertility-Foods-Optimize-Ovulation-Conception/dp/0743272811)

REMEMBER, THIS IS ONLY FOR PINK SWAYERS WHO HAVE GONE ON A LONG TIME SWAYING AND/OR HAVE LOST TOO MUCH WEIGHT, BLUE SWAYERS WITH PCOS/PCO-TENDENCIES, OR WHO HAVE GAINED MORE THAN 30 LBS (OR EVEN LESS IF YOU WERE HEAVY TO START WITH), AND THOSE GOING HT. THIS IS NOT THE DIET I RECOMMEND FOR THE AVERAGE PINK OR BLUE SWAYER.

Do not worry about counting calories, go off the quantities of food and don’t worry about the particulars. This is IMPERATIVE if you are a pink swayer who may have cut back too far and dieted too strictly for too long – you need to let go of calorie restrictions because if you keep focusing on them, you will be unable to relax enough to follow a more fertility-friendly diet. Remember, it’s a radio dial, not a light switch!! http://genderdreaming.com/forum/gender-swaying-general-discussion/25293-three-essays-swaying.html

:superhero:3 lbs. plant foods per day broken up into the following 3 categories

--1 lb “safe starches” (white rice, white potato, sweet potato, taro, plantain, tapioca, AND I include brown rice and oatmeal for blue swayers and blue swayers going HT) AVOID wheat, corn, and products made from them like breads, pasta, tortillas, and other baked goods.

PINK swayers: white rice and white potato are best, you can also have sweet potato in moderation but remember these are more nutrient dense.

Pink Swayers going HT: If you have a history of insulin resistance, are heavyset, or are over 40, use mainly sweet potato and brown rice (limit brown rice to 2-3 ½ c servings a day if you have PCO-tendencies). Avoid oatmeal.

BLUE Swayers: Sweet potatoes and brown rice are better for you. Oatmeal is a blue-friendly food that you can have as much as once a day provided that you do not have PCOS running out of control – if you do, you may need to avoid ALL grains including brown rice and oatmeal.

Blue Swayers going HT: As long as you have no history of PCOS, you are fine to follow the directions for blue swayers AND also include white rice and white potato, but do stick to the 1 lb guideline.

--1 pound fruit and/or sugary (higher carb) vegetables such as beets and carrots and turnip and winter squash, but NOT corn, peas, beans – above all, avoid soy based foods.

Pink swayers you will want to focus more on lower nutrient fruits

Pink swayers going HT: eat all fruits and veg – the more colorful, the better. Avoid/limit fruit juices and dried fruit, they are carbs for no good reason for you.

Blue swayers: limit/avoid lower nutrient fruits like apples and do NOT drink any fruit juices or eat dried fruits, they are too carb heavy and will aggravate PCO-tendencies.


Blue swayers going HT: focus primarily on brightly colored, nutrient dense fruits and veg. If you are the “classic” girl mama and underweight, you CAN have fruit juice and dried fruit but they are carb-heavy, and so keep them minimal. IF you have PCOS or are overweight, then do not use juices or dried fruit.

:superhero:Unlimited amount of low carb vegetables – these are good for EVERYONE!! Eat up!

:superhero: 1 serving of full fat dairy per day.

This is good for EVERYONE. This can be in the form of whole milk or full fat yogurt such as Brown Cow or Mountain High brand. Natural cheeses such as cheddar, mozzarella, Monterey Jack are allowed, avoid processed cheeses like Velveeta or American. AVOID skim and part-skim dairy, it is bad for fertility. (keep an eye on your yogurts, if it’s not full fat, it needs to go)

Avoid all milk replacers and use full fat dairy instead.

:superhero: Iodized salt or iodine supplements

Use iodized salt instead of sea salt or table salt. You need ample iodine to be able to sustain a pregnancy. If you can’t find or don’t want to use iodized salt, add in an iodine supplement of 150 IU or a prenatal containing that amount of iodine. If you have any history of thyroid issues and especially if you are taking medication for thyroid, PLEASE double check with your doctor before beginning iodine.

:superhero:1/2 to 1 lb of meat per day. 2 days a week but no more than that, eat a serving of salmon. You will need to avoid shellfish, whitefish, and tuna because you can only have fish 2x aweek when TTC and you are already getting that from the salmon. (the salmon is healthiest and best option)

Avoid all processed meats like lunch meat, hot dogs, bacon, ham. Even the so-called “nitrate free” products have nitrates, it’s just that they are derived from vegetable concentrates and chemically are the same stuff. Pork is ok for pink swayers going HT, but probably has too many Omega 6 fats for blue swayers to include very often, and too nutrient dense for pink swayers TTC naturally to use.

Pink swayers – Eat the lower level of meat intake and stick to lean white chicken and turkey. Do NOT use the shellfish/whitefish option that I often recommend for pink, because you will already be having fish 2x a week and when TTC you should only eat fish 2x a week.

Pink swayers going HT – Eat upper level of protein intake but it may help to stick with chicken, turkey, and pork.

Blue swayers – Upper level of meat intake, stick with beef, goat, lamb, game meats, and only occasionally pork and dark meat poultry.

Blue swayers going HT – follow directions for blue swayers above.

:superhero:Eggs. Avoid the eggs that are advertised as being high in Omega 6 fats and supposedly “healthy” – they aren’t, and esp are not healthy for fertility!! For everyone but blue swayers going HT, on the days you eat eggs, you may want to eat a bit less meat because the protein in the eggs will compensate for the protein in the meat.

Pink swayers – 4 eggs a week

Pink swayers going HT- 8 eggs per week

Blue swayers – 2 eggs per day (this is an average, if you had a big omelet one day with 4 eggs then you can skip
eggs the next day and eat more meat)

Blue swayers going HT – 2 eggs per day AND eat upper level of protein.

:superhero:Fat intake. No one should be eating an extremely low fat diet while TTC. You NEED fat for your body to be able to make the sex hormones that enable us to get and stay pregnant.

Pink swayers – If you have been avoiding or limiting fat, increase intake to the upper level of LE Diet – 60 g. Focus on Omega 6 fats like vegetable oils as described in this essay http://genderdreaming.com/forum/gender-swaying-general-discussion/39013-skinny-fats-pink-blue.html However, if you have truly gone on swaying a very long time and are ready to pull out all the stops in order to get pregnant, start gradually increasing intake of Omega 3 and saturated fat…but be aware you will already be DOING this by adding in full fat dairy, eggs, and salmon. I recommend giving it a couple months just with that change before upping intake of blue-friendly fat.

Pink swayers going HT – Limit intake of Omega 6 fats in favor of Omega 3 and saturated fat. Follow the directions for blue. We do not have any evidence that changing the % of fat types does anything to help get a good gender split when going HT and I think it very important that you go in with the absolute best odds of HT success.

Blue swayers – Focus on Omega 3 and saturated fat as outlined in this essay. Limit Omega 6 intake and if you are taking evening primrose oil or flaxseed oil, be SURE you are taking an equal or preferably greater amount of fish oil. Avocado every day and coconut oil daily is also beneficial. Nuts are great for blue but DO be aware that they have a fair amount of Omega 6 fats in them so take care to balance that with Omega 3 and saturated fat http://genderdreaming.com/forum/gender-swaying-general-discussion/39013-skinny-fats-pink-blue.html

Blue swayers going HT – follow directions for blue swayers and you should also limit/avoid peanuts all together; while I do believe them to be good for blue, there is a little conflicting data about how they affect fertility and when in doubt, since HT is such an all-or-nothing thing, let’s err on the side of avoiding them when going HT.

:superhero:Chocolate, coffee, tea, alcohol, coconut water

These are all almost certainly beneficial in moderate amounts so as long as you do not have any known issues with egg quality. Moderate amounts of these foods/drinks as a treat are allowed for everyone. High intake of caffeine is not a good idea but 2 cups a day is fine – exception being if you have suffered repeat unexplained losses and just want to do anything possible to help boost the odds a little. Alcohol should of course be avoided if you may be pregnant but it is fine beforehand.

Coconut water is good for both pink and blue – an easy way to get a lot of much-needed potassium for very few calories and not many carbs.

We believe milk/white chocolate is “pinker” than dark chocolate – be sure to watch out for high levels of sugar/carbs in chocolate and limit serving size! But a little chocolate can help nip cravings for less beneficial, empty carb foods.

We believe coffee is “pinker” than tea

We believe red wine and dark beer are “bluer” than white wine, light and “lite” beer, and spirits

:superhero:Things to AVOID when trying to boost fertility

Excessive amounts of sugar/corn syrup/artificial sweeteners

Wheat, corn, peas, beans and other legumes and products made from them (such as breads, pastas, tortillas)

Wheatgrass juice – despite its reputation, the Drs Jaminet, authors of the Perfect Health Diet, believe that wheat contains harmful toxins made by the plant as natural pesiticides, and should be avoided. Wheatgrass would have even MORE of these toxins than the grains themselves. I think that particularly for blue swayers going HT, you don’t NEED the wheatgrass and let’s err on the side of caution and leave it out.

Seaweed in supplement forms such as spirulina, blue-green algae, chlorella, and the drinks containing them, and also probably kelp and kelp supplements, are best avoided when TTC. They contain toxins that are produced naturally by the plant (so the “purity” of the product has nothing to do with it, this is toxin that the plant grows naturally) and are not monitored by any governmental agency in terms of safety. The Japanese snack type of seaweed is probably fine and beneficial in dietary amounts.

Very low fat and very low carb diets, and very high protein diets unless recommended by your doctor on the basis of having severe PCOS and/or insulin resistance/prediabetes

Shellfish and organ meats, processed meats with high levels of nitrates, any fish that is high in mercury, and fish in any greater amount than the salmon 2x a week

Milk replacers or skim part/skim dairy. Full fat dairy has been proven to boost fertility so drop any alternate milk replacers, particularly rice milk and soy milk.

Royal Jelly and bee pollen. There is NOTHING in them other than a concentrated form of B vitamins and a little bit of fatty acid and protein (which you'll be getting in ample amounts). Plus, it sensitizes your body to the bee venom which may prime you for a fatal allergic reaction. People have DIED, both from taking RJBP in and of itself, and then also having taken it and then bee stings or exposure to RJBP in other foods/drinks at a later time.

Maca - huge unknown and next to no quality info about it. One person I know started hallucinating after taking it. If you're eating a healthy diet you don't need it anyway so why take the risk?

Soy for both you and DH. do NOT use soy isoflavones as a DIY-Clomid. IF you're having trouble conceiving, soy iso will only aggravate that in most cases. If you need Clomid, go to a doctor and get some.

Large intake of herbal teas such as peppermint – a cup of tea here or there is not going to have a negative effect, but even as little as 1 cup a day may have a deleterious effect on fertility. Even tea blends marketed as being GOOD for fertility often have bad juju in them (such as vitex which lowers fertility, alfalfa, and the cohoshes among many other herbs which can lower odds of conception and may reduce your body's ability to sustain a pregnancy. Stick with regular good old tea (both green and black), good and good for ya.

[fourunderfour]

I'm unable to read sections #4 and #5 in this thread! Is there any way I can get a hold of this information. I would really like to know the correct diet for a person with PCOS who is trying to sway PINK.
Thank you SO MUCH in advance!
Katie

[atomic sagebrush]

I'm unable to read sections #4 and #5 in this thread! Is there any way I can get a hold of this information. I would really like to know the correct diet for a person with PCOS who is trying to sway PINK.
Thank you SO MUCH in advance!
Katie

That's because I haven't had the time to complete them yet, I'm sorry.

[HopingWishingPraying]

HI Atomic

Thank you so much for this, it is very helpful. I have a few questions:

1) I had gestational diabetes with my first baby 6 years ago (mild and diet controlled, baby was not big etc, I only just scraped in over the level considered to be GD), but not at all with my next 2 babies (I was well under the value for GD). I have had a glucose challenge test after the first baby too and passed it easily. I have breastfed by boys for 2 years each and have heard that longterm breastfeeding can change the way a mother metabolises glucose and reduce her chances of developing diabetes, so maybe this is why. I am in a healthy weight range but definitely carry my weight on my stomach (apple shape) and could afford to lose some (I will on the LE diet!), and have long irregular cycles but have been tested for PCOS with bloodtests and told I didn't have it as my testosterone levels were fine. No other PCOS symptoms. Do you think the crash and burn diet is ok for me to do? I hope so as I have been planning it for ages and spent my time making meal plans etc.

2) Is Vitex compatible with breastfeeding? What about DCI? What does DCI stand for?

3) I am confused about whether chromium is for pink or blue swayers? You were saying it improves insulin levels so I thought that might mean it is good for pink swayers, but then you mentioned it is good for blue a bit later?

Thanks so much!

[atomic sagebrush]

Gestational diabetes is one of the most commonly misdiagnosed things around and I wonder that given your subsequent history, if you might have been misdiagnosed in the first place.

PCOS can be tough to diagnose, but the odds are good that if you got a clean bill of health, esp. with testosterone, you don't have it. That doesn't mean you couldn't develop it at a later date, tho.

I would give it a try on Crash and Burn and see how it goes, esp. since you're breastfeeding. It will SOON become apparent if you're having insulin resistance issues because you won't lose much weight if any, and you can then change it up at that point. (plus, weight loss will only help IR if you do have it.) If you notice anything weird - your cycles get longer, facial hair, acne, etc. then you can rethink things at that point.

Vitex is compatible with breastfeeding and I felt good enough about it to take it twice while BF (and I am pretty particular about what I take while BF)

DCI is D-chiro-inositol and it has never been tested while BF. I wouldn't use it because it's too much of an unknown.

The chromium concerns me for pink because it is a trace mineral and also because it's often taken by high protein dieters to better metabolize protein, and it's said to build muscle. I think it's better off used by blue swayers for now until we have more data.

[xHopeFaithLove]

more awesome advice.. thanks!

[Maple]

Tagging for reference :wink:

This is impressive Atomic, I cant imagine how much time you have put into this. I'm really thankful! XX

[babygirl]

What is the best fiber to take? I have seen a bulk forming laxative konsyl-d made from psyllium husks is this ok? or what would a good one be?

[atomic sagebrush]

psyllium is fine, a lot of people are allergic to it so be on the lookout for hives.

Any fiber is ok as long as it doesn't have added nutrients, some do.

[GeCon]

So my gyn has done a U/S the other day and commented that there are a few cysts on each ovary (about 5-7 on each). I realise that this is not a huge amount, but it has got me thinking. And it is another week and a half until I get the results from the blood test.

I have read that some women who have PCOS do not have any cysts at all, so I guess the quantity does not really mean a lot.

My cycles are very irregular (always have been, but I put it down to the effects of BCP and then BF'ing). In previous cycles it appears that my body was gearing up to O, but didn't. Does that mean it could have tried to release an egg, but grown the follicle into a cyst instead?

I am a bit of a stress-head and have some dark hairs from the belly-button downwards and on the inside of my thighs, so maybe increased testosterone.

I was on the LE diet from Nov 2011-Jan 2012 and lost over 10kg on it (1500 calories per day, eating lots of white bread/pasta/rice and lots of empty calories). Does the weight loss mean that PCOS is not so likely? Or could I have developed it since then as I have been on a pretty bad diet since?

Oh, and I carry most of my excess weight around the belly.

:think:

[atomic sagebrush]

Weight loss does help with pcos but the empty carbs can aggravate it.

You need to have several findings for it to be pcos...not just the cysts.

[Shenanigans]

Thank you for this! I normally only have a cycle once or twice a year and have PCOS. I have 3 boys who are 6, 3 and just turned 1. I was able to finally start a cycle when TTC#3 by taking the inositol, femaprin (vitex), vitaminD3 and a few other things. I conceived DS3 that very first cycle but didn't ovulate until day 45. I am now on cycle day 43 and no ovulation yet with the same regimen. I am trying to eat low protein, more calcium, etc and small portions, while always skipping breakfast. I have always eaten breakfast when TTC my boys. I desperately want a little girl and want to sway but am concerned it will make my almost non existant ovulation even more so. Any advice?? Thank you!

*Also, my first 2 boys were conceived by taking meformin and clomid.

[atomic sagebrush]

Metformin and Clomid is still a good pink sway, even tho it is not a guarantee as you already know. I would not hesitate at all about going that route again. That is not why you got boys and we've had 90% success rate with LE Diet + Clomid for pink.

the thing with PCOS and ovulation is it's actually the opposite of why you stop ovulating from LE Diet. So going on LE Diet (modified to be PCOS friendly, without all the empty carbs) is very likely going to HELP you ovulate, not prevent it.

With PCOS, you don't go as low in protein as others do. 50-60 g protein for you, no less than that. If you cut back too far in protein, your blood sugar level may go bonkers and end up inadvertently raising testosterone.

[Shenanigans]

Thanks so much for your input! I will be trying to calculate my protein better as I didn't realize that. I am on day 48 and still no O but it seems as if my body has been trying to for at least a couple weeks. With DS3 my body faked me out and I thought I O'd on day 30 but the temps wouldn't stay very high, then I really O'd on day 45 and we had happened to dtd 3 days before. I am currently 189 lb's so need to lose 30-40 lb's. I started at 202 though and this is the lowest I have been before conceiving my 3 boys. Should I just keep waiting on my body to eventually O and just keep losing more weight in the mean time or maybe start progesterone cream to bring on AF again and try clomid? Sorry for being so long winded! I really appreciate you taking the time to reply!

[GeCon]

Weight loss does help with pcos but the empty carbs can aggravate it.

You need to have several findings for it to be pcos...not just the cysts.

So having been diagnosed with mild PC ovaries I am wondering how do I know if the empty carbs aggravate it? :think:

With it only being mild, can I continue the diet the way I have been or should I make some changes regardless?

[atomic sagebrush]

Thanks so much for your input! I will be trying to calculate my protein better as I didn't realize that. I am on day 48 and still no O but it seems as if my body has been trying to for at least a couple weeks. With DS3 my body faked me out and I thought I O'd on day 30 but the temps wouldn't stay very high, then I really O'd on day 45 and we had happened to dtd 3 days before. I am currently 189 lb's so need to lose 30-40 lb's. I started at 202 though and this is the lowest I have been before conceiving my 3 boys. Should I just keep waiting on my body to eventually O and just keep losing more weight in the mean time or maybe start progesterone cream to bring on AF again and try clomid? Sorry for being so long winded! I really appreciate you taking the time to reply!

I would do a shot or cream to bring on AF and then do Clomid. I would also try to keep losing weight tho - it will only help your sway and the PCOS as well. (you're doing great BTW!!)

[atomic sagebrush]

So having been diagnosed with mild PC ovaries I am wondering how do I know if the empty carbs aggravate it? :think:

With it only being mild, can I continue the diet the way I have been or should I make some changes regardless?

It's believed by some researchers that the majority of women would eventually get PCOS if their diet supported it strongly enough, so since you already have some tendencies in that direction, I don't think you have anything to lose by cutting back empty carbs and focusing more on fruit and veg and whole grain.

I would NOT go all the way with the PCOS diet (so don't limit carbs per se, just eat less empty carbs) and I'd stick to the lower protein guidelines for now and then see how you go. I don't want you to lose too much weight and end up stopping ovulation...most people need to include some empty carbs to help keep weight on.

[myrainbowgirl]

Hi Atomic, I have been told by one doc that I have PCOS...cysts on ovaries, long irregular cycles, and acne. Normal hormones, though...normal testosterone, not insulin resistant, etc. I am concerned about aggravating my long cycles on the LE diet as well. I am currently just trying to lower calorie & fat intake. Lowering protein a little, but not too much. Also, I am a breakfast cereal JUNKIE (a giant bowl every morning, with whole milk, and 2 times a week for lunch)...trying to eat a variety of things at breakfast now, . (I am still eating breakfast because I am still breastfeeding my 11 mo.) I am waiting much later in the morning for my breakfast (after I work out, usually not eating till 9:30-10), and probably eating 1/2 the calories I used to eat.

Even though this is not full-on LE diet, will the changes I'm making sway pink?

Also, I have tons of EWCM...like for 5-6 days before O. Should I take an antihistamine? What days? I am thinking we will do frequent BD in some form, through O, to maximize chance of pregnancy, since we are older (I'm almost 36, DH is 38.)

Sorry for all the questions, I have so much to learn!

One more...should I be doing any diet at all while bf? I am 5'7" and 125 lb., so not much weight to lose. Maybe I should just reduce my morning calories & diet harder once I'm done BF?

Can you tell I'm overwhelmed?? Haha. Thanks for any feedback you might have!

[atomic sagebrush]

Any changes you make in a more Low-Everything direction, will only help.

If you're breastfeeding, I recommend antihistamine as a rescue only - take one the day of your attempt and that's all. Cetirizine 6 hours before or diphenhydramine 1-2 hours before (I find diph. makes my baby drowsy when I use it and prefer peopel use the cetirizine)

Yes, you can do LE Diet while breastfeeding. You should up cal intake to keep the weight on and yoru milk supply up. If you choose to take fiber you will want to add in a vit. drop with Vit. D and DHA for your baby (your baby takes this, not you) you don't need to lose any weight, just hold steady.

[myrainbowgirl]

Thanks again for your responses to all my questions! Sooo helpful!

[atomic sagebrush]

thanks for your patience! :)

[Bigwish]

Ok, i'm very in doubt whether to ask this already but, well, i do it anyway, LOL

My question at the end is: is it likely that i have pcos amd how urgent is it to switch to the whole grain/vegetable le diet instead of the crash and burn (empty calories) le diet?

- i have many pos opk's or near pos. (Just had two the recent days, cd 6 and cd 7)
- i am not loosing weight easily without exercising
- on a low carb diet i loose weight
- my LP is between 10 and 12 days
- my mensis is often 8 days or longer with the heaviest blood loss on cd 5
- i have spotting in between
- my cycles aren't exactly 28 days anymore, but between 25 and 30 days.
- i have acne
- i have hair loss


Well, i think i should mention this to my GP, right? LOL

[atomic sagebrush]

Well, the prob. is that you can have tendencies towards PCOS without having it. PCOS is one of those weird things where it's not even really a disease, it's more like a variation of normal that probably helped people to survive back in the day, but in our modern world it becomes more of a problem.

My thinking is, for those people who don't lose weight either at 1500-1800 cals WITH exercise, or 1200 without it, or who gain weight when they add carbs, you may have the tendency towards PCOS. It doesn't mean you have it all the way, and it will probably not show up on tests at your doctor's office, but you should try to adjust your diet in a more PCOS friendly way by:

Increase protein to 50-60 g
Eat upper level of fat
Keep cal intake the same
(Since you get more cals from pro and fat, you will effectively lower your carb intake without even thinking about it)
get carbs from wholegrains (possibly even limit grains to 2-3 servings a day) and fruit and veg, fresh and fiber-rich best

Do moderate exercise even if you cannot do the intense exercise - the benefits for blood sugar are enormous.

[atomic sagebrush]

the benefit of mentioning it to your doctor is sometimes you can come out of it with Clomid.

[Bigwish]

Thanks AS!

Well, it's difficult to tell whether i have it or not, based on symptoms. I could have it, i think, but then i doubt it again.

Fact is i do loose weight as i stick to 1200kcal (if i exercise then i can eat somewhat more) but as soon as i cheat i'm not loosing anything.

I feel not comfortable with switching to whole grains and nutrient rich foods. Maybe i have to wait what my gp says about having pcos or not. And even if she'll give me clomid, it's still better to switch to whole grains and veggies, isn't it?

I keep thinking what would be safe for me with respect to swaying: lower fast sugars amd thereby insuline levels, but as a result increasing nutrients/minerals/vitamines...
Tough one!

[atomic sagebrush]

Well, even if you have the tendency you can still benefit from the PCOS version of diet, and it may not show up on the tests at the doctor's office.

I'm going to message you...

[lindi]

Atomic, I've always been interested in how heavily PCOS might sway blue, and thought I would share a quick poll I did on a PCOS forum I am a member of. After simply asking on the mommy board whether ladies had a boy or girl, I've had about 30 respondents so far, and 75% have boys. I shared the Valerie Grant hypothesis, since it was the easiest link to explain where the idea for the survey came from. Thought you would find this number interesting. Don't know how many more responses I will get, clearly the more people respond the more it will have any meaning, but I was pretty taken with what seems to be a very strong blue sway with PCOS!

[atomic sagebrush]

thank you so much lindi!!! very helpful.

[atomic sagebrush]

also we have to keep in mind that some women with PCOS are given medications that we know sway pink such as Clomid and Metformin so it may be a stronger sway than that for people who are not on medicatiion.

[lindi]

Yes, a lot of the women on those boards needed clomid and metformin, and still the stats were almost 75% boy.

[gurly]

Do you have any links to research re:vitamin E being bad for pcos? I find this particularly interesting and important because many women with pcos (or more specifically insulin resistance) have fatty liver and vitamin E is shown to be the most effective treatment in healing and preventing further scaring from forming.

[atomic sagebrush]

If i said it, then it exists and I read it somewhere or I would not have included it in the essay. I don't make stuff up. The problem is that I don't know if it was in one of my books or online or what and I have no time to go hunting stuff down.

There is a ton of info about how Vitamin E may not actually be that great for health in more than dietary levels. proceed with caution while using

[atomic sagebrush]

antioxidants may increase insulin resistance and raise diabetes risk Diabetes Update: Antioxidant Vitamins Raise Insulin Resistance and Render Exercise Useless (http://diabetesupdate.blogspot.com/2009/10/antioxidant-vitamins-raise-insulin.html) Thus Vit E would be bad for PCOS

[gurly]

If i said it, then it exists and I read it somewhere or I would not have included it in the essay. I don't make stuff up. The problem is that I don't know if it was in one of my books or online or what and I have no time to go hunting stuff down.

