be absolutely sure that you just don't like kids!!

[atomic sagebrush]

Ok, straight talk here - I have a couple friends who got their desired gender and complain just as much about raising them as ever, and it occurs to me that maybe, just maybe some of us just don't like kids that much. It isn't a boy thing or a girl thing, it's a "some people don't really enjoy having kids" thing...and that is OK. No value judgement implied, it's just one of the many things to investigate about yourself and your own psyche before taking a drastic step like trying to conceive or pursuing high tech. Is it really gender, or is it that you'd just possibly rather be doing adult things and pursuing your own interests at this point in time???

Just be sure when you look at your kids and think "ZOMG boys are so loud and rambunctious" or "My Gosh little girls scream a lot and like drama" that what you're really not saying is, "I am just one of those people that happens to enjoy adult pursuits" before you make a decision that will last for literally the rest of your life. :)

[trifecta]

I think the opposite is probably also true for some people: if you want more children pursuit of the desired gender can give you a reason or excuse to have more than you originally intended.

[deaks66]

Personally I'm glad to hear people moan about raising their dg as much as the other. I prefer that to people putting their dg on a pedestal. Both genders are hard hard work, that's why parenting is so rewarding even if at the time we moan a lot!

[Leokat]

Know what you mean exactly. Sometimes we blame things on a current situation, not the fact that we maybe aren't suited to that actual situation as people! x

[atomic sagebrush]

Personally I'm glad to hear people moan about raising their dg as much as the other. I prefer that to people putting their dg on a pedestal. Both genders are hard hard work, that's why parenting is so rewarding even if at the time we moan a lot!

I also like this and please don't get me wrong, I am honestly not being judgemental at all. It's not the complaining that I"m talking about. Just that I know a couple people who are really, really not seeming to enjoy their kids, like, at all. They just don't like it. Not everyone does.

I think most of us myself included have been guilty of thinking "if I had a girl she would/wouldn't (insert annoying behavior here)". I just think it's something to consider when planning these life altering decisions that we are potentially taking on, that it may NOT be a boy thing or a girl thing, it might me a "me thing" and just food for thought, for whatever it's worth to anyone else.

[atomic sagebrush]

It's hard when they're little no matter how you slice it. hang in there, it gets easier.

[Dana-Alicia]

To be honest, I was one of thise moms who was really not enjoying being a mom for a long time. So it's a good thing you brought this up Atomic, because I think a lot of moms are feeling this way. It turned out I was just very depressed and completely burned out. Not because of my kids, but because of me. I put me somewhere in the corner and only lived for my kids and my husband. And none of them seemed very grateful. I just felt like a slob, who was picking up after everyone, wiping bums and cooking meals no one likes. It was not them, it was me, I'm a Martha, a perfectionist, and it's never good enough what I do, ever. Once I got therapy and meds AND took more time for me, also took care of me, I am now honestly so content with being a mother. Before I wanted a daughter, because I felt I deserved it. A daughter would be easier, I should have had a daughter, she was taken from me before I could even meet her and now I deserved her back! But that's not how life works. I always had the excuses of not having time to do something for me, as the kids needed me. But I truly believe now it's like being on a plane and the airpressure drops. First save yourself, then your kids. Once you got that sorted, see if you still want another one, desired gender or not. Now I feel I still want a girl, but for different reasons. Not because I deserve it, not because she needs me or I need her. But because I want this for my family, to complete us as a whole. I doubt I could ever put a girl on a pedestole solely, as my boys will share that spot with her! And they will all be equally lovely and annoying all together. In the end, all our kids need us to love them for who they are, not their gender.

[atomic sagebrush]

Thanks you guys so much for sharing your thoughts and feelings!!!

[XXforhubby]

I know for my DH the thought of having four kids is too much for him. We have close relatives with four, young kids and he doesn't want that. I could, but I would like to go back to work before I'm 40, lol!

