Swaying after miscarriage

[atomic sagebrush]

Should I ask my Dr about taking aspirin? The stats on your data sheet are pretty good!

Also, what about olive leaf extract for dh?

No. 65% is LOWER than the overall success rates of the site and we had a statistician analyse the results and found that aspirin was not working - same number of people getting girls with and without it. 65% means something is just piggybacking on the overall success rate of the site.

The "80%" success for cranberry and aspirin I believe to be a fluke caused by small sample size. One sway going the other way would put that right down to the overall success of the site. It is very dangerous to take cran and aspirin together and I have never recommended that.

Plus, aspirin may actually CAUSE miscarriages for many people, possibly many more than it helps prevent. https://www.dailymail.co.uk/health/a...scarriage.html

OLE for DH is fine, provided he's not taking cranberry. It is cranberry OR OLE, not both.

[ABC.2606]

I'm so sorry to hear about your miscarriage, RaisingGentlemen3. It's such an awful thing to go through and I feel your pain

I had 3 m/cs between Aug 2017 & March 2018. The first two were very early @ 5 weeks and thus happened naturally but the 3rd was very similar to yours - I went in at 7 weeks and the sac measured 5w4days - no HB or fetal pole. Went back a week later and confirmed that the pregnancy was gone. Had a D&C because I had NO bleeding or signs that my body had "figured it out" that the baby was gone. I had been on LE for 1 year at the point but had been off of it (like, really off of it!) for 6 weeks during that 3rd pregnancy/miscarriage so I was in that same dilemma that you are in terms of do we try again quickly or do I wait so I can be back on the diet longer. In my case, I got my AF 3.5 weeks after the D&C but as far as I know didn't ovulate before that AF came. After that AF came we waited it out one full cycle and then tried again the next cycle (and I got pregnant), so I was back on the diet for 8 weeks prior to ovulation. Because I had had 3 m/cs in a row, during those 8 weeks I went through a bunch of fertility testing trying to see if there was a clear cause for my losses - there wasn't. Anyways, so when I ovulated 8 weeks after the D&C, we conceived & we got twins!! Boy & girl - I'm currently 24 weeks. But, I was also on Clomid and I'm about to turn 35 so those were likely the main reasons for conceiving twins I have read loss might increase the risk of twins but if atomic doesn't see any clear evidence I would trust her on that!

A couple of things to respond to your questions... Like atomic said, I would not talk to your doctor about your swaying. You really aren't doing anything in terms of swaying that would increase the risk. I know there is some stuff out there about caffeine and m/c risks - but I'm not sure how proven it is. I switched to decaf/ half-caff after my 1st loss though so you could try that. But I know it's natural to worry and feel like the things you are doing are maybe the cause of the loss - I felt that and went through A LOT of guilt during all those losses. But after having gone through 3 losses in a row and then ending up with two seemingly very healthy twins on the 4th time around, I've really come to believe (as many others on here with losses will tell you as well), that it really usually is just bad luck! A bad sperm, a bad egg, or just things not going quite "right" at conception and there's really nothing you can do. And having a loss (or 3 in my case!) absolutely does not mean you wont get a perfectly healthy babe the next time around, even if you change nothing at all about your diet or lifestyle! Lots of ladies on here are proof of that!! I still tell my doctor how odd I feel like it is that we had loss after loss and then suddenly ended up with healthy twins. Also - I did tell my fertility specialist that I had lost a lot of weight (50 lbs) over the year prior to that 3rd miscarriage and that I had been on a "lower calorie diet" but didn't tell her why. I asked her if she thought that would have had anything to do with my losses and she said absolutely not. So hopefully that's a little reassurance for you as well!

RE aspirin... I know atomic is very opposed to it both b/c it doesn't really help swaying & b/c there may be risks with it. But to be transparent with my own experience, I did take it before conceiving this time and have taken it every day this pregnancy. In my case, my OB started recommending it after my first loss. I ignored him, ignored him when he pushed it again after my 2nd loss, and then after my 3rd I decided to listen to him because I had guilt after that 3rd loss that maybe, just maybe, if I had taken it, I wouldn't have lost that third pregnancy. For me I was at the point where I felt I had to try something and that I needed to listen to what my doctor was telling me to do. I have no idea if it has had any effect in my being able to keep these babies this time or not but just to put that out there. I know it's controversial and I'm not trying to contradict atomic at all b/c she's the expert and has done the research. But, I don't regret taking it this time - it's possible I'm just one of those women that it does for whatever reason help.

I also took CoQ10 for several weeks before getting pregnant this time - I know that it is also not "proven" in terms of improving egg quality, but it is safe to take, sway-neutral and a lot of women going through fertility issues do use it. Ubiquinol is the best form if you take it.

