Deleted

[pink_bean]

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[familymatters]

I think you're over-analyzing here. People often on this site will say they feel blessed to receive their DG. It's definitely not meant in a way superior way or to hurt other members struggling with GD. What are they meant to say that wouldn't affect you? Don't fixate on word blessed or lucky. IMO they are perfectly valid emotions to feel when you find out your expecting your DG. Doesn't mean you personally shouldn't feel blessed or lucky to have your current children. I think it would be a shame if the ladies on here had to start feeling as though they needed to monitor what they expressed on here. I think 99.9% of the time everyone is very respectful.

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[familymatters]

Sorry pink_bean i didn't mean to invalidate you, it's just that many members on here use those turn of phrases to describe their happiness. I wrongly assumed you were including them in your vent. Although I can't relate to your sentiments, I'm sure another member will so don't stop posting etc just because I don't agree. Not trying to diminish your GD in the slightest, just wanted you to try and see that people aren't trying to be superior when they say they feel blessed or lucky.

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[familymatters]

Since I know feel I need to clarify, I'm coming from a point of view of where people who get a girl after a boy get called or call themselves "lucky" or "blessed" whereas many of us where offered condolenses or told better luck next time, when announcing another child if the same gender. It's hurtful, yes. Is it meant to be? Maybe not. But expressing how it's painful to me is therapeutic. I was not referring to people on this board who have also suffered GD getting their GD in the end. Just noting a double standard.
OK well that's a fair bit different to what you originally posted. And yes I know exactly what you mean because the same people said that to me when I had Ds - how lucky, clever etc I was to have a pigeon pair. As if I had had another DD it wouldn't have been as wonderful. So yes I do understand that that is hurtful.

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[familymatters]

Maybe more detailed but not different.
Yes some of those details though painted a very different picture (to me)

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[familymatters]

Im sorry, I didn't mean to make you feel unsupported. It's tough having to deal with the many millions of idiots that walk around out there saying insensitive things. I can include myself in those idiots today as I've upset you. Sorry hun xx

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[Hopefully Pink]

Pink-bean, I completely understand how you feel. This forum is a place free of those judgements but out in the real world I feel like my 2 boys are viewed as the least desirable kiddo combo by random strangers and even friends. When I was pregnant with my 2nd son people would ask if I was having a girl, when I said no the response was always "too bad..." Followed by "well at least you won't have to buy new clothes" or "at least you won't have to deal with those horrible teen years" etc. It was always pity and I never shared my GD so this was never invited. I have 12 Mom's in my play group and I am the only one without a daughter and I am the only one who gets asked if I will try for a 3rd to get a girl. The assumption being, if you have a pp then why would you want a 3rd. It is hard, especially since I really try to push my GD out of mind on a daily basis but somedays the comment of a stranger will catch me off guard. I love my boys like crazy and I often think that if others reflected a more positive view of an all boy family that I might have an easier time dealing with my GD. Hope you have a better day tomorrow...I had a rough one today too.


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[Complex Emotions]

Does anyone else feel offended, hurt or slighted when people call themselves blessed to have their DG and/ or especially a pp? Or "lucky". It implies the rest of us were not in God's favor (or whoever they believe to be doing the "blessing") I'm not trying to start a religious debate but I know so many of us feel we were "undeserving" of our DG or we blame ourselves when really it's biology not "karma." I know that saying one is blessed is meant as expressing gratitude but when it comes to getting the gender you want it just smacks of a superiority complex. It's just which sperm won the race. Of course, it could be the GD talking but I too feel blessed to have my sons. Just a rant.

Yes, I feel you on this pink_bean.

I don't like "blessed" or "luck" because they imply one version of events is better than another. I'm more comfortable thinking that everyone's life is somehow "even" or "equal". Like maybe all the suffering someone does is balanced by their resulting depth of awareness or some kind of an intense beauty they'll find through their sorrow. I myself was deeply depressed and alone for many years, but in some ways those years are very special to me and have added a richness to the way I now experience life.

We both long for a daughter, but in the long run there is joy and fulfillment in parenting our son(s). Who is to say that having a daughter is more of a blessing than another son? I mean, just because you want something that doesn't make it better. We truly don't have a way to know which would bring our lives the most joy.