I wanted another baby, and we are having one! He is healthy and our boys are excited to have another brother. I feel we are in a good place and worry that having a fourth would be too stressful on our marriage, since DH has anxiety just talking about a fourth child. I know that things could change, but a lot would have to change! We would have to move to a larger house, DH would need a promotion, I wouldn't go back to work until I'm 40, etc. The only way it would work is if we had to make it work and had a pleasant surprise! But even then DH and I would both be panicking, lol!!


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[Adia]

OMG, don't get me started on this one.

I was raised in a religion, (that shall remain nameless so as not to offend), where culturally families have a lot of kids. I was raised with 6 siblings and knew many families that had 7+ kids. My mom really wanted kids when she was young but by the time she had #7 she just checked out and the older kids raised the younger kids.

I realize this sounds like a "big family debate" but I really think people who WANT 7 kids can handle 7 kids with the proper resources. I would have loved to have had more kids but I don't have time, fertility or money on my side so #4 is the end of the road.

DH also had 6 siblings and his parents couldn't afford even 1. MIL was a decent mother, but has NEVER struck me as someone who REALLY wanted kids. She just played along with FIL wanting to prove his manlyhood and maintain a certain status in the religion. As a result DH and his siblings were malnourished as kids and seriously neglected in some pretty heavy areas that have left long term damage and scars.

Then their was my aunt. She was married to total pig the first time and had 8 kid, they couldn't afford one kid, not joking, but had 8 in the name of religion. My aunt hates kids, she was the WORST mother I have ever seen, abusive, cruel, horrible, spiteful, hypocritical, and a miserable person to be around. Then she divorces and marries her 2nd husband. Goes on to have 2 more kids because neither she nor him can figure out how to use birth control. Mind you these are people in their 40's who both have very advanced college degrees. The 2 most recent kids are the most neglected kids I have ever met but have more than most when it comes to material items!

I saw so much of that nonsense growing up. People who had kids AND DIDN'T REALLY WANT KIDS but wanted to maintain a certain status in their religion. I have SILs and BILs who have a certain number of kids just to feel like they fit in, they are CLEARLY not people who deeply desired to have and raise children, but they deeply desire to be a part of a greater society and one way to maintain status in that group is to have a certain number of kids to fit in.

Honestly, I have always felt bad for the kids themselves. I have seen some who went on to repeat the cycle but I have seen many who broke the cycle.

If nothing else seeing all that growing up made me think long and hard about having children and the number that I could live with. I am probably one of the most critical people when it comes to the topic of having kids when you don't really want them, but on the other side I am one of the most supportive people when it comes to those who DON"T want to have kids.

I apologize for the rant and sincerely hope I haven't offended anyone but this in one topic that gets me going...obviously!

[XXforhubby]

When I was younger, I didn't want to have kids. I grew up with an abusive mother with an untreated mental disorder (paranoid schizophrenia). Needless to say, that turned me off to being a mother.

Then I met my husband. We were married 9 years and together for 12 years before we had DS1. I hoped to have all boys, not because of my childhood, but because I always wanted to have a brother growing up. I was a huge tomboy, still am (but now I enjoy make-up!). I just relate better to boys and men on many different levels. My best friend is man I grew up with.

I wanted to make sure I had dealt with all of things from my past before having kids. I DID NOT want to remotely do or be anything close like my mother was to me to my kids. I wanted my children to grow up in a loving supportive home with plenty of examples on how to be a well rounded, emotionally stable person. I knew what not to do as parent ( like children need food and you shouldn't try to kill them!), but I wanted to be ready for the many ways that children need you to be selfless as a mother.

I too am deeply supportive of people who either decided not to have kids or those who don't for a variety of reasons. I get it. I think more people should assess this on a deeper level before having children. I love my children deeply, and they know it (something I never experienced). I'm glad I spent the years dealing completely with my past so it will never be my children's problem, because it was my issue, not theirs. In that respect I have fully succeeded, and now I'm trying to be the best mother that I can be to my boys.