Good luck - I know it's frustrating and painful. I hope you have a beautiful rainbow baby (preferably little girl!) coming soon!! Don't give up hope! I almost did after the 3rd and I'm very glad I didn't

[RaisingGentlemen3]

Atomic I was looking at the stats again a saw raspberry/peppermint tea us 115%?! So does that mean those women drank both raspberry and peppermint tea during their sway? Is it raspberry leaf tea that's referred to in this case? I am considering adding this in as it has such high stats but I don't fully understand how they help? I was looking into rlt and it raises estrogen but possibly lowers pH? Sorry all the questions. I might have drank too much coffee! Haha

[RaisingGentlemen3]

ABC thank you so much for the information and encouragement! I am so sorry you went through so much with 3 mc in a row! I hope this doesn't happen to me but yes does make me feel better at what your fertility doc said about the diet and all. I really don't understand how aspirin can help sway girl or help with a pregnancy but it is nice to know it might have worked for you.
Also, congrats on twins! I kind of want twins but Idk how I would handle it with 3 boys and homeschool too. I am so happy they are healthy and things are going well for you! Did you notice any difference in pregnancy symptoms before you found out they were twins?

[atomic sagebrush]

Atomic I was looking at the stats again a saw raspberry/peppermint tea us 115%?! So does that mean those women drank both raspberry and peppermint tea during their sway? Is it raspberry leaf tea that's referred to in this case? I am considering adding this in as it has such high stats but I don't fully understand how they help? I was looking into rlt and it raises estrogen but possibly lowers pH? Sorry all the questions. I might have drank too much coffee! Haha

That is an error that I would like to see removed from the stats. Something cannot sway more than 100% obviously, and it's some sort of error in the spreadsheet. IT makes no sense for pep tea to be in the overall success of the site, then for something called raspberry/peppermint when I have NEVER EVER recommended rasperry tea (as I believe it sways blue). I have had a very small handful of women use it when they'd gone on a really long time not getting pregnant and it was much more of a "Dumbo's feather" that I gave them to make them think they were changing something rather than out of me believing it was really going to help them, to be honest. So long story short, that has to be a mistake, doesn't make any sense at all as no one has ever recommened RRLT for girls, and peppermint tea has indicated itself to do nothing, so I'd not bother with either of them.

I don't do the stats as it's unethical for me to do so, thus I have to rely on unpaid volunteers and so there are severeal things in the stats that are not as I would have them. I have an essay on why not to read too much into the stats here: https://www.genderdreaming.com/forum...hts-stats.html

[RaisingGentlemen3]

Hey atomic! Just got home from the Dr and all checked out GREAT! she confirmed nothing I did caused the mc but did suggest at least 1400 calories since we will be ttc. She also encouraged me to go ahead and try again this cycle! She said she's noticed if a woman gets pregnant right after a mc (1st o or 2nd o) she's more likely to have a healthy pregnancy than miscarry again. So she was really thinking it should be a healthy sticky bean next time! Also gave me the clear for rephresh as well. She didn't do any labs or urine pregnancy tests bc the US showed no retained tissue. So she said I will O when I O and hopefully she will see me back soon! I went a head and took a Wal-Mart $1 pregnancy test to see if it was still positive and it was very very faint! Here's the pic20181016_140858.jpg

[ABC.2606]

ABC thank you so much for the information and encouragement! I am so sorry you went through so much with 3 mc in a row! I hope this doesn't happen to me but yes does make me feel better at what your fertility doc said about the diet and all. I really don't understand how aspirin can help sway girl or help with a pregnancy but it is nice to know it might have worked for you.
Also, congrats on twins! I kind of want twins but Idk how I would handle it with 3 boys and homeschool too. I am so happy they are healthy and things are going well for you! Did you notice any difference in pregnancy symptoms before you found out they were twins?

Nope - not any difference in symptoms early on As the 1st tri went on, I was a lot more tired than I was in my first two pregnancies (but I also have two small boys to take care of now!) and now in the 2nd trimester I'm WAY bigger than I was at this point with my first two pregnancies and I have more back pain!!!

[atomic sagebrush]

Great news!! Thanks so much for updating us!

Yep nearly there - do be aware we've had a few people ovulate VERY fast after having a preg test that light. Like within a few days even! So while it isn't super common, it is possible, just keep your eyes peeled for any signs that O is approaching.

[atomic sagebrush]

ABC thank you so much for the information and encouragement! I am so sorry you went through so much with 3 mc in a row! I hope this doesn't happen to me but yes does make me feel better at what your fertility doc said about the diet and all. I really don't understand how aspirin can help sway girl or help with a pregnancy but it is nice to know it might have worked for you.
Also, congrats on twins! I kind of want twins but Idk how I would handle it with 3 boys and homeschool too. I am so happy they are healthy and things are going well for you! Did you notice any difference in pregnancy symptoms before you found out they were twins?

Aspirin was said to sway pink due to lower pH but teh science of pH is very very sketchy and when we tracked our results, the aspirin didn't help, same number of people got girls with and without it.

The reason why aspirin was thought to possibly help with losses was because it's a blood thinner, and one theory of loss is that some of them are caused by blood being too "clotty" (which for some people is 100% proven, some women do have blood that clots too easily and that may prevent a fertilized egg from being able to implant.)

BUT. And this is a BIG BUT!

For those of us (the majority) who do not have issues with our blood clotting too easily (and some of us like me who actually seem to have overly thin blood and have issues with bleeding and bruising) adding aspirin into the mix can actually be a total disaster and likely cause miscarriage because for a baby to implant, it's not only necessary for the blood to not be too thick, but also not to be too THIN. You don't want there to be bleeding that starts and can't stop, and additionally it is proven that there is some need for inflammation both in the ovaries for ovulation to happen correctly, and in other parts of our body for pregnancy to occur. We don't WANT to be loading up on blood thinners or anti-inflammatories (aspirin is both) at a point in time where we need our bodies to be able to accurately control the clotting ability of our blood and undergoing various processes that require swelling/inflammation to happen properly. Not to mention that aspirin may harm or even kill YOU yourself by thinning your blood excessively.

In ABC's situation, she had had 3 losses and she wanted to try the aspirin despite not having a proven clotting disorder, and that was fine for her to do that. Maybe it helped her; after all the stuff we don't know about conception is huge and the stuff we do know is minor - she may have had a clotting disorder we don't know how to test for yet. But that doesn't mean that everyone should now extrapolate that to themselves. We have not only our experiences here (I've seen WAY more people for whom aspirin seemed to cause harm than for those who did not have a diagnosed blood clotting disorder and yet were still helped by it) but also studies that seem to indicate for people who don't need it, it's worse than nothing. https://www.theguardian.com/science/...icineandhealth https://www.verywellfamily.com/truth...rriage-2371758

Most losses are chromosomal and have nothing to do with clotting anyway. So I just really want you guys to proceed with great caution and not add in aspirin out of an assumption that it will prevent another miscarraige. You very well may end up MORE likely to have another miscarriage, not less.

And above all else, anyone who uses aspirin, please wean onto it and wean off of it to give your body time to adjust its clotting factors accordingly. You don't want to go from having your blood be super thin from taking aspirin (during which point your body will make massive amounts of clotting factors to compensate) to super thick by stopping the aspirin suddenly (your body will continue making larger amounts of clotting factors for some time after stopping aspirin) And this is especially true when pregnant, as not only does your blood clot more easily, but you have a placenta and umbilical cord involved both of which can be very negatively affected by blood clots.

[ABC.2606]

Aspirin was said to sway pink due to lower pH but teh science of pH is very very sketchy and when we tracked our results, the aspirin didn't help, same number of people got girls with and without it.

The reason why aspirin was thought to possibly help with losses was because it's a blood thinner, and one theory of loss is that some of them are caused by blood being too "clotty" (which for some people is 100% proven, some women do have blood that clots too easily and that may prevent a fertilized egg from being able to implant.)

BUT. And this is a BIG BUT!

For those of us (the majority) who do not have issues with our blood clotting too easily (and some of us like me who actually seem to have overly thin blood and have issues with bleeding and bruising) adding aspirin into the mix can actually be a total disaster and likely cause miscarriage because for a baby to implant, it's not only necessary for the blood to not be too thick, but also not to be too THIN. You don't want there to be bleeding that starts and can't stop, and additionally it is proven that there is some need for inflammation both in the ovaries for ovulation to happen correctly, and in other parts of our body for pregnancy to occur. We don't WANT to be loading up on blood thinners or anti-inflammatories (aspirin is both) at a point in time where we need our bodies to be able to accurately control the clotting ability of our blood and undergoing various processes that require swelling/inflammation to happen properly. Not to mention that aspirin may harm or even kill YOU yourself by thinning your blood excessively.

In ABC's situation, she had had 3 losses and she wanted to try the aspirin despite not having a proven clotting disorder, and that was fine for her to do that. Maybe it helped her; after all the stuff we don't know about conception is huge and the stuff we do know is minor - she may have had a clotting disorder we don't know how to test for yet. But that doesn't mean that everyone should now extrapolate that to themselves. We have not only our experiences here (I've seen WAY more people for whom aspirin seemed to cause harm than for those who did not have a diagnosed blood clotting disorder and yet were still helped by it) but also studies that seem to indicate for people who don't need it, it's worse than nothing. https://www.theguardian.com/science/...icineandhealth https://www.verywellfamily.com/truth...rriage-2371758

Most losses are chromosomal and have nothing to do with clotting anyway. So I just really want you guys to proceed with great caution and not add in aspirin out of an assumption that it will prevent another miscarraige. You very well may end up MORE likely to have another miscarriage, not less.

Atomic I should have also mentioned that I have some underlying autoimmune issues so maybe it’s possible that the anti inflammatory aspect of aspirin has helped me - who knows. I read an article months ago about a study where it seemed to help women with repeated miscarriages who had underlying inflammation. My Obgyn felt strongly about it because he said over his long career he’s seen women with repeated miscarriages use it with success even if he doesn’t understand fully why it helps. My fertility specialist doesn’t believe in it though. But again after 3 unexplained miscarriages I just no longer felt comfortable ignoring his advice. But - it’s clearly one of those very controversial things still that even doctors can’t agree on!


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