New 2018 Clomid AND Femara support threads!

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Originally Posted by atomic sagebrush

Once we start moving the attempts that much closer together I don't like it because it may sway blue and it doesn't really even up odds of conception much anyway (you often end up with just one attempt in fertile window anyway) I much prefer the regular e4d attempts plus an attempt at pos OPK for better chances of conception.

I'm not necessarily advocating SMEP, it's really more of a last ditch effort. People will eventually get preggo on e4d plus one but SMEP may make it happen sooner, rather than later, that's all.

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Thank you atomic, good to know.
I feel comfy with e4d but I think an attempt is already falling on morning AFTER likely positive opk (based on last cycle- but day after positive opk ov pain & temp suggested that to be ovulation day)

So in this scenario where E4d is due on morning after positive opk Do we attempt 2xBD am & pm? Or am I better to do night of positive opk & morning after? Night of positive would be only 60 hours since last E4D attempt. In case ovulation does occur the day after positive opk?

Sorry for all the questions, not sure if it’s a bit confusing!?

Hubby also had an accident today, plant caused major chemical burns to the eyes so has been put on antibiotic & anaesethic drops as well as codeine/paracetamol. Are these girl sway ok?

Agh!!!!
I hope you have a lovely weekend atomic


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Morning after positive OPK is within the window to conceive. In that case what you would do is have attempt the night of positive OPK and then again the next day sometime. That's fine and would be e4d plus one.

Please stop worrying about the number of hours it is. Do e4d and then stick in another attempt whenever the positive OPK comes while continuing with the e4d pattern. You do not know when you ovulate in correlation to the OPK, the temp dip, or the O pains and sitting around counting the hours or doing complex math problems trying to figure out how many hours it is, is the exact type of "control freak" thinking I want you guys to avoid. Do e4d plus one more attempt at pos OPK and then stop thinking about it all together, just put it on autopilot.

It doesn't matter, hubby needs those things. I am so sorry to hear of his accident I hope he's better soon! The pain medication sways pink, we believe, and then while some sites claim antibiotics sway blue, I've never seen any evidence to that effect (and in fact some evidence otherwise) and it's unlikely that eye drops get into the system enough to make a difference even if they did sway blue.

Oh my gosh emshe I'm sorry to hear about your DH!!! Is he going to be ok?!!

LOL, atomic, I've totally done the counting hours between attempts, even trying to figure out the hours between the attempts + the number of hours for the sperm to capacitate and if there would be any sperm left from a previous attempt by the time new sperm are ready! I can see how it's very very control freaky :) :) I will say I've found trying to get that "one attempt in the fertile window" stressful at times! This last pregnancy we just did one attempt at +OPK and it worked so hopefully it will again in the future so I don't fall back in the trap of hour counting!!

emshe this is your 2nd month of Clomid right? Things could look different on your cycle this month vs last month having had the Clomid in your system now for two cycles. For example - I normally have a big delay (like, 3 or more days) between +OPK and temp rise, and this last cycle we got pregnant on I got my temp rise two mornings after the +OPK (so, way earlier than normal). I really think the Clomid caused more changes in my cycle that month, maybe b/c it was my 3rd cycle on it. My progesterone post O was also WAY way higher. So Clomid can change things.

ABC, thanks that's interesting to know that each cycle with Clomid is different. Before pregnancy I would ovulate on my own around CD 22, then on my first round of Clomid 50 mg I O'd on CD 17 and I got pregnant.

Now I'm trying again and my first attempt I only did 25 mg Clomid and O'd around CD 28, last month I did 50 mg Clomid and O'd around CD 22, and I am CD 6 now on my third round of Clomid, 50 mg this time. I'm hoping to O earlier in the cycle, but I guess it's out of my hands now.

Even beyond the control freak element of it, since we can't know when O occurs and how long sperm takes to capacitate and how long it stays alive, we can end up outwitting ourselves. For illustration lets say "Pinkerly" thinks she ovulates 42 hours after a positive OPK (based on an ultrasound of 3 years ago or temp chart or EWCM or whatever, none of which tell us anything about future cycles) and read that sperm take 4 hours to capacitate (even though that's simply the EARLIEST they capacitate) so because she doesn't want to have more than one attempt, but doesn't want to have it too early, she waits till 36 hours after the first positive OPK instead of having an attempt e4d that SHE BELIEVES may fall on O-3/O-Day. So she skips the O-3 attempt in favor of one attempt after pos OPK. But she was wrong about when she was going to ovulate, she Oes earlier than she thinks, and the O-3 attempt would actually have been perfect. Her urine was diluted and so she didn't catch the surge till the tail end, only a couple hours before ovulation. If she had done the e4d and BD on what she thought was O-3 she would have had a well timed attempt, even if she'd done the pos OPK attempt she would have been in with a decent timed attempt, but because she wanted to wait till 36 hours after pos OPK because she was worried about it and thought she knew what was going on, she actually outwits herself and misses the entire month.