I suspect humans have a biological imperative to experience raising a child of both genders. Some people feel it way way more than others. Most pregnant women with two or more kids would probably prefer to get the gender they don't already have. All this seems logical, so I try not to be offended if someone says something like "I bet you're hoping for a girl". Wanting a girl after a boy is a natural desire that most people understand... still, for whatever reason, I'm personally not comfortable admitting that they're right.

I wish you all the best pink_bean :luck:

[Complex Emotions]

...out in the real world I feel like my 2 boys are viewed as the least desirable kiddo combo by random strangers and even friends...

I'm so afraid of this specific perception.

I wonder though, if almost all moms sometimes feel like their family is "the least desirable" in one way or another. There are SO many ways to not be the "gold standard ideal". For example, a lot of parents may be self-conscious if their children/family are:

- low-income
- unattractive
- adopted
- step-children
- have a disability or mental health issue
- single parent
- single child (or "too many" children)
- too wide of an age gap between kids
- the parents had the kids "too young" or "too old"
- multiples like twins or triplets

Gender is just one of so many ways your family could seem less than ideal. I could almost guarantee you that every other mom in your play group probably feels like their family is "less than" for one reason or another.

Also, two boy families are a HUGE percentage of the families out there. It seems like at least 25% of all families with two or more kids are all boy. So, even if this were to be the "least desirable combination" in contemporary society's eyes, at least everyone who has an all boy family is in good company! It's certainly not a rare thing.

I'm sorry if this comes of as glib. I've actually felt a lot of stress over the exact issue you wrote about and my heart is trying to think all this through in preparation for whatever is to come.

[Hopefully Pink]

I'm so afraid of this specific perception. I'm preparing to conceive our second child with a husband who comes from a family that has a long run of all boy births.

I wonder though, if almost all moms sometimes feel like their family is "the least desirable" in one way or another. There are SO many ways to not be the "gold standard ideal". For example, a lot of parents may be self-conscious if their children/family are:

- low-income
- unattractive
- adopted
- step-children
- have a disability or mental health issue
- single parent
- single child (or "too many" children)
- too wide of an age gap between kids
- the parents had the kids "too young" or "too old"
- multiples like twins or triplets

Gender is just one of so many ways your family could seem less than ideal. I could almost guarantee you that every other mom in your play group probably feels like their family is "less than" for one reason or another.

Also, two boy families are a HUGE percentage of the families out there. It seems like at least 25% of all families with two or more kids are all boy. So, even if this were to be the "least desirable combination" in contemporary society's eyes, at least everyone who has an all boy family is in good company! It's certainly not a rare thing.

I'm sorry if this comes of as glib. I've actually felt a lot of stress over the exact issue you wrote about and my heart is trying to think all this through in preparation for whatever is to come.

Hi Complex Emotions, how exciting for you to be extending your family. I hope that your experience is positive regardless of whether you have a boy or a girl. I can only speak from my experience and I have and still encounter people who make very unfortunate comments. Everyone's experience is unique, and before being pregnant with my 2nd son I would never have believed someone could have offered condolences after asking me what I was having. It was very difficult when I was pregnant but I have developed a thick skin at this point.


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[Complex Emotions]

Yes, pink_bean, your family is a perfect blessing, just as is :heart:

I have a memory that relates, from nearly ten years ago. My boss and his wife were expecting their second baby. He'd just come back from the twenty week ultrasound and happily announced they were expecting another girl. I'm pretty sure I said something to the effect of "Are you going to try again for a son?" I didn't mean to be rude. I'm sort of socially awkward and I guess I thought I was funny. I had no sense of how deep that question could cut. He brushed it off, but I did feel the vibe that what I'd said was cruel. I regret that moment so much now.

A lot of people probably say these things without any sense of how terrible they are. Now that I have a true understanding of GD pain I will never ever say anything like that to anyone ever again.

[trifecta]

I think one of the reasons some of these phrases rankle so much is that caring for a child is a huge undertaking and when someone brushes it off just because they think you didn't get the chromosomes right it really feels like they are dismissing your child as person as well as dismissing all the effort you are putting in to raising them.

My boys are valuable independently of whether or not I would have liked to experienced having a daughter. I might not have had GD had I had a pigeon pair but I want people to recognize that my boys are equally valuable, not something that requires a do-over.

My kids are PEOPLE in their own right, not just experiences for me!

That said, I think you should let yourself off the hook for what you said to your boss, Complex Emotions. We've all put our foot in our mouths at one point or other, you learned from your experience, and if you didn't have kids at the time he probably didn't take it too much to heart.

[MummyBee]

I relate to this too. I have heard boy moms called unlucky and worse. I understand people are elated when they get their dream gender (maybe I don't understand as that will never happen to me) but I do wish they would show a bit of sensitivity in a place where people feel strongly on the matter and many have their dreams dashed forever.

[Pink2016]

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[Beau82]

The luck thing doesn't bother me so much b/c it really is luck. The majority of people who have pigeon pairs did not sway so it just came down to luck for them. To me it's not lucky b/c I think a boy needs a brother. So a pigeon pair was never my ideal family but I know it is for some.

I agree that I wish people would be more sensitive in general. Strangers saying things don't bother me. They don't know me and I guess I've been lucky in that I haven't received too many bad comments (except for the all too common "Wow, 4 boys! I feel bad for you. Har har har").
But my SIL is currently pregnant with her first child, a girl. I've spoken with her at length about my desire for a girl, how I was upset when I found out DS4 was a boy, how I still longed for a girl and I even told her about this site. She still felt the need to send me a gender announcement video that she made (it was only sent to a few family members so not like it was posted to FB or anything). She then went on to say how she felt bad sending it to me and how she just couldn't stop crying when she found out. So she knew it was a touchy subject with me, she knew it might upset me and yet she did it anyway. It was just such a blow to me, not the fact that she's having a girl but how she acted as though her having a girl in particular was cause for celebration. All I could think was, is she that happy that she's having a girl, or that happy that she's not having a boy? I'm quite certain she would not have been in tears if they told her it was a boy. Which really irritates me as a boy mom. I really haven't spoken to her much since and I've heard through MIL that she thinks it's because I'm mad at her for having a girl when that has absolutely nothing to do with it.

But yes, comments like blessed bug me when it's referring to a family with one of each. Another one I despise is perfect. As in "oh you have a boy AND a girl, the perfect family!". Uh nope. I will let someone have it if they say something like that in my vicinity. My aunt, who is wonderful, tells anyone with children that they are blessed. Whether they have one girl or 6 boys. Her only comment is "gosh, you are so blessed to have beautiful children". I love that she has never once said to me "oh, another boy?".

[atomic sagebrush]

It's just that I have actually had strangers come up to me and ask me if I was trying for a girl and that they were lucky and blessed that they got their pp so they could be done. I guess I shouldn't take offense to that but I do! It belittles my family.

This is one thing that still bugs me. I never even wanted a PP at all and wanted a larger family anyway but it does still rub me the wrong way how practically every family I know IRL, who has had kids during the same time period I had my younger three, has boy-girl or girl boy just boom boom that easily. It is hard not to let that get to me when it took me 20 years, 4 boys, and years of exhaustive research to get one tiny girl that came to me when I was so old I'll be dead practically before she has a family of her own. :(

it is like going to dinner and everyone has steak and a baked potato and all you get is a baked potato. It could be the tastiest one in the world but it's like "where's my steak, dude".

That having been said, at the same time comparison is the thief of joy and you undoubtedly have many other blessings in your life, things you feel happy about (such as not having a big mouth going up to strangers in stores to discuss their family makeup haha!! seriously what is wrong with people). I think that some people, and I find this at least in the United States to be partially cultural, use the word blessing in a different way than you may (and i think this is what familymatters was trying to explain) as in, it's a good thing that happened to them. I'm sure you feel fortunate to have your children but that doens't mean that you feel that you are more blessed or deserving than a woman who is infertile, yk??? It is possible to cultivate an attitude of feeling grateful and yes, even blessed, for what you do have without intending to mean it as a rebuke against another person who doesn't have as much. It is an attitude that many cultures/religions strive to develop and I think that when people say that, they are trying at least in part to express to the satisfaction of their own higher power or belief system, that they are grateful for having a PP. Now, unfortunately they are doing that at your expense and it is hurtful, but I don't think they intend it to be hurtful, any more than us being grateful for our sons is meant to take away from a woman who can't have children, yk???

