Maternal Dominance Hypothesis and Priviledged Daughter Hypothesis

[atomic sagebrush]

The vicious circle is cruel: you get a couple of boys in part because you have a tendency to obsess, and then you obsess hard about getting the girl.

I have no doubt that nature has its historical reasons for giving boys to women like me but I think in this day and age I'm less suited to raising boys because of my perfectionism/need for control. I would love to be able to be a relaxed parent and ignore the horseplay, vulgarity, etc. but it really bothers me. Maybe I would have been swell at raising cave boys but I have breakable things in my house.

As you see I have a couple remaining essay spots to be filled in this series and one of the upcoming ones will be about this very issue.

This is a little bit of a hot button issue so please be gentle with me, we gotta talk about these things in order to piece it all together.

I am of the opinion (an opinion true for ME and no one else I'm sure but just sharing in case it's helpful to anyone) that because I sometimes want(ed) my boys to do things VERY differently than they do - not for their benefit but for my own personal benefit, to make me look better, to reflect well upon me - that my boys were put here to disobey me because I needed to have that tendency beat out of me, so to speak, before I got a girl that I would have possibly hurt by it. My parents are both huge control freaks (for their own personal benefit) and it very nearly broke me as a child. Being a people pleasing daughter in a family of people who are up your butt perfectionist about everything all the time constantly can crush a little girl. It wasn't an easy way to grow up, and it has caused me nothing but trouble in my life to this very day.

My daughter is much, much easier than my boys (all the girl moms are ticked off at me now saying "girls are NOT easier" well, mine certainly is, for now anyway), much more obedient, she does what I say and gets very upset when I chastise her over even the littlest thing. She worries a LOT about what others, especially me, are thinking about her. It is a novel experience and one that I have really had to rise to the occasion to correct and control myself over. And I have to wonder, when I'm being totally honest with myself, what if I had gotten her first? Would I have had enough experience/wisdom to correct and control myself? Could she have stood up to me when I was being too overbearing or pushy or in her face? Would she have argued back at me the way my second son did when I was asking him to do too many chores, or blown me off the way my first son did when I was critical of his clothing and school choices, or would she have been ME, basically, ending up practically a slave in my parents' house doing all the chores and resenting it all the time, and dropping out of school to get married because I had literally no control over anything in my life otherwise? I don't know.

The way it is now, looking back on it, I believe I had to learn the lesson the boys taught me (which is back the eff off, mom, let me live my life) and I think it has benefited her and made me a better parent for her.

I know a couple of control freakish women IRL who had girls and one of them had her daughter potty trained by age 18 months. She went to school the first day of kindergarten and pooped her pants in front of the entire school. The other one's daughter was perfect, perfect, perfect, her whole life, and ended up with an eating disorder. It isn't only about the boys and their well being. It is also about the girls, and I am not trying to say that we wouldn't be great moms of girls, too, it's not that, it is that there may be more going on here than it seems at first blush. Maybe a percentage of control freak parents out there may cause more harm than good with a girl (not you or anyone on this site, but we do know those people exist, we all recognize the stereotype) and not only is it about keeping your caveboy alive, it's about keeping a cavegirl alive and functional to adulthood, too.

And I get how all that comes off, kinda like Valerie Grant saying "you get the child you're best suited for" and I don't mean to say that, exactly, it's not that. Because I believe we all change our parenting styles to suit our individual kiddos, boys or girls alike, and all of us on this site are great moms who would do exactly that. But not everyone is. And certainly historically, not everyone was. We are dealing with tendencies and circumstances dating back millions of years, before we were even humans. Up till very recently no one was living an examined life, no one was doing what was best for children like we do now, people were struggling so hard to survive that they often treated their children pretty terribly. Children's happiness was an afterthought, even for our parents' generations, you know?

So these things we talk about all hypothetically and stuff very likely made some pretty big differences not that long ago. Children were seen as resources for the benefit of the family to be used and abused. It could have been the difference between life and death to have a child who didn't push back if their parent was taking some advantage of them. A child who was too eager to please, as girls sometimes are, if the parent asked too much, if the parent's standards were too high - that would be a disaster too.

Now, I will sit back and watch this entire thread blow up and everyone be angry at me for the next week or two.

Everyone understand, I'm not trying to give offense, my point is simply that there are possibly benefits to both boys and girls, having the Maternal Dominance Hypothesis in play. It's not a "you have to take one for the team because you are destined to raise caveboys in a Lalique Dove world" because honestly that wouldn't make me feel one bit happy about my life either (and believe me, my word you have no idea how much I relate to that sentiment, I just screamed at my sons for destroying a fragile old cookbook of mine by shoving it carelessly into a drawer when they were asked to pick up instead of picking up one of the 9 zillion things that are everywhere all the time that belong to them). It's a "these are the kids that I got and there may be some higher reason for this even if the reason no longer matters" - IDK. I find some peace in that. And yeah, I have a daughter, easy for me to find peace, right, but let's not forget I had nothing but boys for 21 years and I still have to deal with their horsing around, vulgarity, breaking stuff, constant life threatening accidents, etc.

[emshe]

As you see I have a couple remaining essay spots to be filled in this series and one of the upcoming ones will be about this very issue.

This is a little bit of a hot button issue so please be gentle with me, we gotta talk about these things in order to piece it all together.

I am of the opinion (an opinion true for ME and no one else I'm sure but just sharing in case it's helpful to anyone) that because I sometimes want(ed) my boys to do things VERY differently than they do - not for their benefit but for my own personal benefit, to make me look better, to reflect well upon me - that my boys were put here to disobey me because I needed to have that tendency beat out of me, so to speak, before I got a girl that I would have possibly hurt by it. My parents are both huge control freaks (for their own personal benefit) and it very nearly broke me as a child. Being a people pleasing daughter in a family of people who are up your butt perfectionist about everything all the time constantly can crush a little girl. It wasn't an easy way to grow up, and it has caused me nothing but trouble in my life to this very day.

My daughter is much, much easier than my boys (all the girl moms are ticked off at me now saying "girls are NOT easier" well, mine certainly is, for now anyway), much more obedient, she does what I say and gets very upset when I chastise her over even the littlest thing. She worries a LOT about what others, especially me, are thinking about her. It is a novel experience and one that I have really had to rise to the occasion to correct and control myself over. And I have to wonder, when I'm being totally honest with myself, what if I had gotten her first? Would I have had enough experience/wisdom to correct and control myself? Could she have stood up to me when I was being too overbearing or pushy or in her face? Would she have argued back at me the way my second son did when I was asking him to do too many chores, or blown me off the way my first son did when I was critical of his clothing and school choices, or would she have been ME, basically, ending up practically a slave in my parents' house doing all the chores and resenting it all the time, and dropping out of school to get married because I had literally no control over anything in my life otherwise? I don't know.

The way it is now, looking back on it, I believe I had to learn the lesson the boys taught me (which is back the eff off, mom, let me live my life) and I think it has benefited her and made me a better parent for her.

I know a couple of control freakish women IRL who had girls and one of them had her daughter potty trained by age 18 months. She went to school the first day of kindergarten and pooped her pants in front of the entire school. The other one's daughter was perfect, perfect, perfect, her whole life, and ended up with an eating disorder. It isn't only about the boys and their well being. It is also about the girls, and I am not trying to say that we wouldn't be great moms of girls, too, it's not that, it is that there may be more going on here than it seems at first blush. Maybe a percentage of control freak parents out there may cause more harm than good with a girl (not you or anyone on this site, but we do know those people exist, we all recognize the stereotype) and not only is it about keeping your caveboy alive, it's about keeping a cavegirl alive and functional to adulthood, too.

And I get how all that comes off, kinda like Valerie Grant saying "you get the child you're best suited for" and I don't mean to say that, exactly, it's not that. Because I believe we all change our parenting styles to suit our individual kiddos, boys or girls alike, and all of us on this site are great moms who would do exactly that. But not everyone is. And certainly historically, not everyone was. We are dealing with tendencies and circumstances dating back millions of years, before we were even humans. Up till very recently no one was living an examined life, no one was doing what was best for children like we do now, people were struggling so hard to survive that they often treated their children pretty terribly. Children's happiness was an afterthought, even for our parents' generations, you know?

So these things we talk about all hypothetically and stuff very likely made some pretty big differences not that long ago. Children were seen as resources for the benefit of the family to be used and abused. It could have been the difference between life and death to have a child who didn't push back if their parent was taking some advantage of them. A child who was too eager to please, as girls sometimes are, if the parent asked too much, if the parent's standards were too high - that would be a disaster too.

Now, I will sit back and watch this entire thread blow up and everyone be angry at me for the next week or two.

Everyone understand, I'm not trying to give offense, my point is simply that there are possibly benefits to both boys and girls, having the Maternal Dominance Hypothesis in play. It's not a "you have to take one for the team because you are destined to raise caveboys in a Lalique Dove world" because honestly that wouldn't make me feel one bit happy about my life either (and believe me, my word you have no idea how much I relate to that sentiment, I just screamed at my sons for destroying a fragile old cookbook of mine by shoving it carelessly into a drawer when they were asked to pick up instead of picking up one of the 9 zillion things that are everywhere all the time that belong to them). It's a "these are the kids that I got and there may be some higher reason for this even if the reason no longer matters" - IDK. I find some peace in that. And yeah, I have a daughter, easy for me to find peace, right, but let's not forget I had nothing but boys for 21 years and I still have to deal with their horsing around, vulgarity, breaking stuff, constant life threatening accidents, etc.

Thanks atomic, I was only thinking about my control issues yesterday & wondering how an earth I can back off. Reading how it impacted you as achild, which I’m sorry you dealt with, helps me realise how negative it is being on the other side. I have been trying to let go, but can’t say I’m doing that great [emoji17]

Any tips on how they managed to let go more & more. Walking around with my eyes shut & ear plugs in isn’t as easy as I thought it may be. Ha ha


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[kittendreams]

Needed to read this today thank you Atomic xx

[Greydore]

Maybe I’m the odd one out, but I love my boys’ wildness. The jumping, the wrestling, I love it all. Watching them ‘wrestle’ with my husband is so sweet and funny. Maybe I’m ok with it because we really don’t have a lot of nice things, and I’m not a clean, organized person? I never have been, so maybe it makes it easier for me to have boys? I don’t know. Of course they do things that irritate me, but I figure most kids do. I’ll agree with atomic that all of my friends with girls say they’re easier than boys (while they’re little. Most think they’re more difficult as teenagers). When I was little I was very obedient, quiet, people pleasing, and ended up with an eating disorder I battled for a decade. That was a huge reason I was terrified to have a girl; boys have them but they’re much more prevalent in girls, and ED’s are hereditary. I still don’t know if I want a daughter. When I nannied I bonded much more easily with the boys, despite their boy tendencies that can make them more difficult. Maybe the tendencies that girls have just annoy me more? I don’t know. Either way, I’m think I’m a good fit as a boy mom.


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[frankie2017]

Maybe I’m the odd one out, but I love my boys’ wildness. The jumping, the wrestling, I love it all. Watching them ‘wrestle’ with my husband is so sweet and funny. Maybe I’m ok with it because we really don’t have a lot of nice things, and I’m not a clean, organized person? I never have been, so maybe it makes it easier for me to have boys? I don’t know. Of course they do things that irritate me, but I figure most kids do. I’ll agree with atomic that all of my friends with girls say they’re easier than boys (while they’re little. Most think they’re more difficult as teenagers). When I was little I was very obedient, quiet, people pleasing, and ended up with an eating disorder I battled for a decade. That was a huge reason I was terrified to have a girl; boys have them but they’re much more prevalent in girls, and ED’s are hereditary. I still don’t know if I want a daughter. When I nannied I bonded much more easily with the boys, despite their boy tendencies that can make them more difficult. Maybe the tendencies that girls have just annoy me more? I don’t know. Either way, I’m think I’m a good fit as a boy mom.


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I love being a boy mum too , I can see how I’m really good at it - I bounce off the walls as much as they do most days [emoji23] , I still desperately want a daughter but I feel like I do boy mum VERy well and love it too.

Where are you at Greydore are TTC at the moment ?


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[trifecta]

Just to be clear, I don't have glassware or figurines or anything like that, but I have walls, drawers, doorknobs, shower curtains rods, etc.

I'm not always on their backs but the "boyish" behaviors definitely cause me stress.

Maybe that's why your odds of conceiving a boy go up further still after having a few boys: because they drive you freaking crazy!

[Greydore]

Frankie I’m 10 weeks along with our third. I didn’t sway but I love the community here so I sticking around

Trifecta I totally understand. Boys find a way to make anything and everything into a toy, and their energy is exhausting. I do think girls have their own set of annoyances but I would probably be attacked for saying them


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[gafan]

As you see I have a couple remaining essay spots to be filled in this series and one of the upcoming ones will be about this very issue.

This is a little bit of a hot button issue so please be gentle with me, we gotta talk about these things in order to piece it all together.

I am of the opinion (an opinion true for ME and no one else I'm sure but just sharing in case it's helpful to anyone) that because I sometimes want(ed) my boys to do things VERY differently than they do - not for their benefit but for my own personal benefit, to make me look better, to reflect well upon me - that my boys were put here to disobey me because I needed to have that tendency beat out of me, so to speak, before I got a girl that I would have possibly hurt by it. My parents are both huge control freaks (for their own personal benefit) and it very nearly broke me as a child. Being a people pleasing daughter in a family of people who are up your butt perfectionist about everything all the time constantly can crush a little girl. It wasn't an easy way to grow up, and it has caused me nothing but trouble in my life to this very day.

My daughter is much, much easier than my boys (all the girl moms are ticked off at me now saying "girls are NOT easier" well, mine certainly is, for now anyway), much more obedient, she does what I say and gets very upset when I chastise her over even the littlest thing. She worries a LOT about what others, especially me, are thinking about her. It is a novel experience and one that I have really had to rise to the occasion to correct and control myself over. And I have to wonder, when I'm being totally honest with myself, what if I had gotten her first? Would I have had enough experience/wisdom to correct and control myself? Could she have stood up to me when I was being too overbearing or pushy or in her face? Would she have argued back at me the way my second son did when I was asking him to do too many chores, or blown me off the way my first son did when I was critical of his clothing and school choices, or would she have been ME, basically, ending up practically a slave in my parents' house doing all the chores and resenting it all the time, and dropping out of school to get married because I had literally no control over anything in my life otherwise? I don't know.

The way it is now, looking back on it, I believe I had to learn the lesson the boys taught me (which is back the eff off, mom, let me live my life) and I think it has benefited her and made me a better parent for her.

I know a couple of control freakish women IRL who had girls and one of them had her daughter potty trained by age 18 months. She went to school the first day of kindergarten and pooped her pants in front of the entire school. The other one's daughter was perfect, perfect, perfect, her whole life, and ended up with an eating disorder. It isn't only about the boys and their well being. It is also about the girls, and I am not trying to say that we wouldn't be great moms of girls, too, it's not that, it is that there may be more going on here than it seems at first blush. Maybe a percentage of control freak parents out there may cause more harm than good with a girl (not you or anyone on this site, but we do know those people exist, we all recognize the stereotype) and not only is it about keeping your caveboy alive, it's about keeping a cavegirl alive and functional to adulthood, too.

And I get how all that comes off, kinda like Valerie Grant saying "you get the child you're best suited for" and I don't mean to say that, exactly, it's not that. Because I believe we all change our parenting styles to suit our individual kiddos, boys or girls alike, and all of us on this site are great moms who would do exactly that. But not everyone is. And certainly historically, not everyone was. We are dealing with tendencies and circumstances dating back millions of years, before we were even humans. Up till very recently no one was living an examined life, no one was doing what was best for children like we do now, people were struggling so hard to survive that they often treated their children pretty terribly. Children's happiness was an afterthought, even for our parents' generations, you know?

So these things we talk about all hypothetically and stuff very likely made some pretty big differences not that long ago. Children were seen as resources for the benefit of the family to be used and abused. It could have been the difference between life and death to have a child who didn't push back if their parent was taking some advantage of them. A child who was too eager to please, as girls sometimes are, if the parent asked too much, if the parent's standards were too high - that would be a disaster too.

Now, I will sit back and watch this entire thread blow up and everyone be angry at me for the next week or two.

Everyone understand, I'm not trying to give offense, my point is simply that there are possibly benefits to both boys and girls, having the Maternal Dominance Hypothesis in play. It's not a "you have to take one for the team because you are destined to raise caveboys in a Lalique Dove world" because honestly that wouldn't make me feel one bit happy about my life either (and believe me, my word you have no idea how much I relate to that sentiment, I just screamed at my sons for destroying a fragile old cookbook of mine by shoving it carelessly into a drawer when they were asked to pick up instead of picking up one of the 9 zillion things that are everywhere all the time that belong to them). It's a "these are the kids that I got and there may be some higher reason for this even if the reason no longer matters" - IDK. I find some peace in that. And yeah, I have a daughter, easy for me to find peace, right, but let's not forget I had nothing but boys for 21 years and I still have to deal with their horsing around, vulgarity, breaking stuff, constant life threatening accidents, etc.

Thanks, Atomic. That is an interesting line of thinking. Over-controlling parents are not good for any child but on the whole young girls need to tend to be more emotionally attuned and sensitive than young boys. Of course there are differences within individuals but if we are looking at groups, as we would be in this case, what you're saying makes some sense. If I do get to have 2 children I hope to work through some of my over-controlling and anxiety based references about how things "ought" to be on a child who maybe more suited to roll with it or tell me off. Some of my experiences are similar to yours is a child and it certainly is challenging and not to hand that over control down the generations!

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[kittendreams]

I love being a boy mum too and as a teacher I always seemed to have a soft spot and endless patience for the boys in my class and their energy and while I love teaching girls too I just seem to understand little boys.
But I want a girl too- not because I think she will be better behaved ( I was the naughtiest little girl ever lol) but because I want a chance at a mother -daughter bond which I have never had.

[Greydore]

Gafan that’s actually not true. Recent research has shown that little boys are actually more emotional than girls- they suffer more from negative emotions and require more emotional attention from their parents. Girls seem to be more resilient. My oldest son requires so much of me, and he was a very high needs baby. I’m not surprised by this at all. In school age years boys seem less emotional because of group influence to be stoic.


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