Oh I’m so sorry to hear that. What a shitty thing to go through. I hope one day you get what you wish for.Quote:
Originally Posted by emshe
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Oh I’m so sorry to hear that. What a shitty thing to go through. I hope one day you get what you wish for.Quote:
Originally Posted by emshe
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Emshe that sounds like such a difficult journey you've been on. You are obviously very strong to be continuing moving forward.Quote:
Originally Posted by emshe
Thanks ladies, I certainly have my moments... It is such a tough journey trying to fulfil our desire.
I think moving forward is my coping mechanism in someways Mia Melb, Im scared to stop as that in itself will be difficult too on top of the loss we already feel. I wish I could just switch it off, but I haven't gotten there & I dont know if I ever will. I swore I would, and hubby reminded me of that a couple of times, but he too seems to want to keep trying. When I mentioned Dr Molloy the other day, he instantly asked "so did you call". Shock! I cannot even imagine how we would afford it, the financial side has been huge already. But his response cemented that he is just as invested in this journey. I am on atomics fertilty diet & I feel that will be our route now but I will have a chat with this Dr and see what he has to say.
Gosh I hope they realise the value of the process being made available here & give it the go ahead. I just so wish we & everyone out there wanting a baby could have our babies!
I spoke to dr Malloys office yesterday and they will be in touch if there is any progress. For u ladies that have a phone appointment please let us know bow u go.
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Hi Ladies
I heard from Dr Bowman's rooms in fact his receptionist. He is apart of Genea in Sydney. Whilst he is supportive of couples seeking IVF with PGD for family balancing, he is unable to help.
'IVF units in Australia need to comply with National ethical guidelines for assisted conception in order to maintain their ability to practice. As a result, Dr Bowman is unable to provide treatment for you'.
NSW is legislated by the Assisted Reproductive technology act 2007.
Phone Appointment in a weeks time with Dr Molloy. I wish I had money I would be taking this to court to fight for our reproductive rights.
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I’d join you if I could. It did mention NSW specifically so possible that they are too aware of a possible loophole in other states!?Quote:
Originally Posted by netti02
Dr Molloy’s phone will be ringing hot next week[emoji6]
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They may be aware of it, I am not sure. As they are 2 different clinics they may not share info etc. But QLD doesn't have this act so FX its our saviour.Quote:
Originally Posted by emshe
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Appmnt next Tuesday with Dr Molloy. I got a text reminder [emoji16] ive been going through things in my head- what I want to discuss etc.
Is there anything you ladies think I should/need to mention?
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Ooh exciting. I would just be asking what is the process going to be for them to investigate their legal position and how long might that take? And whether in their opinion they’re going to be successful, or, whether they think Australia is going to catch up with the USA at any point in general ie all states? That’s what I’m curious about... it’s a shred of hope but a shred nonetheless - I hope you get some interesting answers and not more open ends....
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Hope he has some hopeful answers for you netti!Quote:
Originally Posted by netti02
I’m getting a bit nervous about mine on Thursday. I’m not good on the phone... it’s all a bit real too, that in a short while we may try “ourselves” again.
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Appmnt in 10 minutes [emoji50][emoji50]
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Looking forward to hearing how it goes Netti:nails:
I have so much I want to say so i hope I remember and have enough time to get it all out 🤞
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Well that didn't last long enough however, I am going to provide a written letter outlining my choice for IVF/PGD and why it should be allowed. Im hoping how I want to word it will work in favour.
He can't provide any time frame at this stage unfortunately as it's a very slow process through the legal side of things.
Im off to write this letter. The words have been on my brain for days so best to get it out.
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So they couldn’t tell you anything at all? :(
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Work your determined magic in there netti!
If writing letters going to prove beneficial for his case, I’d be happy to write one too!
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??? So have they asked/recommended you send a letter outlining why you would like ivf/pdg so they can use it as part of their legal case to be allowed to offer it?