There is a ton of info about how Vitamin E may not actually be that great for health in more than dietary levels. proceed with caution while using

hmmm I never insinuated that you made it up, not sure where that's coming from. I find this interesting and certainly something I would like to address with my endo if it's pertinent to my health.

[atomic sagebrush]

ok I answer tons of questions and messages a day and can't always take time to reread my posts, sorry if it came off rude, not my intention

i then posted a link to one of the studies

also I believe in the book Fertility Foods by Dr. Jeremy Groll (but not 100% sure, may have been one of my other books)

[sbowman]

What about this study? http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/m/pubmed/23285432/
I have seen others like this too...I just can't wrap my head around antioxidants being bad. Aren't they in coffee?


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[atomic sagebrush]

there are always studies that claim to show this thing or that thing, the sources in the article I posted are much more reliable and the studies involved 10-20 thousand people. Taking antioxidants has not extended life and in some studies actually seems to be cutting it short (and Vit. E is somethign I have seen again and again that seems to be a bad guy when taken in high doses)

Some antioxidants gotten from FOODS vs. supps = GOOD. Megadoses of antioxidants = not always good.

It's pretty complicated but sometimes when we take supplements, our bodies stop doing things they are supposed to do, and are a zillion times better at, than supplements, so we trade something good for something that's not that great really. Your body needs some free radicals to do jobs and those same antioxidants can actually fuel cancer cells - if something helps normal cells, it can help cancer cells too. And antioxidants by definition, are capable of chemically bonding with stuff (the thinking was tht they'd bond with free radicals, but what happens if there are more antioxidants floating around than free radicals --- they bond with other stuff!!) Can you get too many antioxidants? (http://whfoods.org/genpage.php?tname=george&dbid=143) so it's best to eat foods with nutrients in them and let our bodies do what they do best and decide how many and what to take from those foods.

At no point ever in human history have people taken vitamins. It's not "natural" to take them - that doesn't mean it's bad necessarily, but we can't assume it's good either. We are all part of the biggest experiment ever known.

[sbowman]

That makes sense. I don't plan on taking any vitamin e or antioxidant supplements myself but I was concerned about the food amounts...this pcos/insulin resistance business is just exhausting trying to figure out what's best.


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[The Anchor]

You know I am slowly realizing that this was true for me. After my m/c I started taking every supplement ever recommended for fertility EVER. I am firmly of the belief now that this actually prevented me from getting pregnant. And why wouldn't it? I had never taken anything remotely resembling the "pharmacy" concoction I convinced myself my body needed. Three OHWs. I've been TTC for the last year (not swaying, just wanting to be pg), and nothing. I just dropped everything last cycle (except FA, prenatal and vit D). We shall see :wink:

[atomic sagebrush]

Thank you for sharing your experience!! I got pg the month after I dropped vitex and I hope with all my might this is the case for you too. :cheer:

I agree and I have recently decided to be more vocal about this, both for swayers and for HT. I think we are creating problems that we wouldn't otherwise be having with some of this stuff. No one is not conceiving because they have a shortage of False Unicorn Root in their body, IKYKWIM.

[The Anchor]

Thank you for sharing your experience!! I got pg the month after I dropped vitex and I hope with all my might this is the case for you too. :cheer:

I agree and I have recently decided to be more vocal about this, both for swayers and for HT. I think we are creating problems that we wouldn't otherwise be having with some of this stuff. No one is not conceiving because they have a shortage of False Unicorn Root in their body, IKYKWIM.

Yes! (And thanks for the cheers :)) I'm sure maca is wonderful, but is it really some sort of miracle herb that can "regulate" my hormones? I'm thinking not...

[lindi]

I agree. PCOS is particularly complex, because there are a lot of supplements that help with the symptoms of PCOS, but maybe even if you are seemingly "curing" the PCOS, you may be throwing off other vital systems in your body.
The one thing I personally feel strongly about for PCOSers, and possibly a PCOS sway, is getting the insulin resistance dealt with, which can be helped along lowering carbs. Cutting sugar out of your diet certainly won't harm your system.
I think swaying pink with PCOS is particularly tricky just from reading all the wonderful stuff Atomic has researched.

[atomic sagebrush]

:agree: if you do one thing for PCOS, cut back on sugar and empty carbs (the ones without fiber)

[ThinkPink2014]

Reposting w the reply link I meant to use! :-)


atomic, thank you so much for this extremely useful thread. I have PCOS and am doing research to prep for my girl sway next year. I'm 33 and had my sweet baby boy this Jan. My primary PCOS symptom is the IR and not surprisingly I had GD during my pregnancy. I was on Metformin when I conceived and stayed on it my entire pregnancy. I'm still nursing and am off the Met, but will resume it next year when I begin my pre sway weight loss. I've already cut out wheat, which gives me high sugars. I'm having a hard time losing weight while nursing and plan to gently wean after my son is a year old to begin my pre sway efforts. I'm sure I'll be asking some questions in the not so distant future. For now I'm taking lots of notes! Thanks again. Really appreciate it. :-)

[Adia]

:agree: if you do one thing for PCOS, cut back on sugar and empty carbs (the ones without fiber)

That alone has made the biggest improvement in my health. I have mild PCOS and what a huge difference cutting back on carbs has done for me!!

[atomic sagebrush]

Reposting w the reply link I meant to use! :-)


atomic, thank you so much for this extremely useful thread. I have PCOS and am doing research to prep for my girl sway next year. I'm 33 and had my sweet baby boy this Jan. My primary PCOS symptom is the IR and not surprisingly I had GD during my pregnancy. I was on Metformin when I conceived and stayed on it my entire pregnancy. I'm still nursing and am off the Met, but will resume it next year when I begin my pre sway weight loss. I've already cut out wheat, which gives me high sugars. I'm having a hard time losing weight while nursing and plan to gently wean after my son is a year old to begin my pre sway efforts. I'm sure I'll be asking some questions in the not so distant future. For now I'm taking lots of notes! Thanks again. Really appreciate it. :-)

Hi and welcome, let me know if I can help!

I did want to let you know that it's not at all unusual to have some trouble taking weight off while nursing for even 9 months to a year after giving birth. But it does happen eventually. I think your body wants to hang onto the weight till it's sure the baby and you are on the road to recovery and then and only then will it start to let it go. So don't feel like you ahve to wean in the future, just because you've had a bit of trouble taking off the weight now. The myth is that we will all go right back to our prepreg shapes in 6 weeks just because 6 ft tall supermodels with personal trainers and chefs claim that they did, but the reality is that it takes most of us more like 12-18 months to recover from childbirth. My daughter is 14 months old and only just now has that last 15 lbs slowly started coming off. :s

[sbowman]

That alone has made the biggest improvement in my health. I have mild PCOS and what a huge difference cutting back on carbs has done for me!!

Adia when did you start cutting carbs? Did you conceive any of your girls on a low carb diet?

I also found a blog that recommended going gluten free for pcos. Anyone have input on that?

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[Adia]

Adia when did you start cutting carbs? Did you conceive any of your girls on a low carb diet?

I also found a blog that recommended going gluten free for pcos. Anyone have input on that?

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Its interesting to read this because I always thought that PCOS swayed girl, not boy. My mom and many friends with PCOS have all had girls. Disclaimer: my mom had mostly girls, she was such a yo-yo weight gainer/loser that she had both girls and boy and she used Clomid for both genders.

I had to go gluten free after having DD3 - I was getting really sick. I was forced to cut carbs then but since I have been doing the HE I have cut back even more.

No, I didn't conceive my girls while on low-carb, I am the epitome of an LE eater when I was TTC my girls. I just don't feel like eating most mornings and I enjoy feeling hungry. I am always trying to watch my weight and I gain weight much easier than I lose it.

I honestly think it is almost a body type tendency towards an LE diet than an actual deliberate thought process. Which explains why it is so hard for people to do the LE when they are naturally very HE. And it explains why I have gained almost 20lbs on the HE after 12 months TTC.

[sbowman]

That's an interesting thought. It probably is a body type thing. I naturally eat a HE diet of course but I'm not over weight. My natural bmi seems to be about 21 and if I try to lose weight I can get down to 20, but the thing is everything I eat is healthy. Whole grains, healthy fats. I think that this is why I never noticed my tendency of insulin resistance before. I also stick to a diet of 1800 cals for weight loss with moderate exercise, always have strength training/resistance to build muscle, always eat a big breakfast and several snacks during the day. And I feel like I have a naturally muscular body type. I'm pretty happy with this except for the fact that I can't make a girl this way. :/


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[atomic sagebrush]

Adia when did you start cutting carbs? Did you conceive any of your girls on a low carb diet?

I also found a blog that recommended going gluten free for pcos. Anyone have input on that?

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I know of a few people who got girls on very strict Atkins diets.

[BabyBug]

Just an FYI: I conceived girls while very low carb. While VLC did a great job controlling my PCOS it's negative side effects (especially for women) really damaged my health (definitely screwed up my thyroid). I have been having great success managing PCOS with Perfect Health Diet (PHD) and supplementing with resistant starch in the form of potato starch and plantain flour. I have been able to go off of Metformin and it is helping a lot of other issues as well. For anyone curious this link is a pretty good basic introduction: Resistant Starch 101 - Everything You Need to Know (http://authoritynutrition.com/resistant-starch-101/)

The only downside I'm wondering about that this approach has worked so well to manage my insulin resistance and blood sugar I'm wondering if it will end up swaying pink (not what I'm looking for). Hope I did this right, I'm new to this posting thing - apologies if I neglected to observe any etiquette.

[atomic sagebrush]

Thank you so much!!! Very helpful info!! I am a huge fan of the Perfect Health Diet!!!

[honeybee]

This is a lot of good info here. Thank you! I met with the RE today as we've been trying for a year, and I have borderline pcos :(

[Bobster]

Sorry if this is a stupid question but I'm a bit confused about what you say to pick one item 5x per day on the pcos bit. Can you not have more than one item off these lists in 1 day? And what does 5 x a day mean?

I think I'm going to opt for the whole grains pcos style LE diet as my skin is Bad since having LO so if there's any chance it will help this and sway pink it would be great.

[atomic sagebrush]

I know that's confusuing, I have gone thru a zillion ways of trying to say that and that way seemed to confuse the fewest people. :)

You can have any of those foods in any combination 5 times a day, however that works out for you. If you want to have 2 eggs, 2 serv. of chicken, and scallops that is fine. If you want to eat only chicken that is fine. whatever works for you. YOu can have 3 serv. at lunch, 2 at dinner, or nothing at lunch, 5 serv at dinner, however it works best for you.

We have gotten good results on the alt. diets and I think whenever in doubt, use the alt diet. the only problem with them is that you may lose weight superquickly on them and also they are difficult to stick with for some.

[Threelittlemen2013]

Do you need to stick to this list when doing the alternate diet or can you make your own combo of foods as long as you stick to cal/fat/pro levels? I have been using foods off this list (sometimes more servings than what is recommended) and then adding in a few other whole grain choices to make it geared to what I like to eat.

[atomic sagebrush]

When doing alt. diets you TRY to stick to the limits but you'd get a higher % of your days' cals from fat and pro as outlined in one of the essays instead of carbs. And your carbs will need to come more from whole grains, fruits, and veg, small amounts in nuts OR if going gluten free, white rice is also allowed for those doing gluten free and they would obv. skip the wheat products.

But you do not need to stick to the lists, they are mainly for example as it's impossible for me to list literally every food under the sun in these threads LOL

So on the original PCOS Diet with the whole grains, you could have something like millet or quinoa which are whole grains ven if not listed. And on the AFD you could have something like taro root or tapioca instead of rice if you like those things.

[Bobster]

Sorry to ask another question atomic but I'm just wondering if we are still lowering the nutrient intake if on the pcos diet? I'm finding it hard to think of meals that are low nutrient, low carb, low sugar? I'm eating salads and cutting back on sweets/snacks. Found it too hard to count protein levels but I'm consciously trying to keep it low. So today I ate a bacon salad with lettuce, cucumber, sweet corn, onion and salad cream, a low fat yogurt, a chicken noodle broth for tea with bean sprouts and spring onions and some grapes and 2 slices of marmite on toast with lighter lurpack and another yogurt. Does this sound ok for Ttc a girl?

[covered in blue]

Bump

[atomic sagebrush]

Sorry to ask another question atomic but I'm just wondering if we are still lowering the nutrient intake if on the pcos diet? I'm finding it hard to think of meals that are low nutrient, low carb, low sugar? I'm eating salads and cutting back on sweets/snacks. Found it too hard to count protein levels but I'm consciously trying to keep it low. So today I ate a bacon salad with lettuce, cucumber, sweet corn, onion and salad cream, a low fat yogurt, a chicken noodle broth for tea with bean sprouts and spring onions and some grapes and 2 slices of marmite on toast with lighter lurpack and another yogurt. Does this sound ok for Ttc a girl?

Not as much as you are on the other diet but it is STILL going to be better than what you were doing before.