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[atomic sagebrush]

OH gee I hope I wasn't shaming anyone, I just think it's a question we need to ask ourselves - is it REALLY a gender thing or is it just that maybe we aren't finding the fulfillment that we hoped/expected from motherhood.

[True Blue]

I have found over the years that with the best intentions and highest sensitivity there will always be those who discussions will hit a raw chord with. For me it's large family discussions or documentaries. I come away doubting our choice to have a large family.
I need to turn off emotionally and let go from those discussions.
We love our family and do our best by them ~ I hold onto that.

All discussions are beneficial :)

[Adia]

I have found over the years that with the best intentions and highest sensitivity there will always be those who discussions will hit a raw chord with. For me it's large family discussions or documentaries. I come away doubting our choice to have a large family.
I need to turn off emotionally and let go from those discussions.
We love our family and do our best by them ~ I hold onto that.

All discussions are beneficial :)

The large family debate is a touchy one True Blue and I certainly feel like I have an opinion based mostly on experience when it comes to that debate. I saw so many parents check out after the first batch of kids and it forced the older ones raise the younger ones. I saw so many families that just kept on having kids and the ones that were already alive were seriously neglected. Made me sick seeing all that, its even harder to digest now as a mother who works so hard to care for my kids.

I honestly think someone who wants a lot of kids and is willing to make it work can do it with the right resources, or the right amount of resourcefulness. You sound like you give it all your effort so I would be proud to have a large family if I were you.

I would have loved to have 10 kids, seriously. I really think I could have handled that many kids had they been spaced out well and I not have had to move and work so much over the years.

I certainly didn't want my 4 kids to be 16 years from start to finish but going through a divorce, Dh being active duty military (which equals deployments, little money, and moving a lot), and years of having to be the breadwinner before I married DH, finishing college, secondary infertility, etc has given me what I've got. I'll take it, but I do wish I could have more kids.

I'm still prego for now but I am having a hard time with the idea of DH or I getting fixed permanently. I would really like one more baby, at least. Realistically, it took me 2 years to conceive this baby and I will be 40 soon, two DDs with special needs....the writing is on the wall for me and its time to close the chapter.

[Adia]

I'm also supportive of people who choose not to have children. I have several family members who are happily childfree.

I, however, disagree with shaming women who may not be enjoying motherhood as much as they'd hoped. It's ok to talk about it and it doesn't make someone a bad mother anymore than having GD does.

I have tons of issues from childhood that I spent years working on and still don't always enjoy motherhood. I didn't expect to feel this way anymore than I expected to have GD.

pink_bean: I think their are going to be times in our life where we don't enjoy a lot of things, motherhood being a biggie as it takes over our existence for years and life if never the same once you have a child.

DD1 was born when I was very young and she had signs of bipolar disorder since the day she was born, not joking. I was working full time to put my exDH through college and way too young to be married and have a kid, but I was playing along with all the religious pressure I was raised with.

I was miserable. I always did the best I could do in the moment with DD1 but raising her until she got treatment was a sheer horror story, and not much fun since she has been treated. I hated being a mother and totally relate to those who aren't "thrilled" with motherhood. Its hard, thankless, work and some days feel like their is no end in sight.

It got better with DD2 but she has issues too and I didn't really enjoy it until I had DD3, but by then I had learned to cope with a lot of the stuff I had been thrown with the first two.

After almost 16 years of my DD1 nightmare, i can say it gets better. I think a lot of it is we learn to ignore and cope with the challenging stuff. I think time gives us the perspective that they will grow up and eventually move away.

I hope you don't feel ashamed for not enjoying motherhood at times. At times I don't really enjoy marriage, working, dealing with special needs kids, etc. I think that all goes along with the journey of life.