Oh sounds like the conversation may have been a bit light/disappointing… sigh
If they need more letters to support their case, let me know, I’d happily write one too!! ;)
Not really Frankie a very slow process. Yet my letter I am writing is about to open up a whole can of worms for this council cause I think there using prejudice and with holding reproductive rights. It will cover my journey and hardships me and DH have experienced in making this dream come true, which is still just a dream atm.Quote:
Originally Posted by frankie2017
Im thinking of also sending it to the council aswell.
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Miamelb- i actually offered as I think thats our only chance in getting our point across. I believe I have some interesting points to make and im hoping they will be heard loudly. Id be happy to email when Ive finished.Quote:
Originally Posted by MiaMelb
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Emshe i think it would help at this stage. Im happy to email mine when ive finished.Quote:
Originally Posted by emshe
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LMSM yes it was very light and rushed- but im not giving up, not without a fight. I think it would benefit us in sending a letter outlining our point across.Quote:
Originally Posted by LMSM
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In my letter im covering my journey so far in hopes of having a daughter. It will cover the financial impacts but more importantly how socially this has affected me. Its turned me into a recluse and very reluctant to share any information about this pregnancy. I am also including how I will worry about my postnatal mental health considering ive already depleted my social stance due to comments etc and have limited social connections. I literally hate all family functions and haven't attended any in a while.
I also want to question the councils other decisions (which i actually can't find any information on) when single women were allowed to access IVF to start a family- were there ethical considerations then? Did this go through such a rigorous review as we are now? (I actually don't mind that women do access this, i just hope there were ethical considerations for that decision- not just automatically granted- this is the part where i feel we are being prejudiced ie our reproductive rights being withheld).
My other point is the council expects that further social change is warranted before this is approved. This is the most stupidest reasoning ive ever heard. IVF with PGD for gender is only ever really going to matter to the people who wish to do it. It also a closet topic. Once upon a time IVF was never talked about openly, was barely accepted in society and people had mixed understandings on how it actually worked. Right now this is where I see peoples views on IVF/PGD for gender. Ive read lots of comments and people actually think you do something or alter to create the desired gender. They don't understand you simply undergo IVF- embyros are made and then they're tested. I believe if people understood the process, there may be more of a social change.
My other point is no one talks openly about this in society to allow change to happen for fear of being judged, bullied, ridiculed and mocked. Many times ive been told as long as its healthy, like im not allowed to have hopes and dreams. Like im not allowed to be a little disappointed. That's why when people ask im not staying silent anymore. I don't care how they perceive me. I don't care if they judge me. I know im entitled to feel this way- no one has to agree with me but im definitely entitled to feel. Otherwise if i don't acknowledge my feelings and bury them away as i have done all these years, ill likely do something really silly. Thats why waiting for social change is absolute BS. Once this is implemented and starts to become main ****** no one will care it will just be another choice people have.
Im also trying to come up with some solutions on how to prevent people exploiting it for gender preference reasons. One way is to confirm with childrens birth certificates and with the actual births, deaths and marriages service.
So i plan to be quite detailed. Not just simply stating ive always wanted a daughter but covering quite a few topics.
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You are doing a great thing! We do suffer in silence I completely agree. My family and friends will never know of the daughter I lost recently and I feel just awful about that.Quote:
Originally Posted by netti02
A day without wondering if I’ll ever fill this heartfelt desire has not been lived in over a decade. I feel for you Netti & the impact it has had on you. Know that you’re not alone, I know I think of & wish for all the ladies & gents out there desiring...that one day will be our day.
I completely understand your questioning why others get to choose & we don’t, & I can not understand how this has to impact on anyone other than the family choosing to do this. It’s not a path taken lightly nor easily. No one is going to jump into it willy nilly.
Did he seem nice & open, I’m wanting to get fertility help from him in my consult too. Don’t want to go through my past with anyone not on board with the journey I’ve had.
Proud of you!
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I think he would be willing/open if you have other fertility issues you want to discuss and because he is an advocate for gender selection he would be the best choice. I simply want to ensure any future child i have is a girl just for my own sanity [emoji16] i did mention to him i am due with my 6th boy and he said wow that is alot of boys- yep you're telling me [emoji23]Quote:
Originally Posted by emshe
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[emoji23]Quote:
Originally Posted by netti02
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Hi all - just to let you know that I wasted over 12months trying to apply to do IVF & PGD gender selection (I have a boy with autism) in Perth between 2016-2017, Following that we conceived then miscarried & then conceived DS3. I have since been told we should have applied through sydney. Very frustrating! They really wasted my time & precious fertility!
Oh my thats unbelievable! Did/ will you try in Sydney?Quote:
Originally Posted by kc15880
Mamma to 6 boys, dreaming of pink one day
So sorry you have gone through this & to be mucked around, it’s not fair. I hope everything works out for youQuote:
Originally Posted by kc15880
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Well he was nice, told me to check in again in a few months to see how it’s going as things have stalled. He wouldn’t help me with my “now” issues without my travelling to Brisbane to see him unfortunately. I can understand that! I just don’t see it happening, but I really don’t want to go & see someone not supportive of what I’ve already tried.
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Spoke with him this morning - same as everyone else. Nice but couldn't give a timeframe on when he thinks he may have a response re legal advice. Now to determine if we want to go down HT path in US (and to find the funds) or try sway again..
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Thanks for keeping us updated ladies!
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A copy of my letter ladies. Ill illustrate in a covering letter concerns of depression, post natal depression etc that the council should consider also. Im going to email this next week. Ill also be writing additionally a follow up regarding the councils decisions etc
My first thoughts of having a family started somewhere when I was a child and in my teens. Thoughts of names I liked and where I wanted to live. How you want to build a life with a future partner, raising sons and daughters. The names I like and where I want to live changed with time, however the dream of raising sons and daughters has always remained a constant. My journey in motherhood began in 2005 when I had my first son. I was excited to be able to give my then fiancé a son, to share wonderful experiences and a bond for life. I often thought about future children and had high hopes a daughter would be able to join us at a later date as it had always been a dream of mine since I could remember. I began tertiary studies the following year after he was born and life became busy for a while. A diagnosis and some poor recommendation from a health specialist, seen us expecting our second baby in August of 2008. I remember feeling extremely anxious in the lead up to the anatomy ultrasound as me and my fiancé had only discussed having two children. I felt the pressure from society to have the ‘pigeon pair’, with many constantly asking me if we knew what we were having. We were told during the anatomy scan we were having a boy. Everything appeared well and whilst that was a relief, I remember the sadness I felt that my dream was finally over. Telling people we were expecting another boy was laced with apprehension as I felt I had to do my best to hide my disappointment in that I would never have a daughter. People would always add comments though, such as ‘next time it will be a girl’, ‘at least you can reuse all those clothes’, and while they thought they were being helpful with their comments, they didn’t realise how detrimental they actually were. Life became busier again as I finished my degree, began working and saving for our first home. The boys were getting older and growing up quickly with one getting ready for big school. We finally got married in 2012 on our 10th anniversary. At the time I was working in a large, metropolitan hospital and struggling with shift work and the kids. In October 2012 I changed jobs to a more stabilised roster and worked regular, permanent night shifts at a large residential aged care facility. This allowed that dream to flutter to the surface again and a brand new hope blossomed of that dream finally coming true. Not long after we were married, we were due in November 2013. I remember all too well the anxiety that bubbled up again and started to take hold and consume me. I started paying more attention to the family dynamics around me when I was out. I would see a family of 2 boys and a girl and hold out hope. I’d also see the mum of 3 boys and my heart would be in knots. We went to our anatomy scan holding onto this hope like a lifeline. I was already dreading the comments if we were having another boy. Not long through our scan I could see the telltale boy signs without even being told. My heart dropped. Having any more kids after this meant a bigger car, a bigger house, so this was it. I didn’t acknowledge my feelings of gender disappointment at this time. I swallowed them, for fear of being judged and ridiculed. I made sure I smiled when people commented, like it didn’t matter and I wasn’t bothered. I listened to people tell me over and over ‘as long as it’s healthy’, ‘think of all the money you will save’, ‘at least you know what to do with a boy’, ‘at least you won’t have to worry about a girl in the teenage years’, like these words were meant to offer some comfort. They didn’t realise how wrong they were. After our son was born in November, there was a questionable age difference between him and my second son. My second son was about to start school in 2014 and I started thinking how the youngest might become lonely and need a friend which fuelled the possibility that this time, it would be a girl. We found out we were due in February 2015. All the anxieties crept back and were in full force when we found out it was another boy. We faced the same comments that felt like they were on repeat and I bravely smiled through them all even though my heart was breaking. The thing that kept me strong was a little flicker of hope deep in my heart that my dream still may come true one day. That’s when an enormous amount of guilt started to weave in with the anxiety and I turned to emotional eating to comfort my heart. I talked to no one of how I felt, too ashamed, too angry, too guilty and heartbroken, I kept it all inside, even from my husband. We purchased a new car and after some consideration approached a real estate about selling as the market at the time was favourable. A few weeks before we were due, the house was on the market. We sold a week before I gave birth and purchased a new home a few weeks later. We would learn that our son had congenital hearing loss. Whilst initially shocked and in disbelief, we were determined to ensure the best for him. The comments continued, ‘will you try for a girl next’, ‘next time it will be a girl’, ‘you need to have a girl’ and ‘think of all the money and trouble you will save’. Once again people believed these words offered some form of comfort yet they couldn’t be more wrong. After settling into the new house, I started researching the internet to find some hope as I was all out. I found information suggesting different diets, positions, timing and supplements. Not 100% convinced, I also had a few psychic readings. It was during this time I found a safe place online to discuss my feelings and it was refreshing being able to talk with others about a desire for a son or daughter without ridicule and hearing the same, repetitive comments. Hope started to build again in my heart but the bigger problem was convincing my husband. Sometime during the middle of 2015, I finally broke down and told him everything. It wasn’t just another child I hoped for, but a daughter. He understood completely how I felt yet he was understandingly apprehensive. From the financial aspects and the fact our last son was born with a congenital issue were his biggest fears. He too started mentioning about the comments from others which truthfully, hadn’t ever really stopped. (I struggle to this day to understand how people can be so intrusive with questions into other people’s reproductive lives. If we want to share that information we will, without having to ask). We found out we were expecting in July 2016. Once again the anxiety peaked in full force, laced with guilt, depression and a little hope. Something about this pregnancy felt different though. I had high hopes this was it, it was finally our daughter, so much so that I even purchased some girl items. The comments continued yet smiling and acting nonchalant was getting harder and harder. At our early ultrasound, once again without being told, I could see in fact it was boy number 5. Not crying in that ultrasound room was the hardest thing. To keep smiling through the scan knowing my heart was breaking was the hardest. The guilt hit after that. The self-berating. The comfort eating. Then I waited for all the comments and as expected, they came. It wasn’t just about gender now, it was the number of children too. The comment I took the hardest during that pregnancy was ‘a son is a son till he takes him a wife, a daughter is a daughter all of her life’. I’ve never hated a saying as much in all my life. I tried to be happy after he was born. Tried to talk my ovaries into retirement. Tried to forget just how much my heart ached and longed for our daughter. Tried to convince myself anymore kids was a car upgrade- everyone else reminded us that we would need a bus. (I should have reminded them how they need filters, or lives or superglue, maybe their own business…..). The comments continued, ‘Are you pregnant?’, ‘Will you have anymore?’ or ‘Will you try for a girl’. People didn’t understand how much my husband and I were hurting. How much I was trying to process my feelings and move on. One night we had friends over. The female mentioned to her partner to ensure that ‘He doesn’t do that to her’, in reference of me having 5 boys. I had to take a breather at that moment and spend 5 minutes in the toilet crying to myself, feeling like a failure and some inadequate female because I didn’t have a daughter- surely there are worse things in this world. I found the easiest way to manage this was avoidance. Social outings abolished. Family events eradicated. The way to protect my heart was to not go out and get it trampled on at all. I begged my husband with ******s of tears coming from my eyes, just one last time. Hope crept back in from another psychic prediction, a different method to try. I didn’t tell anyone we were having another baby, not until we at least knew what we were having, protecting my heart was my priority. We got our ‘bus’, one less thing for people to mention to us. This pregnancy started to feel different, I started to feel a little hopeful. We had an early ultrasound booked at 14 weeks. It was early however I couldn’t take the anxiety any longer and gender would only be confirmed if 100% certain. I hoped with everything I would finally hear something different in that ultrasound room, finally I would be able to shut people up once and for all. After baby being a little tricky, the technician stated it was a boy. Once again the struggle to hold my emotions and remain composed during the scan was becoming too much. A few tears escaped, could be easily mistaken for tears of joy, not of loss. My breaths started coming faster and ragged for what felt like a panic attack. I looked over at my husband and could see the sadness and disappointment on his face. I cried for 2 days after that. I cried like I had lost someone. Somewhere between there and now, I’ve picked myself up, tried to take a day at a time. Tried to process my feelings, validate them as real and meaningful despite what others might think. I’ve skirted around the issue of the baby’s gender with the few that know, not confirming, just that we think it’s a boy. Unlike other times, there’s been no special social media post about our new arrival on the way. Just silence. I didn’t realise the lengths I would need to go to, to protect my own heart from people who I thought I could believe in and trust. What should be a special time in our lives is spoiled from the rude comments of others, whether it be the child’s gender or the number of children we do have. After he is born the comments will come. From all we’ve heard before including, ‘better give up now’, ‘another boy’, ‘going for a football team’, ‘People will think you’re on welfare’ and ‘better tie a knot in it now’. I’m sure there will be people still offering their ‘wisdom’ of what to try for a girl. The best part is, come April, I’ll have a lovely newborn son to cuddle and raise along with his brothers. I’ll always hold onto hope my dream will come true, for what is life without a dream, without hope. Until then, I’ll hold my head high, raise handsome, caring sons and not pay attention to the ignorance of others.
Mamma to 6 boys, dreaming of pink one day
Did anyone who submitted to the NHRMC study get an email from the NHRMC asking if they'd consent to being contacted by Flinders University and University of South Australia?
Netti, I dont know how I missed this. You lovely are amazing, you have such strength. I hope you are doing well?Quote:
Originally Posted by netti02
I wasn't aware there was a study- was this around ivf with pgd? Maybe they are looking at publishing the results.Quote:
Originally Posted by emshe
Mamma to 6 boys, dreaming of pink one day
Sorry my wording may be wrong, it was when they did the review that I submitted after reading about it on here I think it was back in 2015/16 they took submissions from the public to help with their conclusion.Quote:
Originally Posted by netti02
Now unis are asking people who did those submissions if they’d be willing participate in their ethics study of the situation.
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I’m in Australia and submitted and I got an email , so did everyone in the gs Australia fb group who submitted , hopefully that means the SA government is thinking about changing is law ? Too late for me but I hope it helps others so I’ll probably say yes :)Quote:
Originally Posted by emshe
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So happy to see you have fulfilled your dream grace03!Quote:
Originally Posted by grace03
Thanks hun ! nearly 20 weeks!Quote:
Originally Posted by emshe