4-day BDing questions

Atomic, I was hoping you could clarify some scenarios for me in my head...

excuse the cr*ppy picture ;)

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I quite like the concept, it seems low stress, but still struggling to get past the lowering count/lowering sperm concentration thing.

Are you now thinking it's the low T levels that are causing men to have more girls and the low sperm counts just happen to be a side effect rather than the cause of it? Is LR for DH enough to emulate this?

in my head I'm thinking that overall you'd get less swimmers up there than BDing every single day even if total count per attempt is higher...

would it only be scenario 4 when you'd make another attempt closer to OV? if so - on pos OPK or the following day?

would you get OH to do ANY releasing on the days before OV? CFR on each attempt? douche/lube?

for my clomid sway, would it be better to DTD every 3 days (even if CFR every 3 days, or using a low pH douche in the morning of each attempt) so that there's less chance of missing OV (I've read that LH surges can be shorter during clomid cycles) and that way I'd also be guaranteed 1 attempt only in the fertile window?

I'm interested in the answer too, I will be starting Clomid next month and have been advised by Atomic to do the SMEP.

thanks bgt - good luck for it! did she explain why SMEP for you?

Thanks same yo you well she advised it because while on Clomid we have to get pregnant faster (within the 1st 3 months) due to how strong the medication is and can cause cancer. So she says there is no fooling around with it diet and exercise plus Clomid sways.

thank you, that is true and makes sense... are you taking the clomid for fertility reasons?

I will be since, I haven't Ov for a looooong time lol :( I lost too much weight with the strict LE & exercising

Haha I think that's very clever and I'm going to add this to the Index!!

I still think it's low sperm count/numbers at egg that sway pink regardless of how we get there. Low T can cause lower sperm count/quality, but other things can also cause lower sperm numbers as well and all of them seem to sway pink. Additionally I think there may be something happening with capacitation of Y vs. X sperm when there are more than one attempt and/or more sperm on hand - I can only guess at this but sperm are able to communicate on some level to coordinate capacitation, and this is something that seems to me that it may sway.

So I'm still thinking numbers overall. But it has to be more of a balance, I think people are doing too much to lower sperm numbers (both before and after ejaculation) and then reducing odds of conception to nil, this goes on a few months and then they start dropping sway tactics and adding attempts, and I believe this to be contributing to opposites being conceived.

Just to clarify for readers who may not have followed all this, what that graphic is showing is pretty much what I am coming round to as being a good low-stress pink sway tactic, the BD every 4 days trying for one attempt in the fertile window. One attempt has gotten far and away best success for pink and it is possible to get pg with one attempt, but not when including everything plus the kitchen sink in the sway. We are trying to decide what tactics to keep and what to leave out, for pregnancy to occur in a timely manner - that way people don't end up wasting away to nothing and stopping ovulation because they've got BFN for 6 months. Frequency has been highly stressful for people and it's not yielded the results that I would want to see to justify its inclusion in a sway so I believe it's time to play around with dropping frequency but keeping one attempt.

So then back to the question at hand, which of these scenarios might be best, obviously 2 and 3 would probably be preferable, followed by 1. RE what to do with Scenario 4, I think would be largely dependent on how long you had been on Clomid/diet - if it was your first month or two then one might wish to stick with one attempt and wait and see, and if you'd been at it for 5-6 months then you should def. have another attempt. In between times, I really think it may be better to flip a coin in that scenario, because there's really no way to know what is best and I think there's somethign to be said for pink swayers leaving things in the hands of Fate when there's really no way to know what option is best.

I personally am over frequency, I know I've said this before elswhere so apologies for repetition, but I think the frequency is a losing game (reserving the right to change my mind, of course). People aren't getting pg with it and it's causing SO many issues that the results are just not worth it. So i would leave that out. Without frequency, you actually then have more freedom where douche/lube is concerned because you know you're not going to be killing off absolutely everything. Your call to make on that, I honestly don't know. The Clomid may take a couple months to really make CM hostile so you may want to start off using a little something at the start and then drop it on month 3.

re having attempts every 3 days, I would start off with every 4 days for at least the first month just to see if it works out without it. For most people, every 4 days is going to = one attempt in fertile window (as your clever graphic shows) but every 3 days can really end up being 2 attempts. So I would stick with 4 at first and then you can always readjust it.

thank you :)
I know I won't be able to predict when I'll OV, so fingers crossed it ends up either scenario 1 or 2! but will stick to the 4 day one for a cycle or two. I'll only be doing 3 cycles of clomid MAX - thank you :)

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Originally Posted by bgtorres

Thanks same yo you well she advised it because while on Clomid we have to get pregnant faster (within the 1st 3 months) due to how strong the medication is and can cause cancer. So she says there is no fooling around with it diet and exercise plus Clomid sways.

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??? um, no, that's not why I recommend SMEP for you, it's because you are wasting away to nothing on the diet!!! Not only that, but when that happens and your ovulation has stopped from diet (which yours has), this indicates low estrogen. Low estrogen levels plus Clomid can affect your fertility negatively within a shorter time than 6 months, so anyone who wasn't ovulating due to diet should be cautious with the Clomid and try to get pg sooner rather than later.

To clarify the Clomid/cancer thing, the reason why you should try to get pg quickly whilst on Clomid is because you can only take it 6 months consecutively. Because Clomid can lower estrogen, if you take it many months in a row, it will gradually over time lower your fertility so far that you will render yourself infertile if you take it longer than 6 months.

The cancer risk I believe to be totally overblown for anyone with the exception of those people who want a lot of children and need Clomid in order to conceive. If they were to end up taking it longer than 12-18 months over the course of their lives, then and only then there may be a slight increase in cancer risks. But this DOES NOT apply to people taking it 3-6 months for swaying. I am only concerned about the minority of gals on here who need Clomid to TTC, have already taken it for several cycles to TTC previous children, and want more children - those peopel should not do sway tactics while on Clomid, because you only have 12-18 months in your whole life you can take Clomid and thus they do not have 3-6 months to play around with swaying, they need to get pg ASAP to preserve those potential Clomid cycles for future pregnancies.