WANTED! your questions on AF and OPK!!

[atomic sagebrush]

If you do notice that happening and it's just a little spotting it can even be from your cervix instead of AF.

[nancynichols1]

Has anyone ever had 2 lh surges in one cycle? I use the smiley face digital so they are certainly positive. Occured this month on CD 10 then again on CD 27. HPTs are negative and the last positive OPK lasted 2 days so it was tested multiple times. I did use progesterone suppositories after the first positive OPKnstarting on CD 13 and stopped on CD 20 when my HPT was negative thinking my period would start in a few days. Never started AF then started getting EWCM which prompted me to try my OPK and it was positive for 36 hrs then CM turned white & sticky. I am so confused!!!! I also stopped taking Fertile CM during this time. Any thoughts?

[atomic sagebrush]

Yes it can happen. The first one was a faker and then the real O was delayed by the prog supplements.

[nancynichols1]

Thanks Atomic! How do I know in the future that it is not a real surge? Should I always keep testing after the first surge to be sure or was it delayed because I took the Progesterone too soon after the first opk and it caused the ovulation to delay? What should I do going forward?

[aidansmum]

This is a very interesting and helpful thread! What a great idea and can't wait for this book!
Well, my period can be quite tricky. I am a spotter and sometimes it's hard to know if I am actually spotting or if it is the real thing. I follow the 'until you need a pad, it's not AF', but sometimes I can spot from 2-4 days before I get a steady flow. It also happens sometimes that my period starts (the day of the flow) and then stops for a day or so and then starts again, that started happening about 3 months ago (coincidentally when I started Vitex).
I guess I just wish it was easy to know when it is indeed cycle day 1, specially when I want to have meds like Clomid or FSH test that has to be done on a certain day.
As for OPK's, they worked like a charm to me but they went nuts during my Clomid cycle, which drove me bonkers! I has lots of dark but not quite positive from day 10-20, then darker ones from day 23-27, but not just one day, it was every single day and it made it very hard to time BD'ing as I can't get poor DH to comply every single day .
Just thought I should add this in case you want to put a OPK and meds in your book.

[atomic sagebrush]

Thanks Atomic! How do I know in the future that it is not a real surge? Should I always keep testing after the first surge to be sure or was it delayed because I took the Progesterone too soon after the first opk and it caused the ovulation to delay? What should I do going forward?

You don't. That's the downside of OPK, without an ultrasound to confirm ovulation, you really do not know if you ovulated or not. The progesterone will delay ovulation and so you would not get a second surge until the prog. was stopped anyway.

The only option is to have your doctor do an ultrasound when you think you have ovulated to confirm it prior to starting the progesterone. not all doctors are willing to do this unfortunately, so there may be an element of guesswork involved.

I know I should know this but what day are you starting prog?? 3 DPO? THere is the possibiltiy of delaying it a bit, but in cases of true prog. deficiency it is probably not going to help much if you start it later.

[atomic sagebrush]

This is a very interesting and helpful thread! What a great idea and can't wait for this book!
Well, my period can be quite tricky. I am a spotter and sometimes it's hard to know if I am actually spotting or if it is the real thing. I follow the 'until you need a pad, it's not AF', but sometimes I can spot from 2-4 days before I get a steady flow. It also happens sometimes that my period starts (the day of the flow) and then stops for a day or so and then starts again, that started happening about 3 months ago (coincidentally when I started Vitex).
I guess I just wish it was easy to know when it is indeed cycle day 1, specially when I want to have meds like Clomid or FSH test that has to be done on a certain day.
As for OPK's, they worked like a charm to me but they went nuts during my Clomid cycle, which drove me bonkers! I has lots of dark but not quite positive from day 10-20, then darker ones from day 23-27, but not just one day, it was every single day and it made it very hard to time BD'ing as I can't get poor DH to comply every single day .
Just thought I should add this in case you want to put a OPK and meds in your book.

The pad/red flow/AF rule is one of those things that is not set in stone and it needs to be a help for you, not a hindrance. My rule is, "if you think it's AF, then it is." Some people have spotting but only when they wipe, all day, others have a tiny bit of red blood one day, and to me it's just silly to slavishy stick to the "pad/red flow" rule. Look at the big picture - take into account when you ovulate. If you O and then have a day of spotting every cycle 15 DPO before red flow begins 16 DPO, then the day of spotting is part of AF. If you O CD 14 and then start spotting 10 DPO and spot for 4 days before AF starts, then it's a short LP issue. If you're on Clomid and this happens, err on the side of being fully sure that you are firstly not pregnancy and secondly that AF has begun - you can start Clomid as early as CD 2 and as late as CD5 so it's not worth the stress trying to get it exactly on a particular CD.

Re OPK, if it's not positive, it's irrelevant if it's pretty dark and should be disregarded. You will O 8-48 hours after the first positive OPK (avg. 36 hrs) regardless of whether you get positives for 5 minutes or 5 days. Time your attempt from that first positive. Now, if you take OPK while actively taking Clomid or a couple days afterwards, you will get a false pos with OPK so do take that into consideration and be sure to wait a couple days before starting OPK.

[nancynichols1]

I took the progesterone suppository starting 2 DPO. I am still unclear as to why it then delayed my ovulation or caused a second surge 14 days later??? If you take it after ovulation it wouldn't delay it right?! I'm still confused thus i won't be taking it again until I get a BFP! I'm sure there is little chance of getting PG with a CD 30 ovulation.


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[atomic sagebrush]

Because your body "thought" you were pregnant when your progesterone went up and that inhibited ovulation. That's how your body works - after you ovulate, the hole that the egg came out of starts to make a ton of progesterone and that keeps any more eggs from being ovulated. But in your case, the egg never WAS ovulated, so everything just kinda froze in place right where it was. Then when you stopped the progesterone, your body was then able to resume previously scheduled programming and you did ovulate (I doubt it was the original egg, probably that egg was reabsorbed and another egg took over and popped out, but no way to know without ultrasound)

Of course if you take progesterone after ovulation, it can't delay ovulation, because ovulation has already occured - ya can't close the barn door after the horse escaped.

There is absolutely a chance of getting pg with CD 30 ovulation!!!! That's hardly even considered late ovulation.

[Tmolly]

OMG, Atomic, I came here to post a new OPK question and JUST noticed that you answered my prev questions over a month ago. I assumed we were just asking to give you ideas for your book's FAQ and didn't expect a response nor did I ever look for one -- thanks so much for answering, much appreciated!!

Okay, my new question is this: How long can urine be kept for an accurate OPK reading? When I see my OPK becoming positive, I sometimes keep the cup of urine aside to test again with another strip to be sure that it's not a faulty strip. But just my luck, I seem to get pos OPKs when I'm busy (e.g., about to put DS to bed), so I don't make it back to the bathroom until an hour later, and the 2nd strip I test in the same urine is never positive. Does LH dissipate in some way that makes a later test inaccurate? Not looking to hoard urine or anything, but how long is urine good for this purpose?