The thing with e4d is that you CAN just luck your way into it. you can have all the misinformation in the world and you can still luck your way into it. So just do e4d! Don't count days, for SURE do not count hours, do e4d and leave it, and then in months when you go to e4d plus one, then do exactly that without trying to make it come out a certain way or pattern.

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Originally Posted by atomic sagebrush

Morning after positive OPK is within the window to conceive. In that case what you would do is have attempt the night of positive OPK and then again the next day sometime. That's fine and would be e4d plus one.

Please stop worrying about the number of hours it is. Do e4d and then stick in another attempt whenever the positive OPK comes while continuing with the e4d pattern. You do not know when you ovulate in correlation to the OPK, the temp dip, or the O pains and sitting around counting the hours or doing complex math problems trying to figure out how many hours it is, is the exact type of "control freak" thinking I want you guys to avoid. Do e4d plus one more attempt at pos OPK and then stop thinking about it all together, just put it on autopilot.

It doesn't matter, hubby needs those things. I am so sorry to hear of his accident I hope he's better soon! The pain medication sways pink, we believe, and then while some sites claim antibiotics sway blue, I've never seen any evidence to that effect (and in fact some evidence otherwise) and it's unlikely that eye drops get into the system enough to make a difference even if they did sway blue.

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Sounds perfect atomic! Thank you [emoji5]


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Originally Posted by ABC.2606

Oh my gosh emshe I'm sorry to hear about your DH!!! Is he going to be ok?!!

LOL, atomic, I've totally done the counting hours between attempts, even trying to figure out the hours between the attempts + the number of hours for the sperm to capacitate and if there would be any sperm left from a previous attempt by the time new sperm are ready! I can see how it's very very control freaky :) :) I will say I've found trying to get that "one attempt in the fertile window" stressful at times! This last pregnancy we just did one attempt at +OPK and it worked so hopefully it will again in the future so I don't fall back in the trap of hour counting!!

emshe this is your 2nd month of Clomid right? Things could look different on your cycle this month vs last month having had the Clomid in your system now for two cycles. For example - I normally have a big delay (like, 3 or more days) between +OPK and temp rise, and this last cycle we got pregnant on I got my temp rise two mornings after the +OPK (so, way earlier than normal). I really think the Clomid caused more changes in my cycle that month, maybe b/c it was my 3rd cycle on it. My progesterone post O was also WAY way higher. So Clomid can change things.

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He’ll be ok. Silly plant... fell over in the heavy rain we had a week ago so we were doing what we could to save it. Mistake!!!!

I’m so glad he finally agreed to go to the hospital. Stubborn man. I’ve never seen him in so much pain, the car ride was awful the boys will be hard pressed to forget. But he’s feeling much better this morning. Fingers crossed they fully heal.

It will be interesting to see what happens this 2nd Clomid cycle, I’ve had a lot more energy taking it at the later start. When to start opk? I’m day 10 now, last Clomid was last night (lucky I thought to pop it in my bag while we went to the hospital) day 9.


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Originally Posted by emshe

He’ll be ok. Silly plant... fell over in the heavy rain we had a week ago so we were doing what we could to save it. Mistake!!!!

I’m so glad he finally agreed to go to the hospital. Stubborn man. I’ve never seen him in so much pain, the car ride was awful the boys will be hard pressed to forget. But he’s feeling much better this morning. Fingers crossed they fully heal.

It will be interesting to see what happens this 2nd Clomid cycle, I’ve had a lot more energy taking it at the later start. When to start opk? I’m day 10 now, last Clomid was last night (lucky I thought to pop it in my bag while we went to the hospital) day 9.


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Glad he's going to be ok!!

Which type of OPKs are you using? I think I usually start the day after Clomid is done, but I use the CB dual hormone and you're supposed to start well in advance so it can track "high" fertility. I think it's supposed to take 7-10 days after you finish Clomid to O, but you don't know how you're body will react to taking it later in your cycle than you did last month.

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Originally Posted by ABC.2606

Glad he's going to be ok!!

Which type of OPKs are you using? I think I usually start the day after Clomid is done, but I use the CB dual hormone and you're supposed to start well in advance so it can track "high" fertility. I think it's supposed to take 7-10 days after you finish Clomid to O, but you don't know how you're body will react to taking it later in your cycle than you did last month.

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I’m so glad you said that, that’s one I’ve got! So ill start tomorrow then as I’ve already been to the toilet this morning. Can I ask do you use a new handle every time? I did some reading about how it works and it’s based on your previously read levels to determine the rise, so I assume you need a new handle to reset it?


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Originally Posted by emshe

I’m so glad you said that, that’s one I’ve got! So ill start tomorrow then as I’ve already been to the toilet this morning. Can I ask do you use a new handle every time? I did some reading about how it works and it’s based on your previously read levels to determine the rise, so I assume you need a new handle to reset it?


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No I use the same handle each cycle until I run out of test strips and need a new box and then I'll switch to the new one. I buy boxes that have 20 strips so that lasts me about 3 cycles.

The Clomid can cause false positives for 3 days after you take the last dose so wait till then.

Emshe I think we may have talked about this in the past but i often have people wait till the 5th day after the last dose, start OPK that day, but also have an attempt that day too. This is because it is rare, if not impossible that you will ovulate any sooner than that, and it eliminates the possibility of confusion as to whether it's a real surge or not. So by having an attempt that day, and also starting the OPK, you're covered in case of ovulation on that day, but you're also starting OPK and you can be sure any OPK you get is legitimate and not a holdover from any Clomid still in your system.

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Originally Posted by atomic sagebrush

The Clomid can cause false positives for 3 days after you take the last dose so wait till then.

Emshe I think we may have talked about this in the past but i often have people wait till the 5th day after the last dose, start OPK that day, but also have an attempt that day too. This is because it is rare, if not impossible that you will ovulate any sooner than that, and it eliminates the possibility of confusion as to whether it's a real surge or not. So by having an attempt that day, and also starting the OPK, you're covered in case of ovulation on that day, but you're also starting OPK and you can be sure any OPK you get is legitimate and not a holdover from any Clomid still in your system.

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Thanks atomic, I remembered the fmu this morning and tested. Whoops! It was negative.

We bd CD10 am, so next e4d date dance will be CD13, 4 days without Clomid. Hope that will be ok as I just want to keep rolling with e4d to make it carefree 🤞🏻


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I would like to use clomid as part of my sway after I purchase my custom plan. I would not be able to get from my physician. Any ideas online? I live in the US. Thank you! :)

People buy it online but I can't recommend any sites or endorse doing that.

Thanks anyway :)

Hi! How is everyone?

I am having a boring follicular phase (guess that's a good thing). I lost track, but think I'm CD 13 today. No ewcm yet, but I've never had it this early. I'm thinking about buying opks this cycle just for the extra reassurance, even though it's a PITA to have to hold my pee for hours then sneak off at work to POAS.

This cycle my mood has been better. Not sure if the Clomid is affecting me less, or if I have just gotten better at controlling my emotions. I've done a decent job dieting these past two weeks -- better than I have for the past few months, but not as good as the month before I got pregnant.

Hope everyone is well and that this is the lucky month for us.

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Originally Posted by MrsEnglish

Hi! How is everyone?

I am having a boring follicular phase (guess that's a good thing). I lost track, but think I'm CD 13 today. No ewcm yet, but I've never had it this early. I'm thinking about buying opks this cycle just for the extra reassurance, even though it's a PITA to have to hold my pee for hours then sneak off at work to POAS.

This cycle my mood has been better. Not sure if the Clomid is affecting me less, or if I have just gotten better at controlling my emotions. I've done a decent job dieting these past two weeks -- better than I have for the past few months, but not as good as the month before I got pregnant.

Hope everyone is well and that this is the lucky month for us.

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Good to hear youre feeling brighter this round Mrs English! Hope it’s your time & good on you for the diet!


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Atomic! Just got a positive opk 11am CD18. Due for E4D tomorrow morning CD19 around 6am. Should I just bring that a bit earlier? Say late late tonight?


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Sorry I didn't see this yesterday, whatever you did was the right thing to do! :)

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Originally Posted by atomic sagebrush

Sorry I didn't see this yesterday, whatever you did was the right thing to do! :)

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Thanks atomic.
Brought it forward a little, to 12am, hoping Ir wasn’t too late & we caught the egg. Had pressure pain from 8am [emoji51]🤞🏻[emoji51]


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Originally Posted by emshe

Thanks atomic.
Brought it forward a little, to 12am, hoping Ir wasn’t too late & we caught the egg. Had pressure pain from 8am [emoji51]🤞🏻[emoji51]


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Sounds like perfect timing to me! FX

So yesterday (aka the day after I updated saying everything was boring), I got up in the morning and felt unusually sexy. Actually, not so unusual -- because it usually happens to me in the few days before ovulation :)

Then I got some mixed ewcm -- which isn't the best pure ewcm that I get, but it's mixed (TMI) ewcm with chunks of cloudy cm, and I usually have it for about two days before getting pure ewcm.

So we made an attempt last night just to cover the bases, and we're planning an attempt Thursday night which will be a 4 day difference. If I had to guess, I'm guessing that I'll O on Friday.

I did buy OPKs for this cycle. Yesterday's was very negative. From previous natural cycles using OPKs and temping I found that I usually O two days after positive OPK, but Clomid could have changed that, so we'll see.

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Originally Posted by MrsEnglish

So yesterday (aka the day after I updated saying everything was boring), I got up in the morning and felt unusually sexy. Actually, not so unusual -- because it usually happens to me in the few days before ovulation [emoji4]

Then I got some mixed ewcm -- which isn't the best pure ewcm that I get, but it's mixed (TMI) ewcm with chunks of cloudy cm, and I usually have it for about two days before getting pure ewcm.

So we made an attempt last night just to cover the bases, and we're planning an attempt Thursday night which will be a 4 day difference. If I had to guess, I'm guessing that I'll O on Friday.

I did buy OPKs for this cycle. Yesterday's was very negative. From previous natural cycles using OPKs and temping I found that I usually O two days after positive OPK, but Clomid could have changed that, so we'll see.

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Good luck Mrs English! I love that you feel sexy, how helpful is that when wanting to do the deed, fabulous


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Originally Posted by MrsEnglish

Sounds like perfect timing to me! FX

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Thank you!!!!


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Glad you both have some positive signs! I have had a weird cycle so far - no ewcm, no cm. I did some preggo tests last week as I felt a bit odd and got lines on some internet cheapies after a few mins but extremely faint and they could have been evap. All tests now BFN. I am now cd 19 - I oved on 16/17 last cycle on Femara. Hmmm. Plus my temps seem to be post ov when I checked them a few days ago. But I doubt I could have oved at like cd 11/12 as that would be the earliest I ever have! It has really thrown me this month as I usually have at least 3 days of ewcm. So I am clueless as to what is happening! BDing E4D just in case!

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Originally Posted by ManchesterMrs

Glad you both have some positive signs! I have had a weird cycle so far - no ewcm, no cm. I did some preggo tests last week as I felt a bit odd and got lines on some internet cheapies after a few mins but extremely faint and they could have been evap. All tests now BFN. I am now cd 19 - I oved on 16/17 last cycle on Femara. Hmmm. Plus my temps seem to be post ov when I checked them a few days ago. But I doubt I could have oved at like cd 11/12 as that would be the earliest I ever have! It has really thrown me this month as I usually have at least 3 days of ewcm. So I am clueless as to what is happening! BDing E4D just in case!

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How frustrating, E4D sounds like a great plan, takes a lot of the stress out of it!
Good luck


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Good luck ladies!! LMK if you need anything!

Now getting ov signs on day 19/20. No pos opk yet.

Is it normal to ov on different days with Femara? I had pos opk on day 16 last month (first cycle on it) and I guess I just assumed it would be a bit earlier or similar on the second month. Worried it means I will have a weaker ovulation but I guess might not necessarily be the case.

I tend to ov on the later side naturally - don’t recall an earlier ov than cd 19 naturally but then I only have a few cycles to go on as I got pregnant with my boys after only a few natural cycles.

Many thanks for any advice!

I hope if not pregnant my lp is as least longer than 8/9 days this cycle.

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Originally Posted by ManchesterMrs

Now getting ov signs on day 19/20. No pos opk yet.

Is it normal to ov on different days with Femara? I had pos opk on day 16 last month (first cycle on it) and I guess I just assumed it would be a bit earlier or similar on the second month. Worried it means I will have a weaker ovulation but I guess might not necessarily be the case.

I tend to ov on the later side naturally - don’t recall an earlier ov than cd 19 naturally but then I only have a few cycles to go on as I got pregnant with my boys after only a few natural cycles.

Many thanks for any advice!

I hope if not pregnant my lp is as least longer than 8/9 days this cycle.

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I can’t answer this unfortunately but I hope it all works out and ov is approaching


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Attempt planned for tonight. Still only negative OPKs including this mornings', but this morning I got really good ewcm and a lot of it. No pressure in my ovaries yet, so I don't think I could ovulate today, but if I make an attempt tonight then it would still be fine if I ovulate Friday or Saturday, hopefully before Sunday.

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Originally Posted by MrsEnglish

Attempt planned for tonight. Still only negative OPKs including this mornings', but this morning I got really good ewcm and a lot of it. No pressure in my ovaries yet, so I don't think I could ovulate today, but if I make an attempt tonight then it would still be fine if I ovulate Friday or Saturday, hopefully before Sunday.

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Just to let you know- the cycle I fell pregnant with DS2 I got NOT a single positive opk, and it was no cheap one but clearblue digital ;)
But I tracked temperature and so I at least knew that I indeed ovulated and the pregnancy showed that too LOL


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Yes pregnancy is usually a pretty definitive sign that a person has ovulated! :rofl:

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Originally Posted by ManchesterMrs

Now getting ov signs on day 19/20. No pos opk yet.

Is it normal to ov on different days with Femara? I had pos opk on day 16 last month (first cycle on it) and I guess I just assumed it would be a bit earlier or similar on the second month. Worried it means I will have a weaker ovulation but I guess might not necessarily be the case.

I tend to ov on the later side naturally - don’t recall an earlier ov than cd 19 naturally but then I only have a few cycles to go on as I got pregnant with my boys after only a few natural cycles.

Many thanks for any advice!

I hope if not pregnant my lp is as least longer than 8/9 days this cycle.

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Yes, it's totally normal. The odds are sky high that you will not ovulate a)the same day as normal or b) the same day from month to month on the fertility medicine (and this is TRUE no matter what your doc tells you! Doctors give out SOOOO much bad info on this front it's redonk)

This does not mean anything negative about your ovulation. Doesn't make any difference at all.

Atomic! Crosshairs on ff off again I feel, when do you think I ovulated, day after positive opk?

Link to chart below. Due to have another e4d attempt now.

How important is exercise in the days just after ov, I am just so tired I feel I need a bit of a break


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Well, DH and I made an attempt last night, really today around 3 am. Last evening and today I had "dark negative" opks -- still clearly lighter than the control, but a lot darker than they were before. I'm wondering if that's the darkest I'll get.

Today I still have ewcm, but a lot less than I did yesterday, so that is interesting. It seems like like cycle I stopped getting ewcm two days before temping said I ovulated.

I have a small amount of pressure in my ovaries today. Really hoping I O today or tomorrow, but I guess it's in God's hands now.

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Originally Posted by MrsEnglish

Well, DH and I made an attempt last night, really today around 3 am. Last evening and today I had "dark negative" opks -- still clearly lighter than the control, but a lot darker than they were before. I'm wondering if that's the darkest I'll get.

Today I still have ewcm, but a lot less than I did yesterday, so that is interesting. It seems like like cycle I stopped getting ewcm two days before temping said I ovulated.

I have a small amount of pressure in my ovaries today. Really hoping I O today or tomorrow, but I guess it's in God's hands now.

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Best of luck! We are pretty much cycle buddies I reckon as I think I am v close to ov at day 22. Had attempt last night though so I don’t think we will chance another. So hard to get the e4d timing to coincide with ov!

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Originally Posted by emshe

Atomic! Crosshairs on ff off again I feel, when do you think I ovulated, day after positive opk?

Link to chart below. Due to have another e4d attempt now.

How important is exercise in the days just after ov, I am just so tired I feel I need a bit of a break


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In what way do you feel they are off? Maybe a day early??

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Originally Posted by ManchesterMrs

Best of luck! We are pretty much cycle buddies I reckon as I think I am v close to ov at day 22. Had attempt last night though so I don’t think we will chance another. So hard to get the e4d timing to coincide with ov!

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You are not trying to get the e4d to coincide with anything. That is why e4d WORKS is because everyone wants to manipulate their attempts to fall on a certain day when the reality is we don't KNOW a) when O occurs or b) what cycle day will even be best for conception regardless of when O occurs. People end up outwitting themselves aiming at BD on a certain day around O when for all we know, they don't even O then and even if they do, they might have had a better chance the day before or the day after.

Just put ovulation out of your head totally and have sex every 4 days in the Monday/Thursday pattern.

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Originally Posted by atomic sagebrush

In what way do you feel they are off? Maybe a day early??

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Yeah a day early, I don’t feel it possible to have ov when i got my first positive opk at 11am on the day it says I ovulated. Is it?


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Thanks atomic. Good point!! Who even knows what is best? Conception is a very inexact science it seems! I just wanted to check something on E4D as you mention the Monday / Thursday patten. Is E4D Monday and then leave three days and have sex on the Friday? That is what we have been doing! Or is it Monday is day 1, tues and weds are 2 and 3 and then you’d have sex on the Thursday (day 4)? So if it was a week starting Monday you’d have sex on the Monday, the Thursday and then the Sunday?

Thanks so much!!!! You are such a great source of support.