Please keep in mind that there is a HECK of a lot less nutrients in vegetables than ther is in some other foods. YOu would have to eat a mountain of veg to make up for the nutrients in a big mac, fries, choc shake.

What you ate was fine. :agree:

[Bobster]

Thanks so much ��

[Sunflower3]

A

[atomic sagebrush]

The wholegrains have not seemed to make the difference that we once thought they might. They are allowed and in fact mandatory for PCOS because the empty carbs will just raise blood sugar and testosterone.

ARe you tracking your nutrients?? How much fat are you getting?

[ttcpinkin2015]

Thanks Atomic - I've pm'd you

[atomic sagebrush]

OK I'll look for it. :)

[sammysam]

hi Atomic.... this is my first post. I have one boy conceived through clomid and trigger injection. I have pcos but haven't been on metformin for a while now as I felt fine without it. I was insulin resistant but my last test (a while ago) said I no was not. I still don't really ovulate as far as what I know and I want to TTC Girl asap. I used to be a personal trainer so I feel like I know a lot of what to do etc eating wise, and have been looking into the girl diet. After reading this I feel better as you seem to know a lot about pcos and also girl swaying. however, the pcos girl diet seems so different to the normal girl sway, with grains and not empty cars such as white pasta and white rice. I just feel a bit 'stuck' as to know what to do now. feeling like its all to hard and I should just 'cross my fingers and hope'. thoughts??
im also a bit lost about timing. I wanted to start with 5-4 day cut off, but now im reading stuff like the sperm like the same amount of time, and also that I need to keep douching or using aci-jel for the days after BD up until O, and others say the sperm is already up in the fallopian tubes in 4 hours so I don't need to continue keeping PH low after that amount of time. any clarification would be wonderful as im finding it hard on one of the facebook groups to get a clarification. thanks :)

PCOS PINK Sway Diet!!!!!!!!!!

When swaying with PCOS, insulin resistance, have a significant amount of weight to lose (more than 30 lbs), or are having trouble losing weight on the "crash and burn" style of LE Diet (this may be a sign that you are a bit insulin resistant), empty carbs are not going to help your sway. They may in fact harm your sway by sending your testosterone levels skyrocketing (other people would see T drop on the "crash and burn" style of LE Diet).

So if you fall into one of these categories, you need to change the proportions of protein and fat to carbs (cutting carbs overall in favor of more protein and fat) and get most, if not all, your carbs from small amounts of whole grains and fiber-rich fruit and vegetable (fresh or lightly cooked is much better than canned/well-cooked). This is what we call the "slow burn" style of LE Diet.

How does this work?? Protein and carbs have the same amount of calories in them - about 4 calories per gram. Fat has 9 calories a gram. So by getting more protein and more fat, you make up for any caloric deficit that you would incur by cutting back on carbs somewhat, and yet you are still sticking within the overall limits of LE Diet in terms of calories. Don't just cut out carbs, you'll starve that way! Remember, no one should ever drop below 1200 calories!! Also keep in mind that low carb vegetables are free for everyone on both types of diets - you do not count them for calories, fat, or protein and you can eat as much as you want.

Protein - increase to 50-60 g (up from 40-50 g) and if you are super tall and/or are working out a lot, you may want to even increase this a bit more. I would not increase over 70 g protein no matter what and if you're less than 5-10 (178 cm), I would not increase above 60 g unless you are exercising a lot.

Fat - should be at upper limits for calorie intake, so 30% of your calories from fat. On a 1200 cal diet this will be about 25 g fat, on an 1800 cal diet this will be about 60 g fat. Please make an extra effort to get the majority of your fat calories from Omega 6 and transfats as described in this essay http://genderdreaming.com/forum/gender-swaying-general-discussion/39013-skinny-fats-pink-blue.html

So while a traditional "crash and burn" type diet would look like this (and please try not to get too hung up on the numbers, this is really just ballpark for illustration only):


1500-1800 cals Roughly 1000-1500 cals are going to be from carbs, depending on the amount of calories overall and the proportions of protein/fat you are eating. These carbs can be in the form of empty white carbs but can also include small amounts of whole grains and also fruit and higher carb vegetables.

40-50 g protein 160-200 day's cals from protein

25-60 g fat 225-540 day's cals from fat
(and while you might wanna try to get more Omega 6 fats, if you're eating low fat in the 25 g range, it becomes less important to do this, and in fact you may need to make some effort to get at least a bit of saturated fat to ensure you continue ovulating.)

The "slow burn" type of diet would look more like this:

1500-1800 calories Roughly 750-1000 cals from carbs and these carbs will all be in the form of whole grains, fresh or lightly cooked fruit and higher carb veg with lots of fiber to help with insulin resistance
(and while I rarely LIKE to see anyone drop to 1200-1500 calories, some gals with PCOS/IR may benefit from this low a caloric intake at the beginning - as the weight comes off, insulin sensitivity will improve and you can increase calories at that point)

50-60 g protein 200-240 cals from protein, and if you're tall and/or are working out a lot, you can up this as high as 280

60 g fat 540 cals from fat
(and if you can get primarily Omega 6 fats, that's going to help your sway a lot - you don't need to worry about getting any Omega 3 or saturated fat, because your protein foods and the Omega 6 fats will have a little bit in them and that will maintain ovulation)

Wow that was a lot of writing and mathematical equations there! I know, I know, very confusing. So, here is a simplified version LE Diet I made for custom swayers with PCOS/IR - while it's not going to be right or necessary for everyone to be quite this strict, it will help you kinda envision what a "slow burn" type of LE Diet is going to look like.

(Where it says "eat X number of times a day" that means you eat that amount that many times per day. It's like the Weight Watchers points system - you can have 2 or 3 servings at one meal or 1 at 3 meals or however works the best for you. You do not, and in fact shouldn't, be eating 5 times a day on any form of LE Diet. On the "slow burn" style LE Diet, it can be very beneficial to your insulin response to have a nice long fast period up to 16 hours every day with no food coming in and this also seems to sway pink.)

--Eat every day:

1 full fat Brown Cow yogurt (or any full fat yogurt) OR 3/4 c whole milk
1 Taste Nirvana Coconut water (or any coconut water, that one is good tasting while some other brands are ucky)
(this will ensure you get a decent amount of potassium and will help with fat and protein)

--2-3 times a day, pick one :

(You can split them into smaller servings and have more often if you would prefer this. These products are not going to be available in all areas and in that case you just would substitute an equivalent product. The salt limits are only for those who are limiting sodium.)

½ c brown rice
½ c cooked whole wheat pasta
1 slice whole grain bread (NOT wheat bread, must be 100% whole grain)
4 Ry Krisp crackers (unsalted)
8 Hint of Salt Triscuits
16 Hint of Salt Wheat Thins
One graham cracker (this is a treat to be had when you’re craving something sweet and you MUST top with the peanut butter option below.)

2 times a day, pick one:

1-2 cup fruit (if the fruit is chunky and not too sweet like watermelon, you can have more; if it’s kind of dense like blueberries, stick with the smaller amount.
1 baked potato (pick a smallish one)
1 baked yam (smallish one)
Carrot Sticks (you can have quite a few, like 2 carrots’ worth)
1 banana
1 apple or pear (I actually want you to leave the skins on these for extra fiber that will keep your blood sugar in check.)
1 corn on the cob
½ c storebought pasta sauce

5 times a day pick one:

2 egg whites
1 whole egg (best to keep these to a few times per week to prevent getting too much saturated fat)
2 T hummus
½ c beans, lentils, or peas
1 1x1 inch **** of cheese
2 chick. nugget size pieces of chicken (use on top of salad or on taco)
1 oz. turkey (ground or sliced deli meat)
Piece of tofu about the size of a deck of cards
1/8 of a cup of nuts or seed (use to top a salad)
3 large shrimp or scallops (this is an occasional treat – no more than 2x a week)
2 T peanut butter (eat on top of the graham crackers if you are craving something sweet)

(eating that amount of the above foods, plus the protein in the yogurt/whole milk and grains, will ensure you get enough protein)

3-5 times a day pick one:

If you don't NEED to eat them, this is a place to cut some cals, but please feel free to include them if you would like.

1 T oil (corn or vegetable oil with Omega 6 fats are best)
1 T butter (margarine with Omega 6 fats may be better)
1 T mayo
1 T not-very-sweet salad dressing like vinaigrette or ranch
1 T whipping cream (can pour over berries)
1 T parmesan cheese

UNLIMITED

You can have as much as you want.
Mustard and unsweetened Salsa
Mushrooms
Herbs
All low carb veggies (asparagus, bell pepper, broccoli, cauliflower, eggplant, green beans, lettuce, spinach, spaghetti squash, tomato, zucchini)
If you can, use leeks and green onions instead of garlic and onion

[atomic sagebrush]

Sammy, we are getting GREAT results with the PCOS diets, please don't feel you're selliing your sway short in any way. Our results for PCOSers on standard diet were not good and ever since I started changing it up with PCOS diets, our results have skyrocketed. I am actually using these diets more and more and it may actually be the case that they are better for everyone!! This is a work in progress and

Don't cross fingers and hope unless you are ok with another boy.

Both timing and pH have been debunked and you can read more about the reasons why in the links below. You 110% do NOT need to keep douching and testing pH for days on end. That is a bunch of baloney and our results have done nothing but improve since we dropped all that silly stuf.
http://genderdreaming.com/forum/gender-swaying-general-discussion/7691-trouble-timing.html
http://genderdreaming.com/forum/gender-swaying-general-discussion/11684-ph-pickle.html

[sammysam]

once again, thanks Atomic. really appreciate it! I will follow the pcos diet, I fell like its better for me anyway (with the whole grain stuff especially) and veggies.

[Grace]

I'm intrested in the pink fertility diet, since I've been ttc'ing for a year now and I am in my early 40's. However, the diet includes meat and fish, and I am vegetarian. With peas, beans and other legumes excluded from the diet, I'm left with very little protein sources. Since I do not have pcos (not that I know of anyway), is it ok to eat some legumes? How about wheat and corn? Any suggestions??

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[atomic sagebrush]

The legume avoidance is not for the PCOS issue, nor for swaying, it's because legumes have compounds in them that may be harmful to fertility. Peas were even being investigated to be used in new kinds of birth control. It's not that you can NEVER have them if you choose, just keep it to a few times a week.

In your early 40's, you actually should limit carbs to some extent and since legumes are carby you may not want that many of them anyway.

Dairy, eggs, and nuts a possibility??

Wheat and corn are not considered great for fertility either.

What you have to understand as you look at these diets is that it's best to look at them as a guideline. If you need to include SOME wheat, corn, legumes in your diet, that's ok. But you may want to treat rice, fruit, veg, dairy, eggs, as your primary sources and then fill in what you need iwth foods that aren't strictly on the diet. These diets aren't "eat this and only this or fail" it's just a guideline to changes you can make that may help overall. It's totally possible to do this in a 70-30% or even 60-40 kind of way where you just do what you can do and then what you can't, let go of.

[Grace]

Wow, I keep learning new things from you Atomic! Thank you!

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[chocolate]

So would I need to make sure I had the minimum from each group or does it not matter if I only have 1 serving from the 2 to 3 times a day?

Thanks

[atomic sagebrush]

there are two ways to approach it, chocolate. If you want to be "perfectly perfect" on LE guidelines you'd want to use that as a guideline while sticking in the limits for cals, protein, and fat. But a lot of the PCOS swayers have found it very difficult to track all that stuff and so I came up with those guidelines with the number of servings and stuff like that. If you were to do the max number of servings on everything, you would prob. be beyond LE Diet limits but it's meant as an easier to follow compromise diet that you don't have to think so much about. REmember, getting enough food is actually just as important as limiting your food intake because cutting back too far can really wreak havoc with your ovulation.

So nutshell version:

If you want to be absolutely "perfect" on the LE Diet front you would do the type of foods we discuss in this thread while sticking in PCOS LE limits (1500-1800 cals, 50-60 g protein, 50-60 g fat) and yes in that case you may need to do less servings than are in that diet at least on SOME things, some days.

BUT if you find all the tracking and balancing too stressful (and it is extremely tough to get it right on PCOS type diets) then just follow those limits and you'd want to have those minimum number of servings (so where it says 2-3 servings, you HAVE to have at least 2 servings) because we need to be sure you're getting enough. Some days you may go a little over but that is ok, because you'll be getting enough for a healthy and safe pregnancy and also be in line with your needs with the PCO.

No one should drop below those guidelines in the PCOS diet UNLESS they are also tracking nutrients ON THEIR OWN.