[atomic sagebrush]

I'm so afraid of this specific perception. I'm preparing to conceive our second child with a husband who comes from a family that has a long run of all boy births.

I wonder though, if almost all moms sometimes feel like their family is "the least desirable" in one way or another. There are SO many ways to not be the "gold standard ideal". For example, a lot of parents may be self-conscious if their children/family are:

- low-income
- unattractive
- adopted
- step-children
- have a disability or mental health issue
- single parent
- single child (or "too many" children)
- too wide of an age gap between kids
- the parents had the kids "too young" or "too old"
- multiples like twins or triplets

Gender is just one of so many ways your family could seem less than ideal. I could almost guarantee you that every other mom in your play group probably feels like their family is "less than" for one reason or another.

Also, two boy families are a HUGE percentage of the families out there. It seems like at least 25% of all families with two or more kids are all boy. So, even if this were to be the "least desirable combination" in contemporary society's eyes, at least everyone who has an all boy family is in good company! It's certainly not a rare thing.

I'm sorry if this comes of as glib. I've actually felt a lot of stress over the exact issue you wrote about and my heart is trying to think all this through in preparation for whatever is to come.

:bowdown: YES!!!! Part of life is that you gradually start to realize that EVERYONE has something going on in their lives that is totally less than ideal, that they have a chip on their shoulder about, and that everyone is sitting in judgement on (even us sometimes.) Even the people who seem to have it all, either there's a skeleton in the closet that no one knows about, or eventually some bolt comes from the blue that strikes them. To quote Watchmen "It rains on the just and the unjust alike". Every single one of us is just livin our lives and the Julia Robertses of the world who go on national televison and gloat about how much they love their lives (insert retching sound here) even they have a problem, becuase everyone hates them LOL.

There are people in the world, lots of them, who have really super sad lives. They are in chronic pain or have no one to love, they lost children or had to go to Vietnam when they were 18 or had the Black Plague. Honestly, every one of us really IS blessed just to live in the 21st century, I think we sometimes lose sight of this (because comparison is the thief of joy) and that's all people are really saying when they say the "b" word - they're just trying to say, "hey God/universe, thanks for what I got, I acknowledge not everyone has this one thing". :)

[atomic sagebrush]

I completely understand the concept. Really this was just a vent and I know it's not an intentional slight (always). But there are times when I just want to express my frustrations even if it sounds like/ means I'm overthinking it.

It's not a rebuke, I'm commisserating!! It still bugs me too!! for reals!!

[atomic sagebrush]

Hi Complex Emotions, how exciting for you to be extending your family. I hope that your experience is positive regardless of whether you have a boy or a girl. I can only speak from my experience and I have and still encounter people who make very unfortunate comments. Everyone's experience is unique, and before being pregnant with my 2nd son I would never have believed someone could have offered condolences after asking me what I was having. It was very difficult when I was pregnant but I have developed a thick skin at this point.


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I had 2 boys for 13 years and no one ever said anything about it. I really think we are living in strange times where everyone has been sold some bill of goods that if you don't ahve a PP (and can then buy all that precious, precious merchandise like good little consumer drones we are LOL) then you're missing out on something. But you aren't. I'm happy to have my daughter but it's very little difference from raising my boys. she never wears all those pretty dresses and bows I bought her, and runs and screams and farts and burps and poops and makes messes just like the boys did. :)

[atomic sagebrush]

Well, we're just trying to help. I'm sorry if we aren't saying the right things, all we can do is mention what worked for us. I don't think anyone is trying to make you feel bad or pick a fight. Just sharing our own thought processes and experiences which are obviously not helping. I'll sign off now. Wishing you peace.

[Hopefully Pink]

No, you guys are helping! I just didn't want anyone to think I'm just whining lol which I guess I kinda am.

I think it's all about where you are currently in the GD process. I honestly could have posted the same thing you did on the same day. Some days are harder than others and I just start to feel sad and I feel very alone with my feelings and frustrations. So I appreciate your post, as it helped me not feel so alone.


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