folate, miscarriage, help!

[mummaofboys]

I am so sorry to hear of your losses ladies. Such a sad thing to have happen.
I have also just had a miscarriage at 8w2d (found at 10w5d) and a d&c.... I was taking a prenatal vitamin as I was unsure what folate supplement to take here in Australia. My prenatal (InNatal by BioCeuticals) contains Calcium Folinate and it says folinic acid. Is that the same as folic acid? I am unsure as to what to do now...keep taking it? Or try to find a folate supplement.

[ksmom]

Atomic - with prenatal vitamins specifically, are you advising folate only (not folic acid) for those who've had miscarriages, and if so is that what you think I should do as well (when I get BFP again)? I've been doing folate the whole time I've been swaying but the prenatals I have have folic acid in them. I've found it pretty dang near impossible to find the perfect prenatal - they all seem to have something I don't like (too much of something, too little of something, the wrong "form" of something, stuff in it I just don't want at all - like extra herbs and whatnot). For example I try to use one that has the beta carotene form of vit A b/c of the concern about getting too amounts of whatever the other synthetic form is, which a lot of them don't use.

Just curious!

I took the Thorne Research Prenatal which has folate in it. It has 3000 IU vitamin A from beta carotene and 2000 from palmitate (which is OK in pregnancy, up to 10,000 IU). There are no herbs or weird ingredients in the prenatal either. You do have to take 3 capsules a day, but I found it easy to just take one at breakfast, one at lunch, then again at dinner. IMO it's better that way then the nutrients are spread out a bit more plus it's less likely to make you nauseous taking so much in one go.

[atomic sagebrush]

Atomic - with prenatal vitamins specifically, are you advising folate only (not folic acid) for those who've had miscarriages, and if so is that what you think I should do as well (when I get BFP again)? I've been doing folate the whole time I've been swaying but the prenatals I have have folic acid in them. I've found it pretty dang near impossible to find the perfect prenatal - they all seem to have something I don't like (too much of something, too little of something, the wrong "form" of something, stuff in it I just don't want at all - like extra herbs and whatnot). For example I try to use one that has the beta carotene form of vit A b/c of the concern about getting too amounts of whatever the other synthetic form is, which a lot of them don't use.

Just curious!

Yes, I am. If you have suffered a loss(es) and have even the faintest suspicion that it might have been folic/folate related (such as, it happened right after you switched over to folate or had suddenly dropped folate levels without weaning off) OR have had more than one unexplained losses, I want you on ONLY folate and not folic acid in any form. Even things like the folic acid in bread and pasta should be limited as much as possible. It's not only that folate is better, it's that folic acid may be actively bad for some people.

I agree it's hard to find a decent prenatal, I'd LOVE to design one myself LOL if anyone would like to pay me a large sum of money to do that I know exactly what I'd put into it.

If you've had unexplained losses you may even want to skip prenatals and do nutrients taken separately if you can find one without the megadoses and weird herbs. You may have to compromise on the B Vitamins and get a B complex with somewhat higher doses and then add folate to that. But do be aware B9 is folic acid so evne a B complex needs to have folate only as well.

[atomic sagebrush]

I can see that - I come from a B/G family and my brother is 5 years older than me, we have almost nothing in common and we have never been close at all. It also seems like the dynamics in the B/G families I know versus the B/B ones are very different. I do feel like my two are always going to have a very special bond, even though their personalities are very unique!

Your family sounds fantastic, Atomic! And that little girl of yours is too adorable!!!

Awww thank you so much! My husband does get along very well with his kid sister (LOL she's 46 years old now haha but he still calls her that) but I do admit I like that brotherly thing my guys have going on.

[atomic sagebrush]

I am so sorry to hear of your losses ladies. Such a sad thing to have happen.
I have also just had a miscarriage at 8w2d (found at 10w5d) and a d&c.... I was taking a prenatal vitamin as I was unsure what folate supplement to take here in Australia. My prenatal (InNatal by BioCeuticals) contains Calcium Folinate and it says folinic acid. Is that the same as folic acid? I am unsure as to what to do now...keep taking it? Or try to find a folate supplement.

Folinic acid is better than folate, it's also a natural form. I feel better about you guys using folate because I feel that has been better researched than the folinic acid. If you can find a different one, great, if not I'd use folinic acid as a second best

[atomic sagebrush]

Atomic, could I add to this thread a question about irregular cycles. Since I can’t do the exercise this time around, is there anything else I could be doing? My cycles are never the same, so it’s a long annoying wait to try again when it doesn’t happen. Like a 30 day cycle to a 40 day cycle. We were doing E4D and will do that or one attempt again but sometimes that ends up with maybe another attempt at positive OPK (again) because I get two at different times. Should I take something to regulate my cycle? Or is that boy friendly? I can’t quite ask for Clomid I don’t think because it took 2 cycles to get pregnant this time and now they know i haven’t been waiting 6 months.

Oh whoops I think I missed this question. If you're doing every 4 days don't do the OPK. You don't need to do them. If you've gotten pregnant with e4d before. You only add in an additional attempt at positive OPK once you've tried for a few months doing straight up e4d.

Are you doing the alternate diet? http://genderdreaming.com/forum/ttc-...-sugar-issues=

[BeachBabies2]

Oh I'm so sorry BB.

Listen to me on folate/folic acid, not Google and not your doctor. I want you guys to wean. No one else thinks it is important but I do. I don't think this caused your miscarriage but I just like you to be on the safest side.

I want you on folate only from here on in. You're going to have to track down a prenatal with folate instead of folic acid. If you are one of the minority of people who can't take folic acid then you need to stay away from FA all together even in food.

I want you to take one or two (whichever you feel more comfy with, your body just pees out the excess) and then add your prenatal (folate only) into that. This may make more sense if you're only taking one of them and not both. Take higher dose all thru the entire first trimester and only once you're at 12 weeks, then gradually wean off of them to the amount in the prenatal and again, I want you on a prenatal that has only folate, no folic acid.

So I should take just one, of the 1,333 mcg folate (800 mcg Metafolin)? And then at BFP I should start doing the prenatal and the same amount of folate until 12 weeks, and then wean as in like 1 every other day for a while instead of 1 a day and then spaced out more and more until at prenatal?

How would I find out if I had that situation where I can’t handle folic acid? I haven’t had any issues before with it. Also now I’m worried because you mentioned limiting folic acid in pasta and bread and I definitely eat those things often with my swaying. Should I switch diets? You asked if I was doing an alternate diet when I asked about my cycles, and I am not. I’m doing regular LE, I did it for 16 weeks before this m/c and Lost weight. I figured I would just be gentler about it this time, more leanient. Should I switch diets? I looked at the fertility diet but it seemed similar to how I ate with my boys and I don’t see a reason that I need any of the others diets, but I’m open to your thoughts.

As far as OPKs, I did them last time we did E4D just to know what was going on, and the time I got pregnant we ended up doing it again at positive OPK because I didn’t think I could keep up the exercise and diet much longer. This time I feel similar, we will try E4D, with or without OPK but then is it better to try to first cycle post miscarriage as a tactic and do the plus one then or just do E4D for a few months then add that? I’m not being as strict or doing exercise this time so I guess I can hang on for longer with just doing E4D.

And thank you for your kind words. And the info on your family! So cute! So lovely. Boys are awesome and their relationships are amazing to see. Thank you.

That Thorne prenatal sounds good! But now I should also think about the B6 in it? I would never have known that’s related to folic acid.

[atomic sagebrush]

Yes exactly. That's just what I'd have you do.

You would have to be tested for MTHFR mutation. Some docs don't believe in it and won't do the test. It's pretty unlikely you have it but it's just any time there seems to be something with folate going on I like to err on the side of caution.

Standard LE is fine if it worked for you and you lost some weight. I generally have people switch since the alternate LE is better for egg quality but you don't have to.

I have no data about when it's best to do e4d or add the extra attempt. We just don't have the info to know, I'm sorry.

The LE Diet has enough B6 in it and you will be starting the prenatal at BFP anyway. No need for additional B6.

[BeachBabies2]

Thank you so much as alaways, Atomic. Now I’m just unsure about if I should switch diets. Maybe it would be easier to stick to and better for egg quality if I switched? To the Atomic Fertility Diet? I think that’s what you’re thinking? Is skipping breakfast still involved? I assume so. And the coffee/alcohol part too? I was going to be doing the LE in a more gentle way anyway which would involve not tracking, the allowance of small amounts of meat, eggs, and a little more protein and fat than I was allowing before, and I don’t feel like eating candy or drinking soda to add the extra calories this time so I was sort of swapping that for just allowing a little more cheese dairy meat or eggs than I did before. Before I still ate plenty of veggies, and will still do so. I switched to only vegetable oil before but now I’ll allow some olive oil back in. Things like that. I’ll eat breakfast if I really want to one day. So, I want to look over the other diets more thoroughly now. But I recall that when I was looking at the AFD it felt “too healthy”, or too similar to how I ate when I got my boys (although I’m sure I ate way more often and more amount/portion wise when I got them) so I just kind of let it go. But, I’ll read more into it, and I’d also like any thoughts you have. I know it’s kind of a personal choice now.

[atomic sagebrush]

It's better for egg quality, harder to stick to IMO. Honestly I"d probably just stick with the changes you're making first and see how it goes if you're worried since you got your boys eating like that.

Yes, you still skip breakfast and have coffee and alcohol.

Totally up to you but the alternate diets have gotten good results.