[babiixmagic]

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[atomic sagebrush]

oops no questin in the message, babii

[babiixmagic]

I didnt mean to post in this thread sorry =)

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[Beautifulrainbow]

Taging for my reference :prof:

[Kittybear]

Noting this for my reference and to read again later! X

[chocolate]

Tagging for my reference too X

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[2lovelyboys]

Also following :)

[Babybun]

Tagging for my reference [emoji846]


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[MrsFourBoys]

Following so I dont loose it ;)

[Complex Emotions]

Use iodized salt instead of sea salt or table salt. You need ample iodine to be able to sustain a pregnancy. If you can’t find or don’t want to use iodized salt, add in an iodine supplement of 150 IU or a prenatal containing that amount of iodine. If you have any history of thyroid issues and especially if you are taking medication for thyroid, PLEASE double check with your doctor before beginning iodine...

...Seaweed in supplement forms such as spirulina, blue-green algae, chlorella, and the drinks containing them, and also probably kelp and kelp supplements, are best avoided when TTC. They contain toxins that are produced naturally by the plant (so the “purity” of the product has nothing to do with it, this is toxin that the plant grows naturally) and are not monitored by any governmental agency in terms of safety...

I don't have any thyroid problems but I understand that iodine is important when trying to conceive.I'm trying to limit my salt intake so I don't take iodized salt. Instead I've been taking this kelp iodine supplement from GNC: GNC SuperFoods Kelp - GNC NATURAL BRAND - GNC (http://www.gnc.com/GNC-SuperFoods-Kelp/product.jsp?productId=13014248&network=g&device=c&product_id=12991302&creative=146786321001&c3ch=PLA&c3nid=12991302&matchtype=&adpos=1o1&gclid=CNnZksCzk9ACFQ6dfgodi-gP2A&eesource=CA_DF:13014248:GNC)

Is this the kind of thing you're saying we shouldn't take while ttc due to plant toxins? Is there another way to get enough iodine without salt or meat?

[atomic sagebrush]

Yes, I am not a fan of the kelp based iodines. There are a lot of prenatals with iodine in them (and honestly, as long as you've been dieting, I'd recommend this for you anyway!) so what I'd have you do is take a prenatal or Women's One a Day (which I prefer) 3 times a week.

Shellfish is another way to get iodine and you can have that 2x a week.

[Complex Emotions]

...what I'd have you do is take a prenatal or Women's One a Day (which I prefer) 3 times a week.

Shellfish is another way to get iodine and you can have that 2x a week.

Wow! So, I've really come full circle in this sway process, haven't I? I never thought I'd see the day when Atomic recommended I take a prenatal. :wink:

Would you recommend both the Women's One a Day 3x a week and shellfish once or twice a week? Or just either or? I'm concerned that only getting iodine 3x a week might not be enough.

Also, I see the Women's One a Day has 300% of the recommended dose for vitamin D. I remember you've said vitamin D should be avoided for a girl sway, but I'm not sure how much of a factor it is. Is the D thing a hypothetical maybe situation, or have you seen this to be a big deal in practice?

I also just bought solgar folate tablets (http://www.solgar.com/SolgarProducts/Folate-800-mcg-as-Metafolin-Tablets.htm) since I've heard that it's better absorbed than folic acid. There are no indications that I need it instead of plain folic acid, but this is the safer route to go right?

[miniña]

HI,

Im a bit confused by this diet. I thought that Bananas and Potatoes were a NO-NO when swaying pink, and I see them included here! Also since red meat is another NO-No I decided to change it for Fish, but I see very little fish is included in this diet :nails:

[atomic sagebrush]

At some point when people have been on diet a long time, it's a compromise to keep you going longer without getting depleted. It is of course, my preference for people to lose the tactics that don't work a little sooner and thus avoid the prenatal but I do eventually recommend them. :)

It's enough. I won't go into the history of iodine deficiency and public health, but it's enough. If you want to add in shellfish too - I am fine with all pink swayers having that one-two times per week.

I personally believe Vit. D is a big blue swayer, but the thing is, after this point you've been on diet soooo long you probably need it. 3 times a week is not daily. :)

Folate is better if you can get it. The reason I do not blanket prescribe it, is that a lot of people can't afford folate and thus will end up taking nothing. Since most people do great on folic acid, I think it's best to continue to recommend that for eveyrone except those with MTHFR. That doesn't mean folate is not better - it is (probably LOL)

[atomic sagebrush]

HI,

Im a bit confused by this diet. I thought that Bananas and Potatoes were a NO-NO when swaying pink, and I see them included here! Also since red meat is another NO-No I decided to change it for Fish, but I see very little fish is included in this diet :nails:

Bananas and potatoes are only a "no-no" if you're following the French Gender Diet or IG Diet. I assure you I ate gobs of potatoes when I got my daughter (she is like 30% potato.)

I do not want ANYONE eating fish more than 2x a week when you are TTC (and even when you're in your childbearing years). There is some bad pollution that is in fish and eating it too often may accumulate in your body and affect you and your baby's health negatively.

[atomic sagebrush]

You can't go off of and onto vitamins though. that kinda messes you up - first it makes your body tend to save more nutrients up anyway, and then going off nutrients cold turkey may make you not feel well and could potentially delay O. I want you either on them or off them, not on and off them.

[atomic sagebrush]

The problem with getting iodine from plant sources is that it is about the amount present in the soil. So a depleted soil = not enough iodine. Some areas have much less iodine than they used to. I vastly prefer you guys to just eat shellfish once a week than rely on getting anything from vegetables.

Dried seaweed - fine on occasion a few times a month. No more than that (so like, you have sushi once a week - great). You can actually end up ODing on iodine if you eat too much of the stuff.

[Complex Emotions]

I've recently read that potatoes are a great source of iodine. Apparently a single, medium-sized potato meets 40% of your iodine needs.

Some sites suggest that a quarter cup of cranberries will also provide a high amount.

I know you've recommend staying away from seaweed supplements for toxin reasons, but what about snacking on a little bit of dried seaweed? Apparently that's supposed to be a tremendous source of iodine.

Do any/all of these sound okay for pink sway iodine solutions?

[atomic sagebrush]

The problem with getting iodine from plant sources is that it is about the amount present in the soil. So a depleted soil = not enough iodine. Some areas have much less iodine than they used to. I vastly prefer you guys to just eat shellfish once a week than rely on getting anything from vegetables.

Dried seaweed - fine on occasion a few times a month. No more than that (so like, you have sushi once a week - great). You can actually end up ODing on iodine if you eat too much of the stuff.

I am not sure how this happened but my answer somehow ended up above your post???

Please just eat a little fish or shellfish once a week and it will be fine. Or use iodized salt.

Again, supposed naturlly occuring iodine in plant foods are entirely contingent on where the food was grown and whether or not the soil is rich in iodine or not. It's a crapshoot. Additionally, many sources of iodine (alleged) were because farmers used to use iodine washes as disinfectants, but these have been largely replaced by cheaper alternatives and thus they are no longer sources of iodine.

pLease just use the most reliable source and not try to patchwork together with things that may not even have any iodine in them.

[Twopinkplease]

So for the LE PCOS diet, as long as I stick to:
60g protein
60g fat
1200 cals
Mostly vegetarian with limited white meat and eggs, full fat dairy and no white flour/rice/sugar/etc, it's pretty good?

Anything specifically to avoid for pink sways?

[atomic sagebrush]

You are almost certainly going to need more calories than that. There is very little way to get that much food with so few calories. Only about 3% of all my swayers eat that few cals, most others are on 1500-1800 and some - maybe as many as 10%-20% depending on the month are as high as 1800-2000!

PLEASE start out eating MORE than you think you need. You can always reduce cal intake over time. But do NOT start off starving yourself only to have to add more food later on, that can be perceived as an improving condition which may undermine a pink sway.

[babybells]

So glad I re read this again!!!

NO LONGER RECOMMENDED L-Carnitine – Helps to get rid of glucose in the blood that your body isn’t metabolizing and also helps your body turn food into muscle,which will burn off more calories than body fat. (sways blue) LADIES - I no longer recommend this at all due to the fact that it raises T levels and may aggravate PCOS that way. If you have already bought some, you can give it to your husband if you're swaying blue.


I recently added L-Carnitine into the mix for my weight loss, so will be dropping that now. Also would you reccommend all these supps if you have an underactive thyroid?>

Pink swayers – I would feel good about taking vitex, SP, DIM, DCI, magnesium, fiber, and cinnamon. And don’t forget Vitamin X!!

[atomic sagebrush]

Yes, sorry about that, sometimes when I've read the same essay 900 times I miss things that I'd not have put in there had I written it a year or two later.

Please doublecheck everything with your doctor. I do not use vitex or SP for swaying any more for thyroid patients as they haven't worked anyway. DIM and DCI I have not really seen any results so I'd not use them given that we've seen such great results with diet alone (and also myo-inositol)

Magnesium is at your discretion, fiber I do tend to recommend but again please check with your doc first to make sure.

Cinnamon is not something I recommend as a blanket recommendation. It REALLY lowers blood sugar to such extent it can actually make people lightheaded and it takes only a pretty small dose (*just like 1/4 a teaspoon!!). It can also make weight fly off of people. So unless you have moderate to severe PCO and have more than 30 lbs to lose I"d skip the cinnamon. If you are in that group, go ahead but start off with only 1/4 teaspoon (if you tolerate it ok you can gradually build up to 1/2 teaspoon). When actively TTC reduce to 1/8 teaspoon during the luteal phase and at BFP wean back to dietary amounts only. Use Ceylon and not cassia cinnamon.

[hopper]

Hi Atomic, just reading about the LE PCOS diet as I had an opposite last year following the regular LE diet. In hindsight I'm thinking I did a crash and burn type diet with calories no higher than 1500 per day, I regularly exceeded the recommended fat and protein max intake as I couldn't manage to give up meat, though I did cut back. I didn't exercise.
I'm on day 3 of my second attempt and seeing now that you recommend this PCO version for those of us having a failed sway under our belts. I'm not sure what I should do though seeing as my previous sway was watching the cals more than the nutrients though I did eat general low nutrition foods it was hard to stay under protein and fat when I was having meat pretty much daily or every two days at the very very least.
So this time I've started by giving up meat, all meat now not just red meat like previously. I've also given up eggs which I would consume frequently on any given day. I've started the cardio at 60+ mins per day. No snacking at all. Fairly substantial gaps between meals (from last night to today it was verging on 16 hours but that was cause I was super busy and had no time!) I'm trying to take in 3 meals daily as I limited myself to two last time but finding it hard get the time to have that third meal (last night I had a glass of wine with some salad and fat free marshmallows to up my intake of cals)
My question anyway, after all that, is should I stick with what I've started or change it up? And if I should change it how do I tweak it without making it a big thing? Trying to be as horizontal as I can this time after the OCD of last time 😉 Thank you!

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[atomic sagebrush]

I can't totally say, but the thing is that the PCOS type diet has GREAT results. Now, I don't totally know if that's because the diet sways harder, or that some of the people who do standard should have been on it, or what, but you aren't shortchanging your sway by doing it instead if you can stick to it without losing too much weight. I'd really use it for everyone except for those two things - it's harder to stick to, and people lose too much weight on it. So what I'd probably do is try to do is aim at doing some elements of the alt. diet (like whole grains, fruit and veg instead of sugar and white carbs) and just see how it goes.

I do not want ANYONE to do lower than 1500 cals. I was always stressing that but I am even more emphatic that it actually may harm a sway to drop that low (and it certainly activates the OCD because not only are you tracking stuff, but it takes SOOO much willpower to stick to so few calories) I want maybe 5% absolute max of people to drop lower than 1500.

[Shenanigans]

Ok so im not exactly sure where to start. Baby boy #5 is 5 days old today. We tried to sway pink but I am seeing I did some things wrong. Like drinking lots of caffeine. I have PCOS and am overweight and usually do not ovulate without clomid or femara. I am 36 now and will be 37 in April. We want to sway again but i want to do everything in my power to make it a great one. I do see alot about the diet but im also unsure of how to start when exclusively breastfeeding. Im hoping to lose plenty of weight (have at least 50 lb to lose) and miraculously ovulate on my own even while breastfeeding. I paid for the personal sway last time but am not sure when i should even start anything this time. I just know my age is not on my side with waiting too long....

[Girlswaylondon]

I’m drinking lots of coffee, should that be stopped?

[atomic sagebrush]

I’m drinking lots of coffee, should that be stopped?

Coffee sways pink. We've gotten great results with it and I strongly recommend it. In fact that was among the first things I noticed about the old school swaying tactics that didn't seem to add up, was that there were tons of blue swayers and peopel I knew IRL with lots of girls who drank tons of coffee.

[atomic sagebrush]

Ok so im not exactly sure where to start. Baby boy #5 is 5 days old today. We tried to sway pink but I am seeing I did some things wrong. Like drinking lots of caffeine. I have PCOS and am overweight and usually do not ovulate without clomid or femara. I am 36 now and will be 37 in April. We want to sway again but i want to do everything in my power to make it a great one. I do see alot about the diet but im also unsure of how to start when exclusively breastfeeding. Im hoping to lose plenty of weight (have at least 50 lb to lose) and miraculously ovulate on my own even while breastfeeding. I paid for the personal sway last time but am not sure when i should even start anything this time. I just know my age is not on my side with waiting too long....

I don't think drinking coffee is bad though Shenanigans. The studies that claim that are largely debunked (even with PCOS) because they didn't take into account blood sugar across the WHOLE day and not just right after eating adn addionally didn't correct for an overall worse diet. So many of the PCOSers were eating poorly, lots of sugar, and then drinking tons of coffee or whatever on top of that, plus they tested blood sugar only immediately after drinking it. But over time coffee improves your insulin response, this is way, way more proven than it being bad for PCOS anyway.

I don't want you doing anything with diet till bubs is 6 months old. It's GREAT to do things like switch to whole grains, eat more fruit and veg of course, but in terms of cutting cals and stuff, hold off for now.

And huge congrats on your new little guy!! So happy for you!!!!

Did we do Clomid or Femara this last time through??

[Shenanigans]

Thank you! We are so in love with him and i just stare at him all the time. Feeling so fortunate but just cant kick the longing for a girl, as well. That does make sense about coffee. I also did cheat some i think with the diet last time because i found it so hard to stick with so long. We also had at least 2 but maybe 3 tries in the fertile window as i was anxious to get pregnant quicker. I will definitely do e4d for the next attempt. I am just overall trying to make much healthier choices and cutting out the majority or sugar and anything not whole grain. Incorporating more veggies and hopefully the weight will slowly come off. I did use femara last time. Do you think clomid is better? Does breastfeeding sway pink also?

[atomic sagebrush]

good, that's what I want you to do.

No both Clomid and Femara have been good. Femara I think better since it doesn't have all the side effects that Clomid does.

Breastfeeding does sway pink. You aren't going to want to take the meds without the input of your doc though if you're breastfeeidng.

[Hoping4aBoy]

Hi atomic! I would love some help finding the blue sways that work with PCOS! I've been looking around, but keep getting error messages on a lot of pages so I'm not finding much

[atomic sagebrush]

I'm sorry, I'm not following your question? Blue sways that work with PCOS?

[Eggcellent]

Pretty sure untreated PCOS by condition sways blue, unless you're on clomid & metformin

[atomic sagebrush]

Pretty sure untreated PCOS by condition sways blue, unless you're on clomid & metformin

Yes that's what the data seems to indicate. But many people who have their PCOS under control by diet, exercise, herbs, or medicines can still have girls and so they have some confusion when it comes time to sway blue, because they think "oh I have girls because of PCOS" but the reality is much more complicated than that!

[Jasiahsmommy]

Hi Atomic,
When swaying pink with PCOS, is it ok to skip breakfast? Or is that bad for PCOS? Thank you

[atomic sagebrush]

Still skip breakfast. While older info on PCOS pushes breakfast as a way to keep blood sugar "stable" we are coming to realize that spending part of the day without food coming in improves insulin response overall which is beneficial for PCOS (and your sway)

[atomic sagebrush]

Just read a cool study that appears to indicate cooling and then reheating pasta will change the nature of the pasta in such a way that it will have much less dramatic an effect on blood sugar levels. So if you've got PCOS and have been avoiding pasta (because honestly that whole grain pasta is YUK) try cooking it in advance, letting it cool overnight, and then reheating it for less negative effect on blood sugar levels.

Also, slightly green bananas are better for blood sugar than fully ripe ones.

https://www.express.co.uk/life-style/health/1021912/type-2-diabetes-diet-pasta-trick-control-blood-sugar

[ruupau]

So no coffee for pcos, was taking coffee for about 3 weeks flavor cinnamon and hazel should I stop taking it, so Atomic its strictly no coffee?

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[atomic sagebrush]

So no coffee for pcos, was taking coffee for about 3 weeks flavor cinnamon and hazel should I stop taking it, so Atomic its strictly no coffee?

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As long as you're on a PCOS-friendly sway diet you can have coffee. Please continue coffee.

[ruupau]

Thanks a lot

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[lovemyboy01]

Hey guys, I'm finding my way around the PCOS LE diet. I notice that I need sweet treat after dinner to keep me sane. What if I keep 200 kcal for that and stick to the healthy stuff? (I'll stay within the margins ofc)

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[atomic sagebrush]

Yes as long as you're keeping everything within limits, most people can tolerate a small amount of sugar.

[lovemyboy01]

Yes as long as you're keeping everything within limits, most people can tolerate a small amount of sugar.Thanks Atomic :), im in the PCOS le diet section because I have to loose a good amount of weight. Should I make changes when I reach a healthy BMI?

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[atomic sagebrush]

No I WANT you guys on the alternate diet when you've got a lot of weight to spare, even after you reach a normal BMI. You may have that extra weight because your body is less good at regulating blood sugar and so it will help your sway, your egg quality, and your ability to keep the weight off to stick with this type of diet even after you've gotten to where you want to be weightwise.

[lovemyboy01]

No I WANT you guys on the alternate diet when you've got a lot of weight to spare, even after you reach a normal BMI. You may have that extra weight because your body is less good at regulating blood sugar and so it will help your sway, your egg quality, and your ability to keep the weight off to stick with this type of diet even after you've gotten to where you want to be weightwise.Thank you so much atomic! This makes so much sense now. Let's do it!

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[jleighxo]

Didn’t realize it was at the end of that thread.. found it! ThNks!

[atomic sagebrush]

REMINDER - the PCOS Pink Diet and atomic fertility diet are meant to be SUGAR FREE. If you are doing these diets and are eating sugar more than just as the occasional cheat when you're dying for some (meaning, several times a day or week) you are not doing the diet correctly and are not going to get the superior results achieved by those who avoided sugar.

Quite a few of our opposites this last year were in people who ate lots of sugar when they had PCOS or had 30+ lbs to spare against my recommendation. Most of them simply didn't understand it was an important recommendation and assumed I was being overzealous about this and/or thought I was trying to get them to lose more weight. Weight loss is NOT why sugar is avoided on these diets. It is because the people I recommend to be on these types of diets have poor insulin response so their blood sugar stays Avoiding sugar with PCOS is BY FAR more important than weight loss so if you're justifying eating sugar because you're losing weight anyway, please stop eating a bunch of sugar.

YOU ARE HURTING YOUR SWAY BADLY if you eat sugar when you have PCOS or have a fair bit of weight to spare. For best results stick with little to no sugar till your BMI drops to 21 and then add it in in reasonable amounts as a braking mechanism on weight loss, ONLY if you need it, and ONLY if you don't have moderate to severe PCOS even when your BMI is on the low side.

[vicz2001]

Might be a silly question but what is HT?

[atomic sagebrush]

HT is "high tech" meaning using methods of invitro fertilization (IVF) with Pre-implantation genetic diagnosis (PGD) to select a certain gender embryo for transfer into the uterus.

There are other methods of HT but only IVF/PGD actually works.

[lauradeanna]

Im not sure why u sent me a link to this. My pregnancy does rely on a fertility clinic tho. We must do IUI sperm implantation to become pregnate.

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[atomic sagebrush]

Because you have high testosterone. High testosterone is a sign that you need to be on this type of diet to sway pink. It will also help your chances of getting pregnant overall because high testosterone can mean you have bad egg quality.

[lauradeanna]

I cannot do absolutely no sugar!!! Help!!! I will only ingest sugars such as sugars in yogurt & yogurt in activia probiotic "shot"& little nutella.
I will drink H2O and i will consume no drink sugars, as i will only drink crystal lite sometimes (maybe1glass/week)

.im a cake queen: so this is a huge step for me.

I will do this until February 12ish...will that be long enough?

Will i still be able to make my girl connsuming this little bite of healthy sugar and doing 1hour of ellipitical daily???
And taking centrum prenatal vitamin.
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[atomic sagebrush]

Sugars as added in ingredients is fine and allowed. That is not what I am talking about. I am talking about people who eat sway diets where they eat things like gummy worms and marshmallows and pop tarts. Sugar in yogurt is ok and always has been.

A small amount of Nutella now and then for a craving is ok.

12 weeks or more on diet has gotten best results for us. But anything more than 8 weeks got pretty good results too.

I recommend weaning off prenatals for pink. If you can't do that, then reduce to 3x a week.

You can always get a girl no matter what. Even if you were eating a straight blue diet you could get a girl. I am just trying to get people optimal results. If some of the things don't work for you, it's always your choice not to do them. :)

[lauradeanna]

Thankyou, Atomic

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[lauradeanna]

Isnt honey good for swaying girl. Can i have honey on my brown bread with nutella?

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[atomic sagebrush]

There are no magic foods that are good for boys or good for girls really. It is the overall nutrient content of your diet that matters and not a magic food (eating OR avoiding it)

Since you have high testosterone, you should avoid sugar. Honey has a lot of kinds of sugar - fructose, sucrose, and glucose among others and you should eat it very sparingly (as in, treat it like a once in a while treat like the Nutella) Better yet avoid it all together, but I understand if you can't completely cut out sweets. Just try to keep them minimal.

[lauradeanna]

Is special K Fruit & yogurt ok as replacement? Or cereal is boy making?
Lastly, is lemon juice in my water okay or Crystal Lite is better?
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[lauradeanna]

Me again haha :)
Cashews & sesame seeds are good, right?

This recipe is delicious, but i need Atomics stamp of approval:

Turkey Chili:

Onion 1

2.5 tsp cumin

1.5 tzp oregano

4 tbsp chili powder

3 turkey packages

Tomatoes can

Lentiles 3 can

Corn

5 peperz

Broccoli

Spinach

Sesame seeds (little bag)

1bag cashews





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[atomic sagebrush]

Cereal is believed to sway blue NOT because it's a magic food but because it's highly fortified with nutrients. We try to avoid fortified foods for pink sways.

Some people believe lemon in water is "alkalinizing" and would sway blue. I personally think it's fine but most people would prefer to avoid anything that's ever been said to sway blue.

[atomic sagebrush]

Sesame seeds and cashews are allowed within the limits of the diet but are not a magic girl making food.

The recipe would depend on how much you ate. The recipe itself is fine but you would have to eat a certain amount to stay within the limits of calories, protein, and fat.

[lauradeanna]

Ok, Atomic. Gone. Thank you! But Crystal Light Blueberry-Razz/StrawberryOrangeBanana singles are good sometimes and sometimes just plain water and sometimes orange juice?

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[lauradeanna]

What is a magic, girl makin food :) ??? Anything I gotta ingest?

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[lauradeanna]

What's the limits? How much carb/protein/fat sould i be consuming? Where did u write about this?
Should i just buy"Babydust Method"? But I'm doing an IUI so diet is the only aspect I can alter. So, I'm not sure if it would be beneficial?

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[atomic sagebrush]

What's the limits? How much carb/protein/fat sould i be consuming? Where did u write about this?
Should i just buy"Babydust Method"? But I'm doing an IUI so diet is the only aspect I can alter. So, I'm not sure if it would be beneficial?

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Please do not buy Babydust Method. It doesn't work, their page is loaded with tons of opposites, worst of all people are trying for years and not conceiving, and I will happily help you for free. Babydust cannot be done with IUI and you need to do diet no matter what you do or you won't have your best chance of a girl. You'd just be wasting your money for bad information that won't help you conceive.

I have written about the diet in lots of places including first page of the thread you're commenting on, which is the best place for you to look since you should be on the diet I describe in this thread. But just to make it easier I'll rewrite the limits right here.

You need to be on the following limits due to your high testosterone:

1500-1800 cals a day (a few people eat lower cals than this, a larger minority eat more like 1800-2000, but most eat 1500-1800)

50-60 g protein and fat

Do not count the protein and fat in fruit and veg, and low carb veg (the ones that are not sweet and starchy, you count nothing, not even calories. Low carb vegetables are free and unlimited.)

Whole grains only, no white refined grains (we make an exception for pasta if you really can't stand whole grain pasta)

Full fat dairy only, NO skim or part skim dairy (skim dairy is terrible for blood sugar and testosterone)

And as we already talked about, cut back sugar as much as you can.

[atomic sagebrush]

Oh and you don't need to count carbs. If you're keeping cals, protein, and fat in the range and not eating sugar and white carbs and skim dairy, the carbs take care of themselves with no need to count them at all.

[atomic sagebrush]

Ok, Atomic. Gone. Thank you! But Crystal Light Blueberry-Razz singles are good sometimes and sometimes just plain water and sometimes orange juice?

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Yes, Crystal Light is fine as is water. Most people choose to give up juice because it's so nutrient dense and isn't necessary. (and anyone on the alternate diet like you are SHOULD give up juice because it's highly sugary)

[atomic sagebrush]

What is a magic, girl makin food :) ??? Anything I gotta ingest?

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There are no magic foods that make you have girls or boys. They just don't exist. It is the overall nutrient content of your diet that matters and not magic foods.

[lauradeanna]

Thank you! Good to eat oranges and pinapple?

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[atomic sagebrush]

Pieces of whole fresh fruit are allowed because they're not so highly concentrated like juices are (a glass of juice is all the sugar in several pieces of fruit) and additionally the fiber in whole fruit slows down rises and falls in blood sugar.

[lauradeanna]

Okay, Atomic. Thank you But I've been eating an orange/day since I've switched my diet b/c I used to eat an apple/day=I got 2 boys by doing that. So, now im tryin something that i dont typically go for (since it seems that im wired to like "boy-makin" foods. So, i thought i dont love oranges and oj so maybe those are the girl making things and i found stuff on the internet that oranges are girl-making

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[atomic sagebrush]

There are no boy making foods. That is not a thing just like there are no girl making foods. It is the overall nutrient content of your diet, and also that you have a history of higher than average testosterone and that means your blood sugar is also high.

Going from eating an apple to eating an orange will not make you have a girl. Those two things are roughly the same amount of calories, protein, and fat. They both have various micronutrients in them. They are fine to eat as a part of your overall sway diet. Both. Either. They are different from juice because they are not highly concentrated and they have fiber in them, which helps with your blood sugar.

You can eat an orange every day. You can eat an apple every day. You can eat both an orange and an apple every day!

I PROMISE you orange juice does not sway pink. Personally I drank tons of orange juice with a couple of my boys. Magic foods don't work. What's more it is a bad idea for you personally because it's very sugary (which will further raise your testosterone). It is also loaded with way more Vitamin C than just an orange or apple itself.

If you like oranges, you can eat them within the limits of the day. If you like apples, you can eat them in the limits of the day. It is the limits of the day that matter. For apples and oranges you'd track only calories, not protein or fat.

There are tons of people selling nonsense like magic foods online. This site is based on science and the science indicates that you cannot alter your baby's gender eating magic foods.

[lauradeanna]

So should i stop my chewable Vit C tablet?

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[lauradeanna]

[emoji3590]

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[atomic sagebrush]

I would stop it, yes. But if you are a big believer in pH, I know some people take it thinking it helps with pH. Your choice.

[lauradeanna]

So, the only pill i'll take is CaMg supp? Anything else, Atomic?

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[lauradeanna]

So, u dont think pH matters? Isnt high VitaminC good if you want a girl?

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[lauradeanna]

Sorry, one last question before bed:
I know, i know: stay away fr sugar :)
But, would u choose a little glass of chocolate milk or orange juice ?

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[atomic sagebrush]

So, the only pill i'll take is CaMg supp? Anything else, Atomic?

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I can't specifically make recommendations to people without a sway plan since I don't know your full medical history but most people take folic acid or folate (this doesn't sway, just is good for a healthy pregnancy) and a fiber supplement with any meals containing fat (if you're not eating fat with your meal you can skip the fiber)

Since you have high testosterone we may want to add in a supplement called myoinositol, but I need more info first...what is your BMI? Are you on any other medication (including stuff that is NOT for swaying)? Any health issues?

[atomic sagebrush]

So, u dont think pH matters? Isnt high VitaminC good if you want a girl?

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Here's my essay in which I outlay the case against pH and swaying. https://www.genderdreaming.com/forum/gender-swaying-general-discussion/11684-ph-pickle.html Whether you believe in vaginal pH for swaying or not, the truth is there's NO WAY that supplements you take or foods you eat affect the pH of your body. If your pH goes out of a very small range, you will die. All those people who claim your body is 'acidic' or 'alkaline' based on your diet or on supplements are not being truthful about that.

The best study ever done on maternal preconception diet and gender conceived, in fact the ONLY study ever done in someone who wasn't selling a gender swaying diet they were trying to prove correct, found that all nutrients across the boards were associated with more boys conceived. Even things like Vitamin C and cal-mag. So while I do allow people to take those three things if they really believe in them, I don't personally think they sway pink and probably sway blue.

I got my 3rd and 4th boy taking Vit. C and cal-mag and gave them up to get my girl. But it's your sway, your way, you can decide what you want to use, but just that I don't happen to recommend them.

[lauradeanna]

Ok-gone. Ill take no pills.

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[atomic sagebrush]

Sorry, one last question before bed:
I know, i know: stay away fr sugar :)
But, would u choose a little glass of chocolate milk or orange juice ?

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Whichever you're in the mood for within the limits. If you're wanting milk, have milk, if you want orange juice, have that instead. The key to sticking to the diet is giving yourself the flexibility to have what you are craving rather than eating the same thing over and over again.

[lauradeanna]

But is doing this til February11ish long enough?

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[atomic sagebrush]

While we get best results with 12 weeks or more on diet we have good results with anything longer than 8 weeks. Plus, you may not even get pregnant that first month anyway.

[lauradeanna]

Thank you, Atomic! You're the best!

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[lauradeanna]

You know I always have an end of day question for you. Well today's no different: what were your major differences when you were conceiving/ carring your girl vs your boys? What did you eat different?

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[lauradeanna]

I can't specifically make recommendations to people without a sway plan since I don't know your full medical history but most people take folic acid or folate (this doesn't sway, just is good for a healthy pregnancy) and a fiber supplement with any meals containing fat (if you're not eating fat with your meal you can skip the fiber)

Since you have high testosterone we may want to add in a supplement called myoinositol, but I need more info first...what is your BMI? Are you on any other medication (including stuff that is NOT for swaying)? Any health issues?Im 5foot 3.5" and 111lbs now. I actually went below 118lbs on this new diet. Up until September 2020: i loved eating burgers and desserts, and anything on the "boy diet"always staying at 118lbs...im not on any medication, but ill def start folic acid. My husband watches our boys so i can do at least 1hour of elliptical

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[lauradeanna]

I dont have PCOS. U said i had to be in this thread b/c i had elevated testosterone.

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[lauradeanna]

No health issues

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[atomic sagebrush]

You know I always have an end of day question for you. Well today's no different: what were your major differences when you were conceiving/ carring your girl vs your boys? What did you eat different?

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How I got my boys is here: https://www.genderdreaming.com/forum/trying-to-conceive-a-boy/1890-how-we-got-our-boys-2.html

How I got my daughter is here: https://www.genderdreaming.com/forum/gender-confirmed-girl-sway-results-details-listed-by-member/9388-atomics-stealth-sway-updated-july-20-a.html

I strongly suggest you follow the type of diet as laid out in the first page of this thread we're in, though. I don't have PCOS or high testosterone and so the types of diet that I followed would not be right for you.

[atomic sagebrush]

I dont have PCOS. U said i had to be in this thread b/c i had elevated testosterone.

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If you have high testosterone you have tendencies towards PCOS, and would get it eventually if your lifestyle supported it strongly enough.

I originally used this diet just for those with full blown PCOS but over time we have used it for more and more people. We have better results with it by far than the standard sway diet and I'd honestly use it for everyone if I could. But many people lose too much weight on this, or hate the foods and won't stick to the diet.

Please use the type of sway diet in the first page of this thread. That will be your best chance.

[atomic sagebrush]

Im 5foot 3.5" and 111lbs now. I actually went below 118lbs on this new diet. Up until September 2020: i loved eating burgers and desserts, and anything on the "boy diet"always staying at 118lbs...im not on any medication, but ill def start folic acid. My husband watches our boys so i can do at least 1hour of elliptical

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Ok. You're below my cutoff for not losing any more weight so please try to hold steady where you are. I won't suggest myoinositol for you due to your low weight.

[lauradeanna]

I dont eat breakfast (i know breakfast is bad) but i do have a big lunch at 11:30or noon, that's okay. Right?

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[atomic sagebrush]

Yes however you need to arrange your meals. That's what most people do.

[lauradeanna]

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[atomic sagebrush]

Did you have a question?

[lauradeanna]

No, my question was answered by u in another thread. Thank you

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[lauradeanna]

Im only going to take folate

And stay away fr cashews, sesame seeds and lentils? What should i use for protein in my chili? 'I'm confused: I thought those we're good for ttc girl?

Please reply fast. Im en route to grocery tonight

Thankyou, oh great Atomic:)

[lauradeanna]

What about this site?

https://www.gender-swaying.com/recipes
Lastly, should i drink milk? I really dont like, but if it gets me a girl, it's worth it

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[atomic sagebrush]

Im only going to take folate

And stay away fr cashews, sesame seeds and lentils? What should i use for protein in my chili? 'I'm confused: I thought those we're good for ttc girl?

Please reply fast. Im en route to grocery tonight

Thankyou, oh great Atomic:)

Sorry, I only just now saw this. We had our national holiday so I took Friday off, and worked very early on Thursday.

You can have those things in the limits of the diet. They are all allowed within the limits. Any warnings from me you read about any foods are based on the people who refuse to do limits and only eat magic foods.

All foods are allowed on LE Diet. On the LE PCOS diet there are some limitations (like skim dairy, white refined grains, and sugar) but you can have nuts, seeds, legumes.

[atomic sagebrush]

What about this site?

https://www.gender-swaying.com/recipes
Lastly, should i drink milk? I really dont like, but if it gets me a girl, it's worth it

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That site promotes the mineral diet and not the Low Everything Diet. I'm sure you can find some good recipes there (though it didn't look like they had a whole lot) but it won't be in line with the LE Diet, nor is it compatible with the PCOS-type of alternate diet you need to follow because of your high testosterone. For instance, they used lowfat dairy, which is terrible for anyone with high testosterone. Full fat dairy ONLY for you.

Now, as for drinking milk, NO, you do NOT need to drink milk. There is nothing magically boy producing about milk. The claims of the mineral diets are based on animals that do not even reproduce in the same way people do. The best study ever done on maternal preconception diet and gender conceived found that women who had the most boys had higher intake of ALL nutrients than those who conceived girls (and dairy is LOADED with nutrients) Most of us on here, myself very much included, got BOYS doing those mineral diets. I got my girl with the lowest dairy intake for myself and my husband we'd ever had. So while you can have some dairy foods within the limits of the diet (as long as they're full fat) you shouldn't force yourself to drink milk. The science just isn't there in support of the notion that milk sways pink, and in fact points the opposite direction...since 75% of people on Earth are lactose intolerant, and most cultures don't even have dairy foods, it's IMPOSSIBLE that drinking a massive amount of milk is in any way a prerequisite for having a daughter.

[lauradeanna]

Thank you[emoji3590]

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[lauradeanna]

Hello! Is it reallya good idea to eat tomatoes? U did eat them before u conceived ur daughter? What should i use in my chilli besides tomatoes?

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[atomic sagebrush]

Try to keep in mind there are no magic foods. It's the overall nutrient content of your diet that matters and not specific foods. So you can have tomatoes (there is NO NEED to drop tomatoes, they don't sway blue) within the limits of the day. We usually treat fresh tomatoes like low carb veg (free and unlimited, no need to count them - though if you eat crates a day LOL you might wish to count them) and cooked tomatoes (including salsa or similar preparations with no added fat/protein to them) like high carb veg and count only cals, no protein and fat. If you're having something like spaghetti sauce that has added ingredients like fat in it, you count ALL of that (fat, protein, and calories)

I absolutely ate tomatoes when I got my daughter. I limited them and got my 4th boy, then after seeing several people get girls while still eating tomatoes, I realized that avoiding tomatoes couldn't possibly be doing anything. I ate plenty of both tomatoes and potatoes, but I also followed an LE-type of diet, and got my daughter.

Please just use tomatoes in chili. I can't imagine chili without tomatoes in it being any good at all. They simply can't sway on their own, it makes no biological sense, and cultures that eat lots of tomatoes still have plenty of girls.

[lauradeanna]

Thank you

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[lauradeanna]

Is coffee a nono? I haven't had any for yrs (waaay before my boys), but i could use a wakeup today?
Also, should i swap cauliflower, cabbage or green beans for broccoli?

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[lauradeanna]

Metamucil's okay, right?

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[atomic sagebrush]

Is coffee a nono? I haven't had any for yrs (waaay before my boys), but i could use a wakeup today?
Also, should i swap cauliflower, cabbage or green beans for broccoli?

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There are no magic foods that sway. You can have cauliflower or broccoli. Have whatever you like within the limits. It doesn't matter at all. All those vegetables are free and unlimited, you can have as much as you want, no need to count them.

Coffee is not only allowed but sways pink for us. Most of us have 1-3 cups of coffee daily for a part of our sways. I got my girl drinking coffee after getting all four boys with tea.

[atomic sagebrush]

Metamucil's okay, right?

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Yes!

[lauradeanna]

There are no magic foods that sway. You can have cauliflower or broccoli. Have whatever you like within the limits. It doesn't matter at all. All those vegetables are free and unlimited, you can have as much as you want, no need to count them.

Coffee is not only allowed but sways pink for us. Most of us have 1-3 cups of coffee daily for a part of our sways. I got my girl drinking coffee after getting all four boys with tea.What about instant Nescafe Cappuccino? Or just nescafe instant gold expresso, or just instant coffee?

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[lauradeanna]

Thank you, Atomic, that knows everything[emoji3590]
Instant's allowed?

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[atomic sagebrush]

What about instant Nescafe Cappuccino? Or just nescafe instant gold expresso, or just instant coffee?

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Remember, due to your high testosterone we want you to limit sugar so if any of those have sugar in them, you might want to skip those.

[atomic sagebrush]

Thank you, Atomic, that knows everything[emoji3590]
Instant's allowed?

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Instant coffee is fine! Just be sure it doesn't have sugar or any vitamins added (some coffee drinks have added vitamins)

[lauradeanna]

Remember, due to your high testosterone we want you to limit sugar so if any of those have sugar in them, you might want to skip those.Ok, just reg coffee instant or actually i think im getting an early Christmas gift: Keurig machine[emoji319][emoji16][emoji3590]Is McCafe Premium Roast keurig k cups ok?
Just black or with creme or is 3% reg drinking milk better?
What did u drink at the time?
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[lauradeanna]

I got 3:Nescafe instants
1.Gold origins:sumatra
2.Double filter, rich
3.Rich Hazelnut (this one has an artificial sweetener: acesulfame-potassium) only 2calories/whole mug

All okay? With a drop of 3% drinking milk. Or black best?

Thank you[emoji3590]

[lauradeanna]

Is ir ok to have a cup of coffee around now ~10:40am? Nothing else?

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[atomic sagebrush]

As long as they have no added sugar they're fine. artificial sweetener is ok.
I drank regular old cheap coffee with whole milk. You can use cream, though. The only thing you need to do is avoid skim dairy and any of the carby milk replacers like rice milk.

[lauradeanna]

Awesome. Thank you, as always[emoji3590]

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[lauradeanna]

Is with or without milk better? I like both

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[lauradeanna]

Can u send me the link to Le Diet? Is Vegetable Stock better than tomatoes? More vegetables is better than more turkey? Ie: cabbage, beans peas broccoli, lentils, all colored peppers.,and cauliflower, right?

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[lauradeanna]

But ill eat less if i can have more meat than vegtables so isnt eating the least amt of food best? So, i should stick to more meat, if in the end-i eat less food, right?
Sorry, i basically just live on this site :)l. . Goodnight Atomic[emoji3590]

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[atomic sagebrush]

Is with or without milk better? I like both

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Your preference! Whatever will work better for you. Your level of happiness and comfort is a big part of being able to stick to the diet.

[atomic sagebrush]

Can u send me the link to Le Diet? Is Vegetable Stock better than tomatoes? More vegetables is better than more turkey? Ie: cabbage, beans peas broccoli, lentils, all colored peppers.,and cauliflower, right?

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You are IN the thread with the form of LE Diet I want you to follow already. Here's a link to the first page and you'll see a couple of options for the diet a few posts from the top of this. But this link is the exact thread we are already chatting in.
https://www.genderdreaming.com/forum/gender-swaying-general-discussion/9052-swaying-under-special-circumstances-part-3-pcos.html

if you want, I can give you the link to the standard LE Diet, but I do not want you on that type of sway diet because you have high testosterone. Your best chance will be, as we discussed, 1500-1800 cals, 50-60 g protein and fat, whole grains only, no sugar, full fat dairy only no skim. That's the type of diet I want you on.

If at all possible, you need to get out of the "eat this, not that" type of diet mentality. There are no magic foods. You can have vegetable stock. You can have tomatoes. Vegetables are not better or worse than turkey, they can both be a part of your diet within the limits. Some people keep eating turkey to get a bit of protein, others don't.

Low carb veg (cabbage, broccoli, peppers, cauliflower, raw tomatoes) are free and unlimited, no need to count them.

Higher carb veg (potatoes, cooked tomatoes, yams/sweet potato, beetroot) and fruit you count calories only, no fat or protein.

But things like peas, beans, and lentils have a lot of protein. So you do count protein for those, and calories, but no fat (because they really don't have any on their own).

[atomic sagebrush]

But ill eat less if i can have more meat than vegtables so isnt eating the least amt of food best? So, i should stick to more meat, if in the end-i eat less food, right?
Sorry, i basically just live on this site :)l. . Goodnight Atomic[emoji3590]

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No. Eating "the least amount of food" is not better. Firstly because turkey is more nutrient dense than vegetables. You would have to eat a MOUNTAIN of vegetables before getting the amount of nutrients in a turkey dinner, for example. It's like weighing feathers and lead - a pound of lead will take up less space than a pound of feathers, but you are still going to be having "a pound" of something. So you can't think to yourself "I ate a turkey rather than a mountain of broccoli, therefore I ate less food" because that simply isn't the case at all. It's nutrients that matter, not the bulk of food you ate.

Secondly and more important, the Low Everything Diet is meant to be a safe and healthy pre-pregnancy diet. It is NOT a starvation diet. The goal of this diet is not to eat as small an amount as you can stand. You are eating a normal diet, to enable yourself to get and stay pregnant with a healthy baby, but it's just the lower end of normal. That will help you be more likely to have a girl.

[lauradeanna]

Thank you But will doing this be long enough December4 -February12isk ?
[emoji3590]
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[atomic sagebrush]

We've had ok results from 6 weeks, better results with 8, even better with 10 weeks, and anything past 12 weeks has gotten great results. I can't ever tell anyone if what they did was enough, I can just report on what has worked for most people most of the time.

[lauradeanna]

Okay, ill try IUI in February, and if that doesnt work: March next year

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[lauradeanna]

Smoked paprika, cayenne pepp and cilantro spices are ok, right. And sugAr snap peas and spring onion okay, right?
Sorry, im cooking and i want everything right.
And, 2tbsp coco powder and 1 cup coffee in the recipe okay?

And only 1pkg of ground turkey (not3 :)
4cans of lentils r okay, right?

My new name should be LauraSoooManyQuestions not lauradeanna :)
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[lauradeanna]

I just read your swaying success and i have to ask, since im athlethic and 19ish BMI with high test... isnt it ok for me to eat BigFoot candy sometimes and skim milk and eat low carb to sway pink?(bc I've always had whole milk, diet-nothing and I've had boys since they favor that high nutrient dense diet)

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[atomic sagebrush]

Yes, all those things are fine! No magic foods

[atomic sagebrush]

I just read your swaying success and i have to ask, since im athlethic and 19ish BMI with high test... isnt it ok for me to eat BigFoot candy sometimes and skim milk and eat low carb to sway pink?(bc I've always had whole milk, diet-nothing and I've had boys since they favor that high nutrient dense diet)

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No, it is not ok because of your high testosterone. I know it seems counterintuitive but skim milk is the DEVIL for blood sugar and blood sugar raises testosterone. Whole milk only, just within the limits of the day. (We have best results with this type of diet including whole milk!!)

No sugar either because high blood sugar raises testosterone.

[lauradeanna]

No, it is not ok because of your high testosterone. I know it seems counterintuitive but skim milk is the DEVIL for blood sugar and blood sugar raises testosterone. Whole milk only, just within the limits of the day. (We have best results with this type of diet including whole milk!!)

No sugar either because high blood sugar raises testosterone.So, why shouldnt i switch to skim & diet stuff this time since in the past, its given me boys. Maybe diet stuff and skim is the answer. Whole etc has always given me boys. I know people with high test and theyve had girls...


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[atomic sagebrush]

Because you got boys in the past for some other reason (or possibly because you were having a LOT of dairy, rather than staying in the limits. Portion size matters too.)

All you're going to do if you switch to skim is make your blood sugar and testosterone rise, which will make you more likely to have another boy.

People with high testosterone can still have girls. It is what you do that sways, and not some number on a test. I have tons of people with high testosterone who have used this type of diet and have success. I think it's a very big mistake to have skim dairy if you have high testosterone.

[lauradeanna]

[QUOTE=atomic sagebrush;1062777]Because you got boys in the past for some other reason (or possibly because you were having a LOT of dairy, rather than staying in the limits. Portion size matters too.)

All you're going to do if you switch to skim is make your blood sugar and testosterone rise, which will make you more likely to have another boy.

People with high testosterone can still have girls. It is what you do that sways, and not some number on a test. I have tons of people with high testosterone who have used this type of diet and have success. I think it's a very big mistake to have skim dairy if you have high testosterone.[/QUOTE

So, of ive enjoyed whole milk, mega amt of desserts and fatty stuff in the past, and had boys...maybe it was bc i didnt drink coffee-3mugs/day (which is sooo great btw-should i do 1or2 spoonfulSf coffee/mug?)) and ate a lot of animal products (today: mainly veg) and didnt have things like yogurt(2/day) crystal light (3 glasze/day)& pineapple & oranges (1/day)-(past only ate apples for fresh fruit)& i drink350mL of pure cranberry jiuice/day -not fr concentrate) could it really be that simple diet change. As well as daily 1 hour and 10ish elliptical xcept Friday.(past: never worked out cause i didnt need to, i just stayed at 118lbs even if i ate McDonald's everyday ( which i did somedays)

With your repertoire, if i do this permanently could this result in me conceiving a girl in February thru IUI?

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[lauradeanna]

Im having my morning coffee (now ive upgraded to 2 spoonfuls coffee/mug) with reg cinnamon but this weekend im getting ceylon cinnamon to add to my coffee with whole milk. I know, ceylon is best and non harmful. But, ceylon cinnamon is good for girl sway, correctamondo?

I try to send a pic but it wont work :(

[atomic sagebrush]

In terms of coffee, just have more than you were when you got your boys. you don't have to have a huge amount if you didn't have any before. Just aim at having more than you did.

I can't look at JUST your diet and tell you why you had boys. And I can't give you a guarantee either. All I can tell you is what has worked for most people most of the time.
There is a LOT that goes into the reasons why we have the genders we do - not only our diet for a short time but many many things involved.

Again, magic foods don't sway, so switching from apples to oranges and pineapples really won't do anything, but as long as you're in the diet limits that's fine.

I don't recommend cinnamon for you. You're already very low in weight and cinnamon may make your blood sugar drop perilously low, and also may make weight fly off. The other kind of cinnamon is DANGEROUS in medicinal amounts, and you need to stop using it in anything more than just dietary amounts. If you must use the cinnamon (which I do not recommend for you at all and in fact think is a bad idea) then wait till you get the ceylon only.

[lauradeanna]

Okay, thank you[emoji3590]

But cinnamon does help sway pink? Maybe i can have just a sprinkle?
Im getting McCafe K Cups now![emoji319]
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[atomic sagebrush]

Don't use anything for swaying but the Ceylon cinnamon.

You can't just do anything ever said to sway pink. Some things aren't right for everyone.

If you want to use dietary amounts of cinnamon that is fine, because all foods are allowed within limits, but it won't be doing anything for swaying.

If you MUST include cinnamon (and please don't combine it with aspirin, cranberry, or any other blood thinner) then please use only 1/4 teaspoon (this is a small amount) from AF-O and then 1/8 teaspoon (this is a very very small amount) from O-AF and wean off at BFP. Ceylon cinnamon ONLY. Don't use the other kind of cinnamon in anything more than dietary amounts EVER.

I don't recommend that for you but that is how you should use it.

[lauradeanna]

Thank you. Im getting Van Houette Hazelnut Vanilla K cups too

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[lauradeanna]

Okay, i've reading a lot of stuff, and ive read mixed reviews on the addition of cashews and sesame seeds. Since, they may sway blue, id rather leave them out. What do u thiink? Do u think they sway pink or blue?

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[atomic sagebrush]

There are no magic foods. They are allowed within limits. The reason why I have them mentioned some places as "more blue friendly" is because in the mineral diet they are listed as good for PINK and so people eat tons of them. Keep in mind that portions matter, so I have to mention those things because otherwise people will eat massive amounts of them.

[lauradeanna]

Yes, but even u have a few boy/girl friendly diet items. Ive been a read-aholic on this. And ive concluded that, as uve stated before; nuts &seeds are more boy-friendly. And im going to switch to 2%milk and low fat greek yogurt.
And no more cashews and sesame seeds.
And im going to eat 1 bigfoot (their acidic)

https://www.genderdreaming.com/the-myth-of-magic-foods-and-best-to-worst-food-guide-for-swaying/


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[atomic sagebrush]

Again, that is because I cannot always make people do things my way. Some people refuse to stick in the limits and ONLY do the magic foods. They are also told by other sites to eat unlimited amounts of those things. For THOSE people, it may be best to avoid those foods because they are not sticking in the limits otherwise. But I very much vastly prefer that everyone stick in the limits and not do the magic foods approach.

THERE ARE NO MAGIC FOODS. Some foods may be better than others but that doesn't mean you cannot eat certain things or must eat certain things.

I wrote that food guide you've listed there solely to save me time and energy answering these types of questions you're asking me here in this thread. "Can I eat this? Can I eat that?" But as I stated repeatedly in that very article, there are no forbidden foods on LE Diet, you can have all foods in the limits, and it is absolutely fine for you to have some sesame seeds and some cashews.

Trust me, I know what I'm talking about. I am quite aware of everything I have written along the way and the reasons why I have written it.

I really am not too clear on why you would take my advice I wrote ages ago versus what I am writing here and now based on 10+ years of experience and outstanding results with this PCOS-type pink sway diet that I am suggesting for you.

I don't know what a bigfoot is.