[atomic sagebrush]

the interesting thing is I can look back on times when I was really very unhappy and remember a lot of good in it that I didn't necessarily notice at the time. It's like I remember mainly the good things and the bad goes away. Kind of like giving birth!

[XXforhubby]

the interesting thing is I can look back on times when I was really very unhappy and remember a lot of good in it that I didn't necessarily notice at the time. It's like I remember mainly the good things and the bad goes away. Kind of like giving birth!

I can totally relate. I believe I had PPD or severe baby blues with DS1. It wasn't until he was 6 months old that I felt like a fog had lifted in my brain, and I began to feel more like myself. At the time, I felt awful for feeling that way but it was like a train wreck- I could see it happening but couldn't do anything to stop it. Now looking back on that time period, which was four years ago I see so many happy times. I think I was so busy just trying to cope/survive that I missed them, though I remember them clearly now. Thank goodness too, because I have WAY more happy memories than bad from back then!


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[atomic sagebrush]

:agree: With my 3rd son ( he was the one I had the bad GD with and he was also a super difficult baby/toddler/preschooler/child LOL) I rem. he was little and I just wasn't enjoying it really, and we had this photo screen saver where we had all our pictures, and I'd look at the pictures go by and think "oh he's so adorable, I love him so much" and then wonder why I never felt like that when I was dealing with the actual baby himself LOL. I think it was the same type of thing - when I was in it, I just had so much going on in my head that the good got sublimated or something, beneath stress and work and mourning the daughter that I thought I was "supposed" to have. It was THERE all along, but just that I didn't notice when I was in it, and it was only by focusing on those little moments in the pictures that I could experience the positive emotions.

[Dana-Alicia]

I just love reading this thread, everyone is so honest and the feeling are so raw. And this helps me knowing I'm not alone! We just bought a new house and for the past weekend, DH and I went there alone to get the house ready for us to move in a few weeks. So for the next few weekends I will also be alone with hubby. I was so looking forward to it, being able to work and get stuff done without my little gang. But on the first day I already started whining at DH: I want to call my mom, see how the boys are! And during the second day it turned into crying: let's go see the boys, maybe they can help us out here (they're 6 and 3, LOL they would make everything so much worse) and by day 3 I couldn't wait to go home. My dad picked us up at the train station and when I saw them in the car i ran to them and saw them cheering and pounding on the windows when they saw us. Sooo happy to see eachother again!

Can you imagine? Me, who was so looking forward to some quiet time, some alone time with DH, being able to get stuff done. And all I could think was my kids. Sometimes my mind hops around and from missing them, I got to thinking about moms in wars and then I got to Sophie's choice and I cried. Gosh, so happy to have my kids. And also so happy to drop them off at school! It's never easy and I need to find happiness in the smallest things. I don't find fulfilment or gratitude in dressing them, wiping their bums or cleaning up after them, but when they pick me flowers from the yard or sing me a song, I just feel so happy and thankful. It's those little moments I hold onto. I want them to grow up quickly, to leave all these troubles of raising them behind me, but at the same time I want time to stand still, so I can enjoy them being young. I miss the babies they were, the chubby cheeks and the nursing, the sleeping in my arms and the endless cuddles. So I need to look for beauty in the life I'm living here and now. As raising kids is tough, very ridiculously (you messed up there mother nature, at times it's too hard! ) tough! And I'm so going to get back at them when they're teenagers, I kid you not :cool:

[XXforhubby]

And I'm so going to get back at them when they're teenagers, I kid you not :cool:

Hehe, me too! I say this often under my breath, lol! I teach high school science so I'll know how to even the score, mawhaha [emoji41]!


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[Dana-Alicia]

Haha! I was thinking about when they're teens and have been clubbing, and afterwards they lie in bed stinking of booz and cigarettes, I would come in with pots and pans slamming them together and singing a happy waaaaake up song. I'm sure they'll love that and will enjoy it just as much as I do now when they wake me up :giggle: