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Whoops I think I missed part of this, yes, you can do pullout or have him wear a condom.Quote:
Originally Posted by Elsie
Most of us do the one attempt at positive OPK just for the sake of convenience. But you don't have to. If you ahve a regular cycle and want to do a cutoff, feel free, just be sure it's only 2-3 days as any longer than that cuts odds of conception to practically nil, esp. with using other sway tactics
I'm going to start posting links to threads that show firsthand the stuff that goes wrong when people try to do frequent BD. IT JUST DOESN"T WORK in a practical sense for the vast majority of people who try it.
Husbands cannot DTD and end up shooting dust! http://genderdreaming.com/forum/tryi...-rephresh.html
Quote:
Originally Posted by atomic sagebrush
When you say Din not BD through O, do you mean do not BD the entire fertile week, or like don't BD everyday from AF-O? We usually have sex 2-3x in the fertile window. With the last two being the day of the positive opk, and the day after. I was swaying blue, and got my daughter that way. I'm trying to sway blue again, but that's pretty much always our frequency. Should we be doing something different?
I mean do not start right after AF ends and/or don't start like a week before you expect O. Once that fertile window opens, the more the better, but what people are doing is starting BD too soon, so all the spermies die off, and then BD every day (or sometimes more than that) so by the time the egg drops, there are not many sperm left alive to fertilize the egg. All the "good batches" lived and died 7-10 days prior, and just not enough is coming out per batch to make it to the egg (it takes millions of sperm to fertilize one egg!)
What I like blue swayers to do is BD unprotected every 2-4 days and then once the fertile window opens, hit it with 2-3 additional attempts. You're doing great, but do continue with that BD every 2-4 days, or even a few days with every other day after the pos OPK attempts if he can, even after you think you Oed in case it's delayed for some reason.
bump
As of this year, 2017, 77% success rate for pink. (some of these people did other frequency patterns like e4d) Our results have only gone up since we started emphasizing the one attempt.Quote:
Originally Posted by atomic sagebrush
The stats this year are amazing!! What are the successful swayers doing that works so well??!!
In general, here is what has been getting the best results for pink (some of the successful sways this year had a mash up of different combinations of these):Quote:
Originally Posted by hopetoswaypink
LE diet 12+ weeks, cardio exercise 60+ min 4-6 days a week, one attempt via at first positive opk OR BDing E4D, fiber before fatty meals, coffee, alcohol, and some of us needed to take Clomid to conceive.
FX and GL to you!
[emoji170]8/2010 [emoji170]6/2013 [emoji170]11/2015 [emoji170]
[emoji178]Baby Girl [emoji254]EDD 9/30/2017 [emoji178]
https://lmtm.lilypie.com/kIlmm5.png
I have been doing all that for 11 weeks, just hoping it will work and at 41 I'm not too old! :fx:Quote:
Originally Posted by XXforhubby
Well here is any of the pink baby dust I may have [emoji597][emoji92][emoji178][emoji254][emoji178][emoji94]!!
[emoji170]8/2010 [emoji170]6/2013 [emoji170]11/2015 [emoji170]
[emoji178]Baby Girl [emoji254]EDD 9/30/2017 [emoji178]
https://lmtm.lilypie.com/kIlmm5.png
What great stats so far this year, well done pink swayers.
:agree: and please note - I think a BIG part of the key to our rising success rates is getting rid of the crap that ISN"T working. Up till this past year, most people were still doing a lot of the stuff that wasn't really doing any heavy lifting (such as timing, jellies, frequency, antihistamine, herbs) This ends up with people in situations where they either go on swaying and not getting pregnant so long that they panic and start doing lots of things to boost conception (and possibly swaying blue) or end up with their ovulation delayed or stopped because they lost too much weight on diet that they had to stop dieting and eat more fertility friendly foods just to get pregnant at all. Additionally, the kind of maniacal attention to detail it takes to manage all those things (that remember, aren't even helping!!) may also really undermine a pink sway and sway blue via the "control freak" factor.Quote:
Originally Posted by XXforhubby
I'm also so confused! I thought frequent release was a 'thing', or has that been debunked? I thought the frequent release swayed pink? Now to sway pink we will BD every 4 days from O and have one last attempt at positive OPK (2-3 day cut off)? Will that sway pink?
Hello,
So I have a pretty regular 28 day cycle sometimes 1 or 2 days earlier. We are trying for a girl when would be the best time to BD in my cycle? and from what i'm reading just once is best for a girl?
I already have two girls and now looking back I am pretty certain we only did BD once prior to O.
Our results have shown it doesn't seem to be working for us - but the thing is, that doesn't mean "debunked". It isn't "debunked" until an actual study has been done in random people who are not doing 50 other things to sway at the same time, with hopefully some science explaining why or why it does not work. Some people want to start off using it and that is fine, just should be among the first things to drop.Quote:
Originally Posted by rjp123456
The thing that seems to matter appears to be the one attempt. We don't know why. It's just something our results seemed to show, and then once we all started doing it, our results went up.
I do not want anyone to start OFF using e4d plus one more attempt at positive OPK or cutoff (unless they're in a super huge hurry to get pregnant). I want people to start off doing one attempt at pos OPK (with or without frequency, totaly up to you) , then go to every 4 days, and only after that point try to combine the two.
Yes just one BD in your fertile window (for most people this is O-3 thru O day, some prefer to stretch it an extra day and do only one BD at some point O-4 through O day). Outside of that you can have protected sex or in your safe time if you want to although you may want to avoid exposure to your hubby's semen as the hormones may sway slightly blue.Quote:
Originally Posted by Bridgetjones
When to BD - most of us on here are not believers in timing as we got opposites that way. If you believe in it, then you'd want to have that one attempt on O-2 or O-3. If you don't believe in it, O-1 (or day of positive OPK) has best odds of conception with the one attempt and swaying.
If we aimed for one attempt in the fertile window, at 0-2 or positive OPK, is that getting the best results? What do we do from AF to that point? BD protected every 4 days or abstain? Sorry for the questions, I feel so silly for not understanding straight away. I suppose if it was easy we wouldn't need you!
Before I launch into this explanation what you have to understand is that different groups of people use various sway tactics so I cannot totally compare them to each other.
One attempt, we know for a fact, has gotten better results than 2 or 3 attempts. For several years, we were getting 75% with one attempt, 65% with 2, and 45% with three. That I can say for sure even though that has been kind of swallowed up with more and more people doing one attempt and is no longer as glaringly obvious as it was for a while there. I can state this as a fact because we got disappointing results prior to when I realized it was working, and great results after that. It was dramatic, going from 58% to 70% and up and there it has stayed for 4 years straight.
What I cannot do is compare one attempt to e4d. That I cannot say which one is best because 2 different groups use them. People who get pg using one attempt tend to be more fertile, get pregnant more quickly (possibly with less time on diet) and may be more set for blue. Not only is e4d a much smaller sample size, but it is also done by people who have been TTC for longer, may have lower fertility or lower sperm health, possilby longer on diet, etc. I don't know which is better between the two but since I have a good feel for the one attempt being successful, I have people start off with that.
Frequency, you have to think of as being totally separate from the one attempt. People do one attempt with abstain, with FR, with regular release, or even with just ahving their hubby do whatever they want to do. We don't know which, if any of those things is better. BEcause like as I said, we aren't doing a study here. We don't know what would have happened if, for example, 1000 randomly people did abstain and 1000 did FR and 1000 did reg. release. We just don't know. All we know is that both abstain and FR got lousy results, quite a bit lower than one attempt. Plus, abstain and FR really cut odds of conception with that one attempt which can sometimes make people get into a panic where they actually will give up on things that sway (like diet and one attempt) in a mad rush to get pregnant faster. So they have definite downsides that should be taken into consideration. And husbands HATE doing them.
So do whatever YOU want to do, but take into account that neither abstain nor FR has seemed to help, and they do have downsides. You very well may want to start off having hubby just do regular release every 2-4 days (and he can do this on his own or with you, with a condom) while keeping one attempt. That is fine to do. Others may really feel they need to at leaast try a month with abstain or FR. That is ok too. The important thing is that one attempt!
^^^ Oh and I can also say that it does not matter what DAY you have your attempt on. Clever scientists have studied timing a lot and found that the whole idea doesn't work. 50-50 b and g conceived on every cycle day. So what I want you guys to do is aim at having your attempt at a point in time that is good chances of conception. O-1 and O-2 are best odds of conception, and since swaying can sometimes lower sperm health and dry up CM, I think we see better odds of conception with swaying, on O-1 (since sperm may not live as long with fewer of them, and dried up CM, I mean). O Day is actually NOT a good day to TTC because the odds of conception are low.
Long story short (too late!) if you MUST do timing, O-2 will be a good shot of conception with one attempt. O-3 is possible but i would not count on it since it will be much lower odds of conception. If you can live without timing, O-1 is a good day to attempt because with swaying, it's very likely best chance of conception with one attempt. Most of us will just do our one attempt at positive OPK not because it sways, but because it is an easy way of timing that one attempt at a point in time that is a good chance of conceiving.
Atomic, so you are seeing the exact same same success rate for pink on one attempt on 0, 0-1, and 0-2? The day makes no difference?
https://www.fertilityfriend.com/home/24dd4d
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It doesn't matter what I have seen or anyone on any sway site has seen, scientists have actually studied it and shown definitively 50-50 b and g conceived on every day of the cycle.Quote:
Originally Posted by maximbella
Our statistics and observations are just this side of crap when it comes to timing, because people DO NOT KNOW when they ovulated. Even highly trained experts using cutting edge technology could not pin down their day of ovulation any better than 1 out or 3 times using temping/charting, and 2/3 times using charting + Bilings method. We have no way to know for sure if people on this site or others have their O day right.
The only thing that matters when it comes to timing is the real live studies where scientists showed, when day of O was proven with blood tests, timing did not sway. And this has been as proven as something can be proven in science.
Here is yet another of the threads where someone tried this STUPID METHOD and it did not work out. Ttc soon - is there anything to be done anymore?
In the real world, this does not work out for many people. We are living in the real world and need to operate in real world parameters instead of fantasyland where everything goes according to plan.
PLEASE, PLEASE do not even try BD through O or to a cutoff, for ANYONE swaying pink or blue. You are undermining your sway hugely by trying this and even if you have seen other people seemingly do it, it is entirely within the realm of possibility that it will not work for you. It is also ENTIRELY in the realm of possibility that they are fudging or misremembering what actually occurred - they may have skipped days and forgot or stopped many days before they even ovulated and only the last BD even counted!! (aka one attempt in the fertile window)
And just by trying it, you have then ruined your sway for any other method that month and will often have to skip the month. It does not help your sway and in fact harms it in several ways (refer back to my explanation on the first page) whether you are swaying pink or blue!! Do not BD daily through O or to a cutoff for any swayer!
Could you show me the link where dr. Shettles Method is %100 proven not true. I can’t find it.Quote:
Originally Posted by atomic sagebrush
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https://www.genderdreaming.com/forum...le-timing.html
And I'm not sure I put this in that particular essay but last year they did a study where someone went back through all the old timing studies using modern knowhow and even using Shettles and others' own data, proved that the days when the study subjects had thought they ovulated, they hadn't. And when their errors were corrected for, even using Shettles and other old data, timing did not sway. All based on a bunch of mistakes.
Science can rarely debunk anything 100% but Shettles is as debunked as it is possible to ever debunk anything in science. We know he was wrong, we know why he was wrong, and using his own data we have proven the conclusions of his studies are wrong.
I got 3 of my 4 boys with Shettles girl timing (other boy was a sneak attack, I don't know when I got him!) and gave all that up and got my girl with Shettles blue timing.
Sorry I’m new here! By one attempt was does this mean exactly? Does hubby release any during af-o before the one attempt?
Hi and welcome! One attempt means just one attempt, unprotected, in the fertile window of O-3/4 through O Day (some people worry about O-4 counting as an attempt, others don't. I'm undecided) You only have sex ONE time and not many times.
You can then add ON something like frequent (daily) release in addition to the one attempt, but you don't have to. The one attempt is the key, nothing else has really worked, including the FR.
A couple essays that you may find helpful: https://www.genderdreaming.com/forum...off-with-O-12=
https://www.genderdreaming.com/forum...pink-and-blue=
Did you BD at all after AF for your girls or did your husband release any during that time?
who me?? I only have one girl and my husband and I did e4d without really intending to (I hadn't invented that yet, LOL)
So BD about every 4 days after AF thru O Day.
I feel a bit dumb here... So the 1 attempt, I get that's 1x unprotected sex on O-1 preferably. But are we celibate AF-O? Does frequency of DH's release matter (i.e. every 3 days vs 10 days, not a FR pattern) e4d may be 1 attempt for women's fertile period, but how is it affecting sperm production?Quote:
Originally Posted by atomic sagebrush
I get why you can't really compare 1 attempt to e4d statistically, but man that's my burning question!
And thank you for answering so many of my questions on various threads- I'm reading and learning a lot!
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I understand it's everyone's burning question, but till I strike it rich and can fund studies we can't compare the two. We'd need to do a study in people doing nothing else to sway to find out if either of them really alters the gender ratio, and if so by roughly how much. :) Till then my recommendation stands to start off at one attempt for most people and go to e4d, but as we've talked about when you've got a limited time to TTC it makes sense to start off at e4d, too.
Timing, frequency (number of times hubs releases) and number of attempts are all three different methods. You can use them together or alone. I have a good indepth explanation of all that here in this thread https://www.genderdreaming.com/forum...off-with-O-12=
having hubby release every 4 days is, on paper, said to raise sperm health, and theoretically sway blue. But I PrOMISE it is no magic bullet at all and lots and lots of people get girls both with regular release + one attempt and e4d method (or I'd not recommend it, of course) And indeed, even lots of blue swayers still get pink opposites with regular release.
While I don't yet have the data to prove it, I have a strong suspicion that frequency patterns do little for pink OR blue. I'm just not seeing how, if abstain and FR don't work, how regular release would strongly sway blue, either. I have a pretty good vibe now that if any frequency works it gets swallowed up by the things that are much more effective. If they were doing anything we'd be seeing it make huge differences now, and frequency just doesn't seem to be making huge differences.
Is this one attempt the day after O?Quote:
Originally Posted by atomic sagebrush
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Sorry what does e4d mean?
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Having unprotected sex every 4 days without any additional attempts.Quote:
Originally Posted by PadrePioidevotemyfirstson
It is something we do for pink swayers, whereas blue swayers would always have additional attempts from pos OPK through O day
I'll have to go back and look up what I was saying in context as that was 2 years ago.Quote:
Originally Posted by Abygailjo3
No one should attempt the day after ovulation. There has never been ANY confirmed pregnancy the day after ovulation. Sex the day after ovulation will yield a BFN
Quote:
Originally Posted by atomic sagebrush
Just to put that in context, we ended up with 71% overall for 2017 (we had some opposites that year after I posted that) and 68% in 2018
Our overall success rates of the site are at 69% with 540 people reporting
This is in comparison to 58% when we had more than one attempt.
do one attempt! at least to start with
It is doing just one attempt regardless of timing. No matter what day you BD in the fertile window, having one attempt is much more successful than doing other sway tactics and adding attempts.Quote:
Originally Posted by atomic sagebrush
Hi Atomic,
I understand the 1 attempt. But when you say that if DH releases every day he will eventually be ‘shooting dust’, does that mean that he shouldn’t do FR and then 1 attempt? We were planning for him to release everyday by himself for 7 days prior to our 1 attempt! Confused now!
Some of the advice in this thread is for blue swayers who want absolute max sperm count. Daily release does deplete sperm numbers. Many men can shake this off and still get a woman pregnant anyway, but it does lower odds of conception considerably. I answered more about this in light of your personal situation in your Custom Coaching Forum.Quote:
Originally Posted by Ff12345
I just had a question about this. Is it also okay to do less than 7 times? Just to be sure there will enough sperm count with the one attempt?Quote:
Originally Posted by atomic sagebrush
Yes, it's certainly ok to do that, but it doesn't count as doing the frequent release. That is fine since the frequent release doesn't work, and the one attempt does. I would LOVE to be able to convince everyone to drop abstain and FR and focus only on the one attempt since FR has not worked and cuts odds of conception with one attempt.Quote:
Originally Posted by